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Dany's Landing


#Turncloak

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I think her and Aegon are gonna duke it out. Kind of wish I could sell arms to both sides.

I agree that her endgame is more magical than political. I think she might defeat fAegon in DoD 2.0, then make for the Wall. After a big battle, she'll depart to find her own home.

OldGimletEye: I doubt Daenerys would need arms that much, given she has a dragon and all :D

BearQueen87: Call me an eternal pessimist, but I always thought Daenerys (and Jon too, by the way) will die in the end. Daenerys especially, will die as a messiah figure, imo. Since the ending will be "bittersweet" (though this is GRRM so I'm leaning more towards bitter than sweet) I don't imagine many of the main heroes of the War for the Dawn will survive.

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I think that Dany's landing spot is referred to in one of Quaithe's warnings. Which goes like this:



To go north, you must journey south, to reach the west you must go east. To go forward you must go back and to touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow



I'll break it down by what I thinks it means.



North = The Wall eventually



South = The direction she must begin to travel once she finally decides to head for Westeros, because I believe she will decide this while in the Dothraki Sea once she retakes the Dothraki horde from Khal Jhaqo.



West = Westeros



East = Head East through the Summer sea and the Jade sea towards the Sunset Sea riding on the Iron Fleet and its captured ships with Victarian as her new admiral.



Forward = Means to move toward her goal of taking the Iron Throne.



Go Back = Means return to Mereen where her army will be fighting off the Yunkish troops and her new Khalasar will help finish them off.



The Light = Lonely Light, the Iron Island that is farthest out into the Sunset Sea. With Victarion leading the Iron fleet this should be a familiar place to first land in Westeros after traveling across the Sunset Sea



The Shadow = To follow this course they must sail through the Jade Gates which are south (beneath) of Asshai (The Shadow)




If Victarion is leading them I think this is an obvious path seeing how Victarion feels out shined by Euron Crow's-Eye. So to try to one up Euron (who is said to have crossed the Smoking sea), Victarion will try to cross the Sunset Sea.


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iam going to say that she is going to land in Vale ...i wonder why no one has mentioned Vale till now

there is pretty big Foreshadowing that Daenarys will be in Vale and crush those armies

Actually, I mentioned the Saltpans. And at least one other person mentioned the Vale.

And as far as her "crushing" the armies in the Vale, I don't know about that.

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Actually, I mentioned the Saltpans. And at least one other person mentioned the Vale.

And as far as her "crushing" the armies in the Vale, I don't know about that.

i should correct myself its not that much mentioned

Sansa from FFC thinks that Armies that are gathering near the bloody gate looks like ants from the eyrie and if she can she could crush them with her feet

Danny in her last chapter in ADWD wakes to find that ants are over her and she crushes them ...and looking at the hedges near the wall she thinks of Hedge knights and if we consider that LF has number of Hedge knights and he himself comes from an hedge knight ancestary

and not to forget that there are only two Armies that are untouched by war so far Vale and Dorne ...if (f)Aegan gets Dorne and its only fair that Danny gets Vale ...and there are also lots of mentions about how Eyrie is impregnable and it was dragon who bought them down

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i should correct myself its not that much mentioned

Sansa from FFC thinks that Armies that are gathering near the bloody gate looks like ants from the eyrie and if she can she could crush them with her feet

Danny in her last chapter in ADWD wakes to find that ants are over her and she crushes them ...and looking at the hedges near the wall she thinks of Hedge knights and if we consider that LF has number of Hedge knights and he himself comes from an hedge knight ancestary

and not to forget that there are only two Armies that are untouched by war so far Vale and Dorne ...if (f)Aegan gets Dorne and its only fair that Danny gets Vale ...and there are also lots of mentions about how Eyrie is impregnable and it was dragon who bought them down

This all fine. But, I am little leery these kind of literary "fore shadowings". I look more at the strategic situation. The Vale is not a particularly great place to launch offensive operations, particularly during the winter. And many of Dany's troops are probably not well suited to fighting in the mountains during the winter.

Now, it might make a big difference if Dany can persuade the Mountain Clans to her side. Or maybe, she might even persuade Vale to join her through diplomacy, although I doubt this because the Arryns have no reason to trust a Targ.

Also, the Eyrie is tactically and strategically irrelevant. It can't be occupied in the Winter.

And as far as "fairness" goes, what has that got to do with anything? It is fair that Dany will have Dragons when nobody else does?

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This all fine. But, I am little leery these kind of literary "fore shadowings". I look more at the strategic situation. The Vale is not a particularly great place to launch offensive operations, particularly during the winter. And many of Dany's troops are probably not well suited to fighting in the mountains during the winter.

Now, it might make a big difference if Dany can persuade the Mountain Clans to her side. Or maybe, she might even persuade Vale to join her through diplomacy, although I doubt this because the Arryns have no reason to trust a Targ.

Also, the Eyrie is tactically and strategically irrelevant. It can't be occupied in the Winter.

And as far as "fairness" goes, what has that got to do with anything? It is fair that Dany will have Dragons when nobody else does?

i can agree with you in your view ..

if tyrion is with her he may convince those mountain clans ....

yes the Vale have no reason to trust but they can bend their knee to Danny and her dragons

look at it this way if dorne already sided with (f)aegon and by the time she reaches westeros it looks like (f)aegon would have captured KL ...so can she go to either of the place

but Vale would not have declared to any of them and will be having their own plans ..but if Dragons did arrive then they will bend their knees and follow ..it doesnt have to be a battle to take them ...and Vale has lots of food supplies as well for the winter ..so she will not have a problem with that ...at the time she reaches the Tyrells would have lost power or heavily defeated

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Dany isn't going north until ADoS, IMO. Tyrion would likely have her land in an area that has stayed neutral, and is still at full reserves. I think she would land at Dragonstone since it is her birthplace, her family's ancestral seat and commands the Blackwater Bay. I think Tyrion would advise her to land in the Vale. The Vale was untouched by the war, and is still at full reserves along with being a good base for launching an invasion. It's vulnerable from invasion by sea yet protected from counterattack from the rest of Westeros by the Mountains of the Moon and the Bloody Gate, with the mountains inhabited by the mountain clans whom Tyrion has good contacts with. Another main reason being that Tyrion is still itching to pay his debt to the Vale for Lysa's treatment of him.


East = Head East through the Summer sea and the Jade sea towards the Sunset Sea riding on the Iron Fleet and its captured ships with Victarian as her new admiral.

Forward = Means to move toward her goal of taking the Iron Throne.

Go Back = Means return to Mereen where her army will be fighting off the Yunkish troops and her new Khalasar will help finish them off.

The Light = Lonely Light, the Iron Island that is farthest out into the Sunset Sea. With Victarion leading the Iron fleet this should be a familiar place to first land in Westeros after traveling across the Sunset Sea

The Shadow = To follow this course they must sail through the Jade Gates which are south (beneath) of Asshai (The Shadow)

If Victarion is leading them I think this is an obvious path seeing how Victarion feels out shined by Euron Crow's-Eye. So to try to one up Euron (who is said to have crossed the Smoking sea), Victarion will try to cross the Sunset Sea.

Except GRRM explicitly said we would never go farther east than Qarth. Whay you describe is needlessly risky and dangerous when a shorter, safer and easier route west is before her. Going east would bring risks as they don't know the Sunset Sea, and thus wouldn't know where they would land and or where to stop for water and supplies.

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i can agree with you in your view ..

if tyrion is with her he may convince those mountain clans ....

yes the Vale have no reason to trust but they can bend their knee to Danny and her dragons

look at it this way if dorne already sided with (f)aegon and by the time she reaches westeros it looks like (f)aegon would have captured KL ...so can she go to either of the place

but Vale would not have declared to any of them and will be having their own plans ..but if Dragons did arrive then they will bend their knees and follow ..it doesnt have to be a battle to take them ...and Vale has lots of food supplies as well for the winter ..so she will not have a problem with that ...at the time she reaches the Tyrells would have lost power or heavily defeated

Perhaps if Dany very politely explains to the Arryns (or the Vale lords in general) that she understands what her father did and that she doesn't intend to repeat his errors and that she can help them, then perhaps she will convince them to join her.

But, if she goes in with an attitude of you're the "usuper dogs" and I am your rightful ruler, bend the knee before me, yada,yada,yada,then she might find herself with a serious fight on her hands. Meanwhile, I am sure Aegon, Dorne, & Co will enjoy watching Dany get involved in some brutal mountain campaign.

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Perhaps if Dany very politely explains to the Arryns that she understands what her father did and that she doesn't intend to repeat his errors and that she can help them, then perhaps she will convince them to join her.

But, if she goes in with an attitude of you're the "usuper dogs" and I am your rightful ruler, bend the knee before me, yada,yada,yada,then she might find herself with a serious fight on her hands. Meanwhile, I am sure Aegon, Dorne, & Co will enjoy watching Dany get involved in some brutal mountain campaign.

i think Danny has come a long way since then the time where she used to call "Usurper dogs"..she has now learnt that there was more to rebellion and her father was not a man she thought ..

but even if she does not go politely do you really think that Vale can give her hard time fight yes she may get that but i doubt it will be that hard for her to defeat them especially now due to the winter they dont have the protection of mountains and eyrie ....mountain clan will never fight for the Vale they are trying to take the vale for themselves ...

and not to forget there are lots of inner poltical issues that Vale faces with LF and other Lords

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i think Danny has come a long way since then the time where she used to call "Usurper dogs"..she has now learnt that there was more to rebellion and her father was not a man she thought ..

but even if she does not go politely do you really think that Vale can give her hard time fight yes she may get that but i doubt it will be that hard for her to defeat them especially now due to the winter they dont have the protection of mountains and eyrie ....mountain clan will never fight for the Vale they are trying to take the vale for themselves ...

and not to forget there are lots of inner poltical issues that Vale faces with LF and other Lords

Dany's troops will be more at a disadvantage. The Dothraki are mobile force. They wouldn't operate in mountains very well. Plus they are not used to cold weather fighting. The Unsullied operate in phalanx style formations, which are not really suited to fighting in the mountains.

The bottom line is that Dany's troops will be at a bigger disadvantage because of the weather and the terrain.

Now the wild card will be the Mountain Clans.Maybe Tyrion will be able to get them to join Dany through his old contacts. Or maybe the Mountain Clans simply won't give a shit.

Also, anybody with a half brain knows that when your fighting Dragons, don't base your defenses around castles. I am sure every noble boy knows the story about Harrenhal.

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Now the wild card will be the Mountain Clans.Maybe Tyrion will be able to get them to join Dany through his old contacts. Or maybe the Mountain Clans simply won't give a shit.

yup. With the Clans it could go either way, depending on the day, their mood, and what Tyrion offers. If he can promise them something truly grand, like actually hand the Vale over to them, they might join Dany's side.

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Dany's troops will be more at a disadvantage. The Dothraki are mobile force. They wouldn't operate in mountains very well. Plus they are not used to cold weather fighting. The Unsullied operate in phalanx style formations, which are not really suited to fighting in the mountains.

The bottom line is that Dany troops will be at a bigger disadvantage because of the weather and the terrain.

Now the wild card will be the Mountain Clans.Maybe Tyrion will be able to get them to join Dany through his old contacts. Or maybe the Mountain Clans simply won't give a shit.

Also, anybody with a half brain knows that when your fighting Dragons, don't base your defenses around castles. I am sure every noble boy knows the story about Harrenhal.

yes they dont have an experience in fighting at winter and their style is not suited in fighting at the mountains but we dont know how well the vale can fight in the winter also ...and you are forgetting the major one here Dragons

and the mountain clans doesnt want to join Danny but they will never fight beside Vale lords ..

if Tyrion can offer the Vale to them they will surely join them but they are not like the clans in the north who respects their Lords ..they still think the Vale lords has usurpers who stole their kingdoms ..so they will not join them

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yes they dont have an experience in fighting at winter and their style is not suited in fighting at the mountains but we dont know how well the vale can fight in the winter also ...and you are forgetting the major one here Dragons

and the mountain clans doesnt want to join Danny but they will never fight beside Vale lords ..

if Tyrion can offer the Vale to them they will surely join them but they are not like the clans in the north who respects their Lords ..they still think the Vale lords has usurpers who stole their kingdoms ..so they will not join them

Well, I am not in denial about the power of the Dragons. However, I look at the Dragons as being the equivalent of modern tanks and bombers. They are great at taking terrain, but probably not so great at holding it. For that you need "boots on the ground". Also, isn't their some evidence out there that weather can degrade the capabilities of Dragons, at least some?

And I am betting the soldiers in the Vale are better suited to fighting in cold weather and mountainous terrain for the simple fact that they live there. I doubt the Dothraki and Unsullied have even seen snow or have lived in or near mountainous or hilly terrain.

And if the mountain clans stay neutral, attacking both sides, it could end up being a bigger pain in the ass for Dany. It's Dany that has to prove she can hold the terrain, since she would be the invader.

The most effective tactic for the Vale would probably be just destroy all the food supplies they can't hide. If they destroy the food, Dany's soldiers can't eat, if they can't eat, they can't march, and if they can't march they can't fight, at least for very long.

Of course, this all really depends on the exact forces Dany will have at her disposal and how many dragons she will have under her control and their size. Also, political factors will matter too. We just haven't got enough information yet to tell. Any thing could happen, from the Vale just outright agreeing to join Dany to fighting her.

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Well, I am not in denial about the power of the Dragons. However, I look at the Dragons as being the equivalent of modern tanks and bombers. They are great at taking terrain, but probably not so great at holding it. For that you need "boots on the ground". Also, isn't their some evidence out there that weather can degrade the capabilities of Dragons, at least some?

And I am betting the soldiers in the Vale are better suited to fighting in cold weather and mountainous terrain for the simple fact that they live there. I doubt the Dothraki and Unsullied have even seen snow or have lived in or near mountainous or hilly terrain.

And if the mountain clans stay neutral, attacking both sides, it could end up being a bigger pain in the ass for Dany. It's Dany that has to prove she can hold the terrain, since she would be the invader.

The most effective tactic for the Vale would probably be just destroy all the food supplies they can't hide. If they destroy the food, Dany's soldiers can't eat, if they can't eat, they can't march, and if they can't march they can't fight, at least for very long.

Of course, this all really depends on the exact forces Dany will have at her disposal and how many dragons she will have under her control and their size. Also, political factors will matter too. We just haven't got enough information yet to tell. Any thing could happen, from the Vale just outright agreeing to join Dany to fighting her.

that will be the major factor exact number of forces danny has and we dont know enough information on our hands ...so we have to wait and see when the book comes ...but i think Danny will have all three dragons at her side

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