Small Questions v 10086

[The Bedding]

Trying to figure out why Barristan Selmy's name is "bare it then sell me". Does it mean he's dealing with all of Dany's damn problems in her absence, then he will sell her out to Aegon because he has the better claim?

:BANG:

[The Fallen]

The Oakhearts are known for constantly fighting the Dornish. Even Aerys thinks about all of his ancestors who had died fighting the Dornish. I always assumed that Old Oak was on the border with Dorne, which would explain the hostilities do to the close proximity with Dorne.

But when I looked at a map, Old Oak is actually closer to the Westerlands than Dorne. They're hatred for and constant fighting with Dorne seems odd. Wouldn't it be more realistic that they would have that kind of animosity for the west instead of Dorne?

Or were their battles with Dorne always a result of being part of a Reach host that was fighting Dorne?

[HelenaExMachina]

Trying to figure out why Barristan Selmy's name is "bare it then sell me". Does it mean he's dealing with all of Dany's damn problems in her absence, then he will sell her out to Aegon because he has the better claim?

:BANG:

what? :huh:

His name is Barristan Selmy pronounced BAR-IS-STAN SELL-ME. I don't know where you are getting bare it then sell me from...

[Attitude]

Not sure if it should be here, because it's a question regarding to the show vs the book. But I assumed that more people have read the book + watched the series, then that there are people who have watched the series but didn't read the books. So therefor I place my question here:

In the show, Cersei tells Tywin that she had an affair with Jamie. After that, Tywin dies. But in the book, does Tywin ever know about Cersei & Jamie? Iirc he didn't and the 'tower of the hand scene' between Tywin and Cersei never occured in the books. Is that correct?

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Not sure if it should be here, because it's a question regarding to the show vs the book. But I assumed that more people have read the book + watched the series, then that there are people who have watched the series but didn't read the books. So therefor I place my question here:

In the show, Cersei tells Tywin that she had an affair with Jamie. After that, Tywin dies. But in the book, does Tywin ever know about Cersei & Jamie? Iirc he didn't and the 'tower of the hand scene' between Tywin and Cersei never occured in the books. Is that correct?

No, that scene never happened in the books. There is also nothing in the books that suggests that Tywin knows about the relationship, btw.

[Attitude]

No, that scene never happened in the books. There is also nothing in the books that suggests that Tywin knows about the relationship, btw.

Good, since I didn't remember it happening. The only thing I remember is Tyrion saying to Cersei (I think?) something like: "I know about you and Jamie, I am not as blind as father." Therefor I was quite sure that it didn't happen in the books. I wonder why they slipped it in the tv show.. Maybe to make Cersei's turning crazy BIG TIME a bit more realistic. (I mean, telling this to Tywin(!))

[Godfrey]

Was the marriage between Elia and Rhaegar arranged by the king? or was it out of love.

Don't have my books with me, right now

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Was the marriage between Elia and Rhaegar arranged by the king? or was it out of love.

Don't have my books with me, right now

Arranged by Aerys, after Steffon Baratheon failed to find a bride for Rhaegar in the Free Cities.

[dielsis]

what? :huh:

His name is Barristan Selmy pronounced BAR-IS-STAN SELL-ME. I don't know where you are getting bare it then sell me from...

Yeah, I don't get this either. Hopefully @The Bedding will fill us in on that thought process.

[The Fallen]

Trying to figure out why Barristan Selmy's name is "bare it then sell me". Does it mean he's dealing with all of Dany's damn problems in her absence, then he will sell her out to Aegon because he has the better claim?

:BANG:

I love this kind of outside-the-box thinking.

[The Bedding]

So it's pronounced Bahr Ris Stan Sell Me and not Bear Ris Stan Sell Me? There's something going on with that name. He's an advisor to the Breaker of chains. He's the last one anyone would suspect in Quaithe's betrayal warnings. I think he'd change sides to Aegon because he has the better and more rightful claim than Dany. But I think he'd be straightforward and polite about it with Dany, like a proper relationship breakup.

[Nittanian]

It is often stated that Robert's retinue took a month to travel from KL to Winterfell. Is this confirmed in the books?

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

It is often stated that Robert's retinue took a month to travel from KL to Winterfell. Is this confirmed in the books?

No. But looking at the distance of the Neck and the time it took to cross it (12 days, as stated in Sansa I) and the time it took the court to travel from Darry to KL (a fortnight), you can estimate that the travel took 2 months. Not 1.

Of course, this is GRRM math.. And if GRRM wants the rest of the journey to have lasted shorter, it will have been shorter..

[aryagonnakill#2]

So it's pronounced Bahr Ris Stan Sell Me and not Bear Ris Stan Sell Me? There's something going on with that name. He's an advisor to the Breaker of chains. He's the last one anyone would suspect in Quaithe's betrayal warnings. I think he'd change sides to Aegon because he has the better and more rightful claim than Dany. But I think he'd be straightforward and polite about it with Dany, like a proper relationship breakup.

[Ser Leftwich]

Near the beginning of The Hedge Knight, Ser Roland Crakehall (of the KG), say to Dunk, and I am paraphrasing here, "it would unseemly for we of the KG to compete against those who we are to protect." Meaning that the KG would not enter the lists against the Targ princes that were there to compete: Daeron, Aerion, Valarr, etc.

Now fast-forward to the reign of Aerys II. We know that KG are entering the lists for tournaments (at Storm's End and the ToH), one of which Barristan Selmy won by unhorsing the heir, Prince Rhaegar.

Are there hard and fast rules about this? Was it because at Ashford the princes were kind of young?

Is there something more sinister happening?

[aryagonnakill#2]

Near the beginning of The Hedge Knight, Ser Roland Crakehall (of the KG), say to Dunk, and I am paraphrasing here, "it would unseemly for we of the KG to compete against those who we are to protect." Meaning that the KG would not enter the lists against the Targ princes that were there to compete: Daeron, Aerion, Valarr, etc.

Now fast-forward to the reign of Aerys II. We know that KG are entering the lists for tournaments (at Storm's End and the ToH), one of which Barristan Selmy won by unhorsing the heir, Prince Rhaegar.

Are there hard and fast rules about this? Was it because at Ashford the princes were kind of young?

Is there something more sinister happening?

Dunk realizes right from the start that everyone is letting Aemonds son win, and we also hear that Maekor wanted his sons winning, so the kings guard probably just stayed away.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Near the beginning of The Hedge Knight, Ser Roland Crakehall (of the KG), say to Dunk, and I am paraphrasing here, "it would unseemly for we of the KG to compete against those who we are to protect." Meaning that the KG would not enter the lists against the Targ princes that were there to compete: Daeron, Aerion, Valarr, etc.

Now fast-forward to the reign of Aerys II. We know that KG are entering the lists for tournaments (at Storm's End and the ToH), one of which Barristan Selmy won by unhorsing the heir, Prince Rhaegar.

Are there hard and fast rules about this? Was it because at Ashford the princes were kind of young?

Is there something more sinister happening?

There are no rules about KG taking part in tourneys. For as far as I can tell, they are allowed. The Trial of Seven, however, was another case, since that was an actual fight, and there, as Prince Baelor said, the KG were only allowed to defend themselves, not to attack the princes.

The KG tell it to Dunk in kind words, but KG knights aren't (always) stupid. It's like @Aryagonnakill#2 said, Maekar wanted his own sons to win, so the KG knew better than to try and steal the glory of the two princes who obviously weren't going to win. I doubt that the KG were trying to win favor with Valarr. That is, however, what others tried. They lost to Valarr on purpose, telling him that he had fought well and had been too good for him. The Lords and such did that because they knew that Valarr was going to be their future King, and they tried to gain favour with him by acting this way. The KG had no reason to act like this to Valarr, and besides, not fighting against Valarr would not help gaining his favour.

My guess is that with 6 Targaryen Princes who were supposed to be present (Baelor, Valarr, Maekar, Daeron, Aerion, Aegon), it was better that the KG focussed on protecting their princes, than taking part in the tourney.

Also, with Valarr present, it is possible that his wife was present as well. Also Matarys might have been present, providing even more protecting work for the KG (Valarr and Matarys were heirs, Valarrs wife the future Queen, as far as they knew; they would need KG protection).

[Ser Leftwich]

My guess is that with 6 Targaryen Princes who were supposed to be present (Baelor, Valarr, Maekar, Daeron, Aerion, Aegon), it was better that the KG focussed on protecting their princes, than taking part in the tourney.

The being busy guarding makes sense. But there were 5 champions, enough the KG to tilt against and not steal Valarr's thunder.

With all the rigged tourney's, it has seemed to me that the KG could be commanded to take dives/falls.

Thanks for the thoughts.

[sweetsunray]

Good, since I didn't remember it happening. The only thing I remember is Tyrion saying to Cersei (I think?) something like: "I know about you and Jamie, I am not as blind as father." Therefor I was quite sure that it didn't happen in the books. I wonder why they slipped it in the tv show.. Maybe to make Cersei's turning crazy BIG TIME a bit more realistic. (I mean, telling this to Tywin(!))

Well, since Tywin dies shortly after anyway, this was the show's way to assure the viewers that Tywin had never suspected it and truly thought it was Stannis' propaganda. It says more about Tywin, than Cersei: he may be a mean father to Tyrion and a machiavelistic lord, but he still had some values when it comes to incest.

[Hangover of the Morning]

I was wondering if there is every a mention of the Targaryens choosing their brides among the female members of House Dayne? As far as I remember that has never been the case but it is rather odd considering the fairly high status and prestige of the family among the Westerosi nobility. The Dayenes having similar "phenotype" to the Targs (purple eyes, sometimes silver hair) would seem like reasonable candidates when brother/sister incest is either not possible or desirable. The only drawback would be possibly alienating House Martell.

It seems rather odd that for example Ashara Dayne was not considered a possible match for Rhaegar. Arthur being the crown prince's oldest friend implies a strong bond between the two families. I understand that the Daynes are not Lord Paramours and might not be considered worthy of the Targaryens but surely they should rank above some foreigner from Essos that Aerys was willing to consider.