If Wynafryd Manderly becomes Lady of White Harbour who is a suitable match for her?

[Bright Blue Eyes]

I've already said it; history, family connections, famous family members.

The Freys are the richest of the Tully's bannermen but they are not prestigious. Someone being rich doesn't mean that he has prestige.

Like being the go-to family for Stark brides? Or being the family giving the second-largest river of Westeros its name?

[Jon's Queen Consort]

Besides, speaking of prestige, they are plotting to restore the Starks to power, avenge the Red Wedding, and probably marry into the Starks. That's going to count for something for several generations.

Rickard's grandmother was Melantha Blackwood.

Like being the go-to family for Stark brides? Or being the family giving the second-largest river of Westeros its name?

Having the name, which if irc is just a gossip, didn't mattered when they were kicked out of Reach did it?

Back to the point, the point is that you cannot compare apples and oranges. You cannot compare who is the weaker because one may be the richer the other might me the more prestigious etc.

[Game Of Thrones]

Manderlys are probably converted FM like the Hightowers. The -ly ending is only found in Casterly, Lynderly and Manderly, and Casterlys are FM.

[Game Of Thrones]

Manderlys may also be descendants of Garth Greenhand.

[Universal Sword Donor]

I've already said it; history, family connections, famous family members.

The Freys are the richest of the Tully's bannermen but they are not prestigious. Someone being rich doesn't mean that he has prestige.

I never said Freys were the most prestigious, I said they were the most powerful. People have been talking shit about the Freys the entire series.

You said a bunch of generalities. Please go into specifics. The most famous Blackwood was the Melissa Blackwood, and she was a short term mistress of Aegon IV. That's a hell of an endorsement. If you want to bring up Bloodraven, well he's not a Blackwood. He's a Targaryen.

History? They were petty kings who were overthrown by their neighbors. We're a bit vague on what happened to the Manderlys, but they managed to turn a small fortress into the only city in the North and became wealthy and powerful in the process.

Family connections? The only confirmed marriages we know are with the Brackens and Osgreys. We know that Tytos is close to the Starks but so are the Manderlys. Manderlys married into the Hornwoods, but we don't know much else about their family history.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

I never said Freys were the most prestigious, I said they were the most powerful. People have been talking shit about the Freys the entire series.

You said a bunch of generalities. Please go into specifics. The most famous Blackwood was the Melissa Blackwood, and she was a short term mistress of Aegon IV. That's a hell of an endorsement. If you want to bring up Bloodraven, well he's not a Blackwood. He's a Targaryen.

History? They were petty kings who were overthrown by their neighbors. We're a bit vague on what happened to the Manderlys, but they managed to turn a small fortress into the only city in the North and became wealthy and powerful in the process.

Family connections? The only confirmed marriages we know are with the Brackens and Osgreys. We know that Tytos is close to the Starks but so are the Manderlys. Manderlys married into the Hornwoods, but we don't know much else about their family history.

First of; chill out ok? Because I really don't like your tone.

History; Blackwoods kings, Manderlys came to the North beset and friendless, hounded from their homes and in peril of thei lives.

Family members: Blackwoods; Robb Rivers, Brynden Rivers. Manderly; ?

Family connections; Blackwoods; Riverlanders, Starks and Targs. Manderlys; Northmen (?) & Starks' cousins.

[Lord Thaeglei of Frostpyre]

Rickard's grandmother was Melantha Blackwood.

True, but the Manderlys have provided more consorts to Stark lords than any other Northern noble house in recent history, only the Royces equals them 2 to 2..

[Wmarshal]

First of; chill out ok? Because I really don't like your tone.

History; Blackwoods kings, Manderlys came to the North beset and friendless, hounded from their homes and in peril of thei lives.

Family members: Blackwoods; Robb Rivers, Brynden Rivers. Manderly;

Family connections; Blackwoods; Riverlanders, Starks and Targs. Manderlys; Northmen (?) & Starks' cousins.

The Manderlys held many a title and prestige in the south, and have been great aid in the North. That is why they have such great titles.

THe Blackwoods kingship is so trapped in unknown it is silly.

The Manderly fought in the dance as well and so what they had a bastard by a king? Not likely he married back into the family, and he was a bastard.

The blackwoods have no marriage into the Targs as we know, just one bastard.

[juanml82]

Rickard's grandmother was Melantha Blackwood.

And Rickard's grandson's Rickon's wife might end up being a Manderly

[Jon's Queen Consort]

True, but the Manderlys have provided more consorts to Stark lords than any other Northern noble house in recent history, only the Royces equals them 2 to 2..

Not really. Myriame had no children and Jeyne had no lordings.

Now you mention the Royces, from all we know the Blackwoods are like the Royces. Prestigious yet not so rich.

And Rickard's grandson's Rickon's wife might end up being a Manderly

You see the one is what we know the other is fanfiction.

[Lord Thaeglei of Frostpyre]

Family connections? The only confirmed marriages we know are with the Brackens and Osgreys. We know that Tytos is close to the Starks but so are the Manderlys. Manderlys married into the Hornwoods, but we don't know much else about their family history.

The Manderlys provided two consorts for Stark lords..

Lady Jeyne Manderly was the wife of Lord Rickon Stark, first born son and heir to Lord Cregan Stark, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North.. They had two daughters: Lady Sansa Stark and Lady Sarra Stark.. When their father died, the daughters were bypassed in the line of succession and was placed after their uncles..

Then we have Lady Myriame Manderly who was the wife of Lord Rodwell Stark, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North.. Lord Rodwell was infact cousin to both Lady Sansa and Lady Sarra.. Lady Myriame Manderly was the Lady of Winterfell during her husband's reign..

The Manderlys were also strong supporters of Queen Rhaenyra Targaryen. Ser Medrick Manderly and Ser Torrhen Manderly were among Queen Rhaenyra's staunchest supporters and protected her after the Storming of the Dragonpit.. They even suggested the Queen to seek refuge in White Harbor after the fall of Dragonstone..

[Jon's Queen Consort]

The Manderlys provided two consorts for Stark lords..

Lady Jeyne Manderly was the wife of Lord Rickon Stark, first born son and heir to Lord Cregan Stark, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North.. They had two daughters: Lady Sansa Stark and Lady Sarra Stark.. When their father died, the daughters were bypassed in the line of succession and was placed after their uncles..

Then we have Lady Myriame Manderly who was the wife of Lord Rodwell Stark, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North.. Lord Rodwell was infact cousin to both Lady Sansa and Lady Sarra.. Lady Myriame Manderly was the Lady of Winterfell during her husband's reign..

:eek: and I was thinking that we have only the family tree.

The Manderlys were also strong supporters of Queen Rhaenyra Targaryen. Ser Medrick Manderly and Ser Torrhen Manderly were among Queen Rhaenyra's staunchest supporters and protected her after the Storming of the Dragonpit.. They even suggested the Queen to seek refuge in White Harbor after the fall of Dragonstone..

Thank you I have read TPATQ so what?

[Universal Sword Donor]

First of; chill out ok? Because I really don't like your tone.

History; Blackwoods kings, Manderlys came to the North beset and friendless, hounded from their homes and in peril of thei lives.

Family members: Blackwoods; Robb Rivers, Brynden Rivers. Manderly; ?

Family connections; Blackwoods; Riverlanders, Starks and Targs. Manderlys; Northmen (?) & Starks' cousins.

Being petty kings 2000 years ago means nothing. Manderlys clearly had power and influence in the Reach. They lost everything and completely rebuilt in the North.

Robb Rivers was a famous bowman and a bastard. That's something to put your hat on.

Bloodraven did nothing as a Blackwood bastard. It was only when Aegon legitimized him as a Targaryen that he did anything.

Family connections? There's hardly anything there. Aegon IV banged a blackwood. That's not a connection and Bloodraven didn't exactly favor the Blackwoods even when he got to power. The Manderlys married Starks and Hornwoods. Even if they don't hold much sway outside of the North, they are still a top tier power.

Thank you I have read TPATQ so what?

I'll say the same thing for the Blackwoods.

[RainGhost]

If House Stark have married Blackwoods, why would they be below House Manderly? In fact, surely it would be better for an heiress to marry from a lower House?

[Lord Thaeglei of Frostpyre]

Not really. Myriame had no children and Jeyne had no lordings.

Now you mention the Royces, from all we know the Blackwoods are like the Royces. Prestigious yet not so rich.

I have no problems with Wynafryd marrying a Blackwood, but i don't get it why do you think the Manderlys are not as prestigious as the Blackwoods.. The Royces are a no-brainer.. They are among the most prestigious houses in the kingdoms, when one of the daughters Lady Rhea Royce was chosen as bride for Prince Daemon Targaryen.. While the Blackwoods were once petty kings in the Riverlands.. BUT, the Manderlys have an ancient and colorful history in the south, with one of the greatest rivers in the kingdoms named after them and southern houses like the Webbers and Borrells know a lot about their history.. Plus they are prestigious enough to be intermarried twice (tie with the Royces) with the Starks, even if they are seen back in the North as flowery southerners by most Northern lords..

[Jon's Queen Consort]

Being petty kings 2000 years ago means nothing. Manderlys clearly had power and influence in the Reach. They lost everything and completely rebuilt in the North.

As you said; having power 2000 years ago means nothing.

Robb Rivers was a famous bowman and a bastard. That's something to put your hat on.

Bloodraven did nothing as a Blackwood bastard. It was only when Aegon legitimized him as a Targaryen that he did anything.

Yet there are two half Blackwoods who actually are famous. That's two more than the famous Manderly we know of.

Family connections? There's hardly anything there. Aegon IV banged a blackwood. That's not a connection and Bloodraven didn't exactly favor the Blackwoods even when he got to power. The Manderlys married Starks and Hornwoods. Even if they don't hold much sway outside of the North, they are still a top tier power.

Again; Blackwoods have also married Blackwoods and if what we know of the Tullys are right they have married Tullys too and they have a family connection with Targs. Because Bloodraven was a Blackwood and a Targaryen. Much more than what we know for the Manderlys.

I'll say the same thing for the Blackwoods.

Your point is?

Anyway because I see that we are getting to a dead end the point is that Blackwoods are not inferior than the Manderlys. They might be poorer but that doesn't mean that they are inferior than them. The end.

[Universal Sword Donor]

As you said; having power 2000 years ago means nothing.

Yes and the Manderlys have more power and lnfluence now, so at worst family history is a wash.

Yet there are two half Blackwoods who actually are famous. That's two more than the famous Manderly we know of.

No we get just as much of Manderly knights in the TPaTQ as we do Robb Rivers, if not more.

Again; Blackwoods have also married Blackwoods and if what we know of the Tullys are right they have married Tullys too and they have a family connection with Targs. Because Bloodraven was a Blackwood and a Targaryen. Much more than what we know for the Manderlys.

Your point is?

The Blackwoods aren't as relevant as the Manderlys. That's not a knock on the Blackwoods. The Manderlys are just richer, more influential, and more powerful. That's to be expected with their geographic advantage and apparent mercantile expertise.

Okay you're going to have to clarify that for me. Not entire sure what the bolded, italicized part means.

And frankly your particular line of argument means that the Westerlings are more prestigious than the Manderlys too.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

The Blackwoods aren't as relevant as the Manderlys. That's not a knock on the Blackwoods. The Manderlys are just richer, more influential, and more powerful. That's to be expected with their geographic advantage and apparent mercantile expertise.

I thought that we have only seen that they are more rich.

And frankly your particular line of argument means that the Westerlings are more prestigious than the Manderlys too.

Do you seriously believe that the Blackwoods are Riverlands' Westerling. Yes I am done here, nothing more to see.

[Universal Sword Donor]

I thought that we have only seen that they are more rich.

No they are definitely richer and more powerful. They building an entire navy for the North. No house in the Riverlands could do that. He is supplying the manpower for that navy as well. We also know that despite losing 1750 men, he still has more heavy horse than any house north of the Neck. That includes the Boltons, who essentially suffered no losses south of the Neck and could field 600 mounted men at the Sack of Winterfell. That also means he going to have a correspondingly strong infantry force as well, but that's just strong speculation.

Do you seriously believe that the Blackwoods are Riverlands' Westerling. Yes I am done here, nothing more to see.

No I don't. Your line of argument would support that angle though. The Westerlings are a proud, prestigious house. They married a Targaryen, not just got banged by one. They married into the Lannisters, back when they were Kings of the Westerlands. A full member of the Westerlings was named to the KG and became LC. Jeyne married the KitN. Lord Spicer's brother in law is now a lord and in charge of the mines in Castamere.

Surely that is prestigous no?