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R+L=J v.108


Jon Weirgaryen

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Pot. Kettle.

I have enough sense to know that GRRM is NOT going to write exactly what 90% of his readers are hoping that he writes: For Jon to be reunited with his body & save the realm!!!

Anyone who does not understand this logic, then there is no point in me arguing with them...

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Of course I don't.

But I don't think that prevents Lyanna from being the KOTLT because I'm not sure GRRM cares. It might be a physics mistake for GRRM but it's clearly Lyanna. Who do you think it is, if not Lyanna?

I don't presume to know... I only know that GRRM would understand that 14 year old girls cannot possibly compete with grown men in a jousting competition due to their lack of range... It's pretty simple really

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So to me, it's a confused and nonsensical jumble of ridiculousness that serves no purpose to the story.

You have no idea where the story is going, so how you make statements like this is beyond me...

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I have enough sense to know that GRRM is NOT going to write exactly what 90% of his readers are hoping that he writes: For Jon to be reunited with his body & save the realm!!!

Anyone who does not understand this logic, then there is no point in me arguing with them...

You seem to believe the following

1) GRRM is breaker of all the things. Not true. He sells himself as such but his story isn't "break all the tropes" tastic.

2) That I believe Jon Snow will single handedly save the realm. I do not. No one does it alone. And I do think Jon will be changed when he comes back to his body (yes. HIS body). He will be greyer but this does not a villain make.

3) The GRRM writes actual villains and heroes. Not how GRRM views the world.

4) That GRRM is knowledgeable about what 90% of his fans think he will write. You couldn't get a consensus on this board about ANYTHING if you tried

And you STILL haven't given me evidence outside of "it is foreshadowed" and when in the past I have asked for this you give me some "read the text" or only fragments of text without linking anything. So of course I don't believe you.

I don't presume to know... I only know that GRRM would understand that 14 year old girls cannot possibly compete with grown men in a jousting competition due to their lack of range... It's pretty simple really

Having spoken to GRRM personally, right? Also, Lyanna trained at this. She was more skilled than you're giving her credit for. And if you don't know...do you have a theory.

You have no idea where the story is going, so how you make statements like this is beyond me...

Oh sweet seven save me. Are you kidding? How are you not doing the exact same thing that you're accusing sj4iy of??

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Having spoken to GRRM personally, right? Also, Lyanna trained at this. She was more skilled than you're giving her credit for. And if you don't know...do you have a theory.

You clearly do not understand what is being argued...

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Are you saying that you fall into the camp with all these other R+L=J fan boys/girls who can't wait for their happy ending?

But you're basing this on what you think "predictable" storytelling would be. It's your subjective understanding of what would constitute "predictable." What if GRRM doesn't share your idea of predictability

Ok, you edited your post from what it said originally...but um...again none of us have ever said "happy ending."

Good lord I don't for one second think anyone is getting a happy ending. It will be bittersweet. (which is what GRRM calls BTW).

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Lol, apparently I think I know where the story is going now. I know I've certainly never mentioned "happy ending" anywhere in my posts.

The difference, of course, is that I have theories that I can support with actual evidence from the actual story. And I've never told anyone "you'll see how right I am when the next book comes out!!"

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You clearly do not understand what is being argued...

You're saying that Lyanna would not be able to joust with a lance because of her age and stature. I get that. I'm not so sure that means it can't happen in GRRM's land. And again...provide me with a different answer to the KOTLT then. You don't think it was Lyanna...tell me who? You have theories about everything else.

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You clearly do not understand what is being argued...

Loras is 16 years old at the time of the books, and has a reputation (which isn't established overnight) as being the best jouster in the kingdom, which he attributes to his technique and horsemanship (which we know Lyanna has), not his strength. There is not that large a difference between girls and boys at 14, and she didn't take on anyone that is a uber-renowned night.

Is it somewhat silly? Yes. Is it consistent with the somewhat silliness of the entire storyline? Yes.

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Are you saying that you fall into the camp with all these other R+L=J fan boys/girls who can't wait for their happy ending?

Haha wow. You give another poster stick for something when you are doing the exact same thing. The only difference is yours isn't supported by any evidence, as other posters keep asking you for.

You don't know whats going to happen. I don't know whats going to happen. No one on these boards knows whats going to happen. We have only theories. You seem to think you know where it's going even though other posters have provided actual evidence with their theories.

Their theories have a lot more foreshadowing than yours does.

Do I think Jon is going to warg Hodor and and become the Nights King? Absolutely god damn not, and I have yet to see you provide evidence or so called foreshadowing that would convince me otherwise.

Do I think it will all end happily for everyone? Nope

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Oh sweet seven save me. Are you kidding? How are you not doing the exact same thing that you're accusing sj4iy of??

Like I said in a previous post (that you failed to understand)... sj4jy & his/her little friends think that GRRM is going to have Jon be reunited with his body & save the realm!!! I am smart enough to know that this is not a possibility... That's as simple as it gets...

The only way that people could ever think that GRRM is going to have Jon be reunited with his body & save the realm!!! is if they:

  1. Didn't read the books

Didn't understand the books

or they could be incredibly slow I suppose

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Loras is 16 years old at the time of the books, and has a reputation (which isn't established overnight) as being the best jouster in the kingdom, which he attributes to his technique and horsemanship. There is not that large a difference between girls and boys at 14, and she didn't take on anyone that is a uber-renowned night.

Is it somewhat silly? Yes. Is it consistent with the somewhat silliness of the entire storyline? Yes.

Explanation accepted.

Like I said in a previous post (that you failed to understand)... sj4jy & his/her little friends think that GRRM is going to have Jon be reunited with his body & save the realm!!! I am smart enough to know that this is not a possibility... That's as simple as it gets...

The only way that people could ever think that GRRM is going to have Jon be reunited with his body & save the realm!!! is if they:

  1. Didn't read the books

Didn't understand the books

or they could be incredibly slow I suppose

And with this lovely and not at all insulting response, I think I'm done. Let's discuss when we've read WOW, shall we?

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Like I said in a previous post (that you failed to understand)... sj4jy & his/her little friends think that GRRM is going to have Jon be reunited with his body & save the realm!!! I am smart enough to know that this is not a possibility... That's as simple as it gets...

The only way that people could ever think that GRRM is going to have Jon be reunited with his body & save the realm!!! is if they:

  1. Didn't read the books

Didn't understand the books

or they could be incredibly slow I suppose

And now your insulting others intelligence. Others who have provided evidence with their arguments while you provide none.

Brilliant work

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You don't know whats going to happen. I don't know whats going to happen. No one on these boards knows whats going to happen. We have only theories. You seem to think you know where it's going even though other posters have provided actual evidence with their theories.

Where is this evidence?

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And now your insulting others intelligence. Others who have provided evidence with their arguments while you provide none.

Brilliant work

Where is this evidence? All this board does is attack my theories, they don't present their own...

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Where is this evidence? All this board does is attack my theories, they don't present their own...

You're posting in the 108th thread for R+L=J. Aside from you telling me I'm incorrect and that there is foreshadowing, you have literally presented nothing besides your own insistence.

Meanwhile, we've collectively brought up multiple times the resurrection of other characters, what we've learned about warging from other wargs, and our interpretation of Mel's visions, which are undoubtedly based on the text.

Then we've brought up the logical follow through from a story-telling standpoint, from which we've logically gone from the above to Jon coming back, changed from before, but still essentially the same person absent that change.

Meanwhile, you say "nuh uh, I'm right and you guys are just dumb. You don't get it." You don't try and tell us why we're wrong. You don't try and tell us how you're arriving at your conclusion. You haven't done anything besides being a contrarian troll.

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It's not a solution... Jon is not solving anything... He is going to be the bad-guy...

You have no idea where the story is going, so how you make statements like this is beyond me...

This right here is why nobody is taking you very seriously. Just read those two statements together and think about it for a moment. You're not applying the standards you require of others to yourself.

Want to make your case? Go ahead. Maybe you're right, but simply insisting that you're right and everyone who disagrees is a fool isn't going to help your case any.

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