Colonel Green Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 The Stokeworth/Lothston situation is a bit strange. Aegon begins his affair with Falena in 149AC, and it lasted for two years until they were discovered abed (151AC). Falena was married to Lothston, and Lothston was given Harrenhal, so Falena woudl be removed from court. Aegon was said to have visited frequently over the next two years (151-153). Jeyne, in 178AC, is 14 years old, placing her birth in 164AC.. Far away from Aegon's frequent visits to Harrenhal.. Though between 161AC and 171AC, Aegon had an affair with Bellegere Otherys, the rumours seem to be based on the idea that Aegon also slept with Falena during this time.. Possible, as Bellegere wouldn't constantly be in Westeros... But still, the wording was a bit strange.. Not that this is determinative, but Falena Stokeworth has dark hair. Her daughter Jeyne has blonde hair, much closer to the Targaryen look. We have no idea what Lucas Lothston looked like, of course, but I thought that stood out given her rumoured parentage. The story of Merry Meg was quite sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Not that this is determinative, but Falena Stokeworth has dark hair. Her daughter Jeyne has blonde hair, much closer to the Targaryen look. We have no idea what Lucas Lothston looked like, of course, but I thought that stood out given her rumoured parentage. The story of Merry Meg was quite sad.Interesting.. I hadn't noticed the hair colour of Jeyne yet.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Jeyne did not continue the line of Lothston, either. That would have been a son. But the interesting thing is that Mad Danelle may have had a good share of Targaryen blood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 A son of Lucas is mentioned somewhere in the rest of the series, though I can't recall his name.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 It's Manfryd, the son of Lucas the Pander. We now know how he got his name, I guess... There is also a Manfred during the Blackfyre Rebellion, although it's unclear whether they are identical or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arataniello Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 The Targaryen lineage: 4. Maegor - Ceryse Hightower, Alys Harroway, Tyanna of the Tower, Rhaena Targaryen, Jeyne Westerling, Elinor Costayne: no surviving issue So the number of wives seems to have definitely changed from the "seven or eight" that we thought previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Yap. There are three black brides, by the way, not just Rhaena. They are named so because Maegar had their previous husbands killed or executed. Only Rhaena and Elinor survive Maegor. I think this is deliberate change. Aenys had as many children as Maegor had wives in the end, and if we also count Alyssa's children by Robar, she had in the end seven surviving children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Oh, and just for the record: Visenya founded the Kingsguard. They are her idea, everything about them. She also personally saved Aegon from assassins in KL during the Dornish War, and pointed out the laziness of guards by cutting his cheek with her sword before they could even move. She was the champion of House Targaryen, and if she did kill Aenys, it was not for personal gain, glory, power, or anything but because she felt it was the best for the dynasty and she had no other choice. She was much more than a kinslayer and evil stepmother cliché! Visenya rules! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARYa_Nym Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I still believe she was ambitious and she supported Maegor. It even says it. "In later days, after Visenya's death, it was suggested that King Aenys's sudden demise was Visenya's doing, and some spoke of her as a kinslayer and kingslayer. Did she not prefer Maegor over Aenys in all things? Did she not have the ambition that her son should rule?? Why, then did she tend to her stepson and nephew when she seemed disgusted with him? Visenya was many things, but a woman capable of pity never seemed to be one of them. It is a question that cannot be readily dismissed...nor readily answered." She was also his councilor during his reign. I long thought that Maegor was in her likeness. Physically and in terms of prowess he was like Aegon but I think he picked up certain personality traits from her. I thought it was interesting when her death was brought up as a possibility for him crumbling as well as other reasons of course. Plus, it was said long ago in an SSM that she was dark. I don't see anything else that shows how dark she is except for supporting and pushing for Maegor. However, I think it's open to interpretation so one can still think she did it for the realm but I don't. ETA: & for the record I think she rules too. It's not like a mother supporting her son is not understandable so that wouldn't eliminate her from being respected to me or from her accomplishments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taenqyrhae Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 There was quite an influx of First Men blood in later years, and understandably, Dornishes marriages. Just something I've noticed, there has never been an Iron Island or Northern marriage. And the marriages seem to be of vassal rather then Great Houses, which is confounding. If it's not a fellow Targ or an Arryn or Baratheon, it's a vassal. I know, I'm kind of surprised at the lack of First Men blood in the Targaryans, especially with Greatjon's line "it was the dragons we married, and the dragons are all dead" when pushing Robb to declare himself King in the North. The North did not fight the Targaryans, they agreed to bend the knee, but what did they get in return? I don't doubt that the North could have fought off the Targaryans at least as well as Dorne. Greatjon's line indicates Northern fealty to the Targaryans was based on marriage, where is it in the lineages? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel Green Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Greatjon's line indicates Northern fealty to the Targaryans was based on marriage, where is it in the lineages? No, it doesn't. It's a metaphor. They "married" the dragons by joining the realm under threat of dragonfire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay's Penguins Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 ^I doubt married means actual marriage. It's more like they had a relationship with them. Northerner never married Starks. Manderlys and Starks were going to, but that never came through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKingoftheSevenKingdoms Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Does the book say who Daeron the Young Dragon's wife was? I would like to know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moondancer Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Oh, and just for the record: Visenya founded the Kingsguard. They are her idea, everything about them.Modelled KG after NW. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Does the book say who Daeron the Young Dragon's wife was? I would like to know He didn't marry, IICR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
para Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 So 'all of Egg's sons married for love and the realm paid in corpses?' Except, you know one didn't marry at all, one did what 95 % of all Targs did before him and married a close relative and only the third married very obviously for love. So is the statement false or merely an exaggeration? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Does the book say who Daeron the Young Dragon's wife was? I would like to know He died unbetrothed and unmarried ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay's Penguins Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 So 'all of Egg's sons married for love and the realm paid in corpses?' Except, you know one didn't marry at all, one did what 95 % of all Targs did before him and married a close relative and only the third married very obviously for love. So is the statement false or merely an exaggeration? Two married for love. The second one married his sister for love. The third never "married" but devoted his love to someone else, and forsoke betrothals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 So 'all of Egg's sons married for love and the realm paid in corpses?' Except, you know one didn't marry at all, one did what 95 % of all Targs did before him and married a close relative and only the third married very obviously for love. So is the statement false or merely an exaggeration? Duncan and Jaehaerys married for love, Daeron had a similar relationship, which basically would have worked like a marriage, despite them not having stood in front of a septon to say vows.. The statement is Barristans interpretation. All three men were in love, and all three chose the partners they wanted to spend their lives with. In his hearth, Daeron was married. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKingoftheSevenKingdoms Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 He didn't marry, IICR. I know I shouldn't take the wiki as gospel, but it says: Although married, Daeron died without issue and was succeeded by his brother, Baelor the Blessed. In the city of Oldtown, there is a statue of King Daeron I astride a tall stone horse, his sword lifted toward Dorne. Should someone fix that know or has the World of Ice and Fire make that fact irrelevant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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