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Colonel Green

[TWOIAF Spoilers] Ranking the Targaryen Kings

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From that list i only agree with Baelor and Valarr

Lol what? Jacaerys has shown nothing but promise during his short reign as Prince of Dragonstone. There were some names on the list who didn't exactly belong there (Valarr for one. His father was brilliant, but Valarr as far as we know was mediocre), but his wasn't one of them.

Veltigar, about Baelor the Blessed (or Befuddled if you prefer, I'm easy). He did show some signs of being a good King yes (he negotiated Daeron's marriage, something the Maester mentions and then conveniently disregards when talking about Dorne joining the 7Ks, but anyway...) but he also showed signs of instability (walking barefoot from KL to Sunspear, whilst an impressive feat, is also pretty mad). So I agree that the Wyls (who are awful btw) made thigs worse, but there is no guarantee Baelor would have remained stable anyway. I agree though, that he laid the groundwork for the Dornish alliance.

ETA; I can also completely buy that Aegon IV killed his father. What a d*ck

Instable perhaps, but also brilliant. I mean Baelor's walk to Sunspear was the greatest piece of PR we saw in this series so far. The Dornish absolutely loathed the Targaryens at this point (e.g. what the Wylls did to Aemon, a highly valuable prisoner) and yet his walk of pennance turned things around. I choose to read this as a young promising (though devout) king. The poison sadly killed what made him great and enhanced his loony side.

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As a hostage????????????

Why did you need a hostage that as the only claim of the blacks?

Viserys disappeared so if he killed Aegon the blacks would have no claim

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We are also told that




...King Aegon retained him [Tyland Lannister] as master of coin. In the last days of his rule, Aegon II even sent Ser Tyland to the Free Cities in search of sellswords to support his cause against Rhaenyra's son, the future Aegon III, and his supporters.





ETA: In addition, whilst not related to Aegon himself, the bit on Tyland suggests a reason for the marriage:




In hopes of binding up the deep wounds left by the Dance...



The Council/Regents were obviously attempting to reconcile the Realm



ETA: And in the Ironborn section:





....The remaining blacks and greens agreed to terms, and Rhaenyra's youngest son was crowned as Aegon III and wed to Aegon II's daughter, Jaehaera



^I knew I had read that somewhere. Its clear that they married after Aegon II's death


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Why did you need a hostage that as the only claim of the blacks?

Viserys disappeared so if he killed Aegon the blacks would have no claim

Because the blacks did not die with Rhaenyra.

Why do you think Aegon and Rhaenys, Elia's children, were killed during the sack of KL? Even with the war lost, there were many Targ loyalists. Hell, right now still are. The same happens here.

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Your confiming what i said why the the older left the younger alive since when the younger died the blacks would have no more claim

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He killed Rhaenyra and he ended his life as king simply that

His life ended because his own men murdered him to save their own asses from the Blacks.

Why did you need a hostage that as the only claim of the blacks?

Viserys disappeared so if he killed Aegon the blacks would have no claim

Also not true. The Blacks would just kill him and crown Rhaena or Baela (whichever is older).

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Your confiming what i said why the the older left the younger alive since when the younger died the blacks would have no more claim

Check my edited post. It has the quotes you need to show Aegon II wasn't behind their marriage

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Your confiming what i said why the the older left the younger alive since when the younger died the blacks would have no more claim

Aegon II didn't plan their marriage.

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Check my edited post. It has the quotes you need to show Aegon II wasn't behind their marriage

I was talking to Ingelheim not you sorry...

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His life ended because his own men murdered him to save their own asses from the Blacks.

Also not true. The Blacks would just kill him and crown Rhaena or Baela (whichever is older).

Why would the blacks continue the war for the daughters of Daemon?

With Aegon III dead the cause is dead

And Baela probably died before Aegon II

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Why would the blacks continue the war for the daughters of Daemon?

With Aegon III dead the cause is dead

Much like how the death of Henry VI killed the Lancastrian cause -- in fact, those people just switched to supporting the Tudor claim, as the war up to that point had drawn sharp lines between the factions, and they weren't going to give up at this point.

And Baela probably died before Aegon II

Even if that were true, Rhaena is alive. And, in any event, is isn't true. See the Targaryen family tree -- Baela married Lord Alyn Velaryon and is the mother to the current line of that house.

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In this whole who finally won thing - it's inspired by Empress Matilda and Stephen. Henry II succeeded Stephen by consent and putting aside Stephen's son, but Matilda herself never reigned.



So the Blacks did win in the end, but by default and because if your cause is male primogeniture, your simple minded daughter can't succeed you consistent with the principle you champion.


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Helena soory my world book hasn't arrive yet so can you quote something about Aegon II death?

Well I'm laying in bed now, so no :D :P

But I can tell you. Basically, Corlys Velaryon was released from the dungeons of the Red Keep and became part of Aegon II's small council. Aegon was going to order his nephew's (Aegon III. Damn, too many Aegons...) ear cut off when he heard of the Black armies converging on King's Landing (His Baratheon allies (essentially his last supporters) having just been defeated by the Riverlords, and the Northmen marching their untouched army to King's Landing). Aegon II got into his litter and when they opened the curtains he was dead having been poisoned.

Also, if Aegon III had been killed, Rhaena of Pentos becomes the rallying point, significantly weakening Aegon II's position because unlike Aegon, Rhaena is not his hostage (she was in the Vale of Arryn, who supported the Blacks). It is the same reason Daemon II Blackfyre was kept hostage - to tie Bittersteel's hands and stop him crowning a new claimant.

Also, Baela outlived Aegon II. She probably wouldn't have been the Black's next choice though, since she was probably a hostage too (having fought Aegon on Dragonstone)

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I don't think that with Aegon III dead the war would continue but that is my opinion

I've got two words for ya buddy: Cregan Stark

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