Sherlock

[Ser Quork]

Just caught up with this.  Quite shocked by just how contrived and overwrought that was.

[Veltigar]

Oh fuck this shit, we still haven't got rid of Mary. I hope this remains a one time appearance 

[TickleMyToes]

Just now, Veltigar said:

Oh fuck this shit, we still haven't got rid of Mary. I hope this remains a one time appearance 

Seriously? Oh FFS, i was hoping episode 1 was the last of it. 

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Is Mary joining Moriarty in Sherlock's mind palace?

[Veltigar]

You know, I kind of dug this episode in the end. Definitely far from Sherlock's best work, but it definitely breaks that curse of the second episode. It was miles better than the first one, but that was of course a really low bar to clear. I didn't really like the beginning of the episode, I was on the verge of getting a headache from all the dopefiend shennanigans. And until the end of the episode I really remained lukewarm to the whole Mary-as-aghost-schtick. It's rather cliche and I think they could have worked this into the plot in other ways.

Toby Jones was quite good as far as villains of the week go. However, the best part of the episode clearly took place after he got caught. That was probably this series best work since A Scandal in Belgravia. I loved every minute of it, from Toby Jones sweaty confessions right untill Sherlock and Watson saying their peace. And of course the big shocker that 

Spoiler

Sherlock has a (possible twin) sister  I did not see that one coming. One heard some rumours about Sherrinford, but this was a great twist imo. We all knew the woman on the bus would probably turn out to be bad news in the end, but I don't think anyone here really anticipated this. Well done Sherlock, well done. 

My favourite reveal though, was that Sherlock still texted with Irene Adler. I'm not usually one for shipping, but damn I have been on the Irene Adler + Sherlock bandwagon since the beginning. Lara Pulver was outstanding in that role and I really hope she'll get to reappear sooner or later (although I rather hope they don't fridge her as soon as she arrives).

One final thing that I must add, I really liked this episode's humour. This series is at its best when it goes out of its way to be a bit cheeky with the original characters. Mrs. Hudson driving an Aston Martin and joking about the incredible property prices in present day London, that was just gold. 

Anyway, my faith in this series perhaps isn't restored quite yet, but we're getting there. I'm anxious to see how this continous next week  

 

[williamjm]

1 hour ago, Veltigar said:

You know, I kind of dug this episode in the end. Definitely far from Sherlock's best work, but it definitely breaks that curse of the second episode. It was miles better than the first one, but that was of course a really low bar to clear. I didn't really like the beginning of the episode, I was on the verge of getting a headache from all the dopefiend shennanigans. And until the end of the episode I really remained lukewarm to the whole Mary-as-aghost-schtick. It's rather cliche and I think they could have worked this into the plot in other ways.

I'd agree with that, while it wasn't a perfect episode (at times it was maybe be a bit too gimmicky with all the multiple layers of hallucinations that people seemed to be having) I think it's the best we've had since season 3. At least there was an actual murder mystery to solve as the main focus of the episode (well, most of the episode), which is something that's been in short supply for a while.

Toby Jones was great, he is always very good at being creepy.

The final twist was interesting...

 

In retrospect I think it's true that we were all doing the same thing Watson did and inferring that there was a brother, but Mycroft's words were carefully chosen, both in the mention of 'the other one' in the previous season and in this episode where he denies having a secret brother. I completely failed to notice that the same actress was playing the woman John flirts with, his psychiatrist and the fake daughter, although I'm a bit unconvinced about Sherlock twice failing to recognise her, even in his drug-addled state

[Jaxom 1974]

I rather liked it.  

And the twist! There's got to be more than just one more episode...

[red snow]

3 hours ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

I rather liked it.  

And the twist! There's got to be more than just one more episode...

I had a feeling the other sibling may have been a sister but didn't put it together with the woman on the bus. Which is odd as I had her pegged as being an agent of Moriarty. Then again both things could be correct as she may have been in a relationship with Moriarty. It would be just the kind of soap opera BS they'd go for - it could even be retconned that she was always the mastermind behind Moriarty. Would also fit with how familiar Moriarty acted around Sherlock.

What was weird was how I knew there was something off about the psychiatrist but I couldn't place it. Some nice work by the dress/make-up and actress in making all 3 characters look convincingly different. I also thought it was nice how they had the ongoing joke about Sherlock's face recognition problems in episode 1 and them pulling the same trick on the viewers. I guess some astute viewers may have worked it out.

Toby Jones was excellent in what felt like a less creepy but still sinister take on Jimmy Saville with the fame/power and hospital setting. I found the hallucinations to be a little too confusing if I'm being honest but I guess that was a good way of conveying Sherlock's state of mind. I hate "ghosts" as a form of internal dialogue in non-fantasy shows - and this was no exception. Especially when they established Watson was actually "seeing" the ghost - that's even worse.

Hopefully the third episode will be the strongest of the season/series

[Jon's Queen Consort]

I would love to see more about Mycroft. Especially after lady Smallwood coming on to him.

Spoiler

Sherrinford=Eurus or Sherrinford and Eurus are the two “evil” siblings and Mycroft and Sherlock the two “good”?

What kind of family they were? How does they did something like that?

Also something that I noticed. Eurus, as it was told by her, in Greek mythology according to wikipedia

Quote

Eurus (Εὖρος, Euros) according to some was the southeast wind, but according to others the east wind https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anemoi#Eurus

and in His last vow it was told;

Quote

Well if he is, he'd better wrap up warm. There's an east wind coming.

Quote

The east wind is coming, Sherlock. It's coming to get you

Quote

The east wind takes us all in the end...It's a story my brother told me when we were kids. The east wind - this terrifying force that lays waste to all in its path. It seeks out the unworthy and plucks them from the earth...That was generally me.

foreshadowing? Or her red dress means that she a red herring for 

Spoiler

Sherrinford

 

[Corvinus85]

Definitely a better episode than last week.

Spoiler

 

Still, I spent the majority of the episode waiting for Sherlock to sober up. I don't like junkie Sherlock - it's a way for the writers to make the plot as confusing as possible, but the real mystery of a detective story suffers for it. I'm glad they skipped over the withdrawal phase. The last twenty minutes or so did save the episode.

I liked Toby Jones, the performances all around were great as usual. I enjoyed the extra reveals about Mrs. Hudson. And I liked the twist at the end, though I kinda wish they had ended the episode with the positive vibe that Sherlock and John are back together, and leave the twist for the start of the next episode.

 

 

[Quoth]

Ever since Sherlock and "Elementary" first aired, I've read how "Sherlock" was the much better show. Never having caught "Sherlock", but having greatly enjoyed "Elementary", I took it with a large grain of salt. Last night, as there was nothing to watch, I caught Season 4 Eps 1 and 2. WOW! Blown away! While I  will still love watching "Elementary", I concede that "Sherlock" is simply an amazing production and has me totally in its grasp. 

[Jaxom 1974]

I honestly thought, and could easily have misinterpreted that:

Spoiler

Sherrinford 

was a place...

[Corvinus85]

21 minutes ago, Quoth said:

Ever since Sherlock and "Elementary" first aired, I've read how "Sherlock" was the much better show. Never having caught "Sherlock", but having greatly enjoyed "Elementary", I took it with a large grain of salt. Last night, as there was nothing to watch, I caught Season 4 Eps 1 and 2. WOW! Blown away! While I  will still love watching "Elementary", I concede that "Sherlock" is simply an amazing production and has me totally in its grasp. 

You should go back and watch the rest of Sherlock. They're available on Netlfix, if you have the service. I like both shows, too, but I do consider Sherlock the better show. Elementary is a more formulaic cop procedural, with the added elements of Sherlock's brilliance and the well developed relationship between the two main characters. But Sherlock has a certain flair about it that puts it in a different category.

[Wrl6199]

2 minutes ago, Corvinus said:

You should go back and watch the rest of Sherlock. They're available on Netlfix, if you have the service. I like both shows, too, but I do consider Sherlock the better show. Elementary is a more formulaic cop procedural, with the added elements of Sherlock's brilliance and the well developed relationship between the two main characters. But Sherlock has a certain flair about it that puts it in a different category.

Yeah Sherlock is a great show.I just finished the first season or i guess it would be considered the first series.

[Quoth]

1 minute ago, Corvinus said:

You should go back and watch the rest of Sherlock. They're available on Netlfix, if you have the service. I like both shows, too, but I do consider Sherlock the better show. Elementary is a more formulaic cop procedural, with the added elements of Sherlock's brilliance and the well developed relationship between the two main characters. But Sherlock has a certain flair about it that puts it in a different category.

I don't have Netflix, but "Sherlock" may push me towards it.

Agreed. Sort of line the books vis-a-vis the TV show "GoT". I enjoy both very much for what each offers. They're both excellent in their own way.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

A question I have is does Mycroft

Spoiler

 

had faked Eurus' death and that is why she wasn't mentioned? If that was the case how Sherlock never noticed anything about her? Maybe it was because of the drugs?

 

2 hours ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

I honestly thought, and could easily have misinterpreted that:

  Reveal hidden contents

Sherrinford 

was a place...

That makes more sense when it comes to Moffat. However I still hope

Spoiler

Sherrinford is yet another Holmes brother. Maybe Tom Hiddleston? The more I think about it the more I like it.

Or it could be a codename.

2 hours ago, Quoth said:

Ever since Sherlock and "Elementary" first aired, I've read how "Sherlock" was the much better show. Never having caught "Sherlock", but having greatly enjoyed "Elementary", I took it with a large grain of salt. Last night, as there was nothing to watch, I caught Season 4 Eps 1 and 2. WOW! Blown away! While I  will still love watching "Elementary", I concede that "Sherlock" is simply an amazing production and has me totally in its grasp. 

Elementary is or at least was good, I didn't liked somethings like Joan, but Sherlock is on another level.  While Elementary is entertaining and nice, Sherlock is beautiful and brilliant. Also imnsho Sherlock has better actors.

[Iskaral Pust]

I really enjoyed that episode, not least because it improved so much on the prior.  Mary's participation was fine for me because it kept her chemistry and allowed a view into John's head, but ditched her super-spy persona that overshadows any other plot.  Good twist at the end and sets up the next episode.  The name also helps  explain some ominous predictions of an east wind in earlier episodes, which I thought at the time foreshadowed Sherlock's punishment suicide-mission to Russia or similar.

[DaveSumm]

Yea far better episode than last week. Although I wonder whether they've set the bar too high with just how intelligent Sherlock and his adversaries have to be.....the already completely absurd prediction of the precise time and place of the goings on at the therapists house appear to have been trumped by the sister, who must have known all that, plus figured out Culverton was a serial killer without Sherlock's 'tip off', and just generally orchestrated / predicted every movement of everyone on the show for at least this and the last episode. Wasn't really a fan of the Mrs Hudson stuff either, they've subverted our expectations of her one too many times and now she's about as believable as Ninja Assasin Mary. But, despite not being a fan of how they set them up last episode, there was some nice character moments for Sherlock and Watson. The whole scene at 221b at the end was very good.

Also, off-topic, but I've been playing Sherlock Holmes: Consulting Detective and it's so, so good. If you like Sherlock and a mystery, or if you don't, do yourself a favour.......and.....wait for it to become available again when it's reprinted. Sometime this year.

[polishgenius]

I really really hate the trope where a hallucination or dream gives a character accurate plot-relevant information, so it amused me greatly when they decided to take the piss out of it. And it's a nice twist, although I hope like heck that Euros doesn't prove to have been Moriarty all along. Pretending to be him since Sherlock came back, fine. Being him all along- if Mycroft and the intelligence service are meant to have her contained, then surely they would have noticed that Moriarty was her creature? I mean, there was a pretty thorough investigation into whether he was real.

I really enjoyed that the whole way through though. I think Sherlock's at its best when it's bonkers, and this is the most bonkers yet. Mrs Hudson was awesome, and to be honest I like druggy Sherlock too.

[Zorral]

We're all different in what works for us.  Or doesn't.  

Truly dislike hallucination anything and particularly in Sherlock and hate druggy Sherlock too. Do not like this show and its frackin' fan service and all the rest.  It isn't fun.

Elementary is pure formula and they do it honestly.  But still, it's Joan Watson that makes that series for me.

But when it comes to the Real Sherlock on screen -- Jeremy Brett!  Always Jeremy Brett.