Theory on Serra/Varys's origins (WOIAF spoilers)

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

First off, this works off the idea that Serra and Varys are both Blackfyres and are siblings. I'm not arguing that theory, necessarily, only attempting to show how Varys and Serra could have been Blackfyres (basically exiled royalty) and still have ended up as they did, with Varys castrated and Serra in a pillowhouse.

In addition to the question of how they ended up where they did, there's also the question of why these Blackfyres would seemingly respect or at least utilize Barristan Selmy, knowing that he killed Maelys the Monstrous and (supposedly) ended the Blackfyre line.

I think this goes back to how Maelys the Monstrous killed his cousin Daemon to take over the company and crown himself the new Blackfyre king. That the cousin's name was Daemon suggests that he may have been of the senior line, with Daemon being, in theory, the preferred dynastic name, similarly to how the Targaryens have used Aegon.

It's possible that Serra and Varys were Daemon's children, who found themselves politically persona non grata when Maelys took power. Maelys may have seen both of them as a threat, being heirs of the elder line, and been responsible for splitting them up and selling them into slavery in order to neutralize them (if they were both young children at the time, this may have been easier than killing them, which could have cost Maelys the support of the company). Or, alternatively, supporters of the now-dead Daemon smuggled them away with the aim of saving their lives, and it ended up botched. Both Varys and Serra apparently have Lysene origins; it's possible they were both sold off there.

The use of Varys in the magical ritual that supposedly resulted in him being castrated could have multiple interpretations. First, if you believe the hype, Varys would be especially attractive as a blood sacrifice by virtue of having king's blood; that could explain why the sorcerer was interested in him specifically. Second, the ritual may have actually been a cover in order to castrate him, leaving him dynastically useless (it's also possible that this was why Varys was castrated and the magical ritual story is a lie).

We know Varys ended up in Pentos and befriended Illyrio, and that Illyrio found Serra in the Lysene brothel. What if Varys, once he had Illyrio's resources and knowing that his sister had been sold to a pillowhouse in Lys, actually sent or asked Illyrio to retrieve her, which resulted in Illyrio falling in love with her and marrying her?

As for why these Blackfyres seem to have no ill will toward Barristan: Barristan killed Maelys. Rather than that act making the Blackfyres hate him, it would make these Blackfyres have a debt of gratitude, if Barristan had killed the man who killed their father and usurped their rights within the Blackfyre dynasty. If Maelys hadn't died, it'd be his heirs vying for the throne, not them. And as senior-line claimants (going by the idea that Daemon was probably senior-line), they would thus see themselves as the Blackfyre heirs and Aegon as the scion of the, to their thinking, rightful royal house.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I need to not post stuff at 2 a.m.

[Monctonvike]

Wow very well put together ! that would explain a lot. I am very excited to learn more of Vary's endgame I don't think we are that deep into it yet

[Winterfell is Burning]

This is not a bad theory at all. The only thing against it is that Illyrio said that the male line of House Blackfyre had ended with Maelys, making me think fAegon is descended from a female one.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

This is not a bad theory at all. The only thing against it is that Illyrio said that the male line of House Blackfyre had ended with Maelys, making me think fAegon is descended from a female one.

If Aegon is Serra's son, that would constitute him being descended in a female line. His claim to the Blackfyre throne is through his mother. And if Varys was castrated when Maelys was killed, then it is accurate to say that the male line is extinct. Any descendants would have to be Serra's, i.e. now female line.

[Blazfemur]

If Aegon is Serra's son, that would constitute him being descended in a female line. His claim to the Blackfyre throne is through his mother. And if Varys was castrated when Maelys was killed, then it is accurate to say that the male line is extinct. Any descendants would have to be Serra's, i.e. now female line.

i want this all the be, so badly. more than that other parentage that everyone hypes beyond recognition.

[Fat Mac]

I really like this theory. Not much to say besides that, but I hope it's true.

[Blazfemur]

and it would fulfill that "varys" is, in fact, just another persona, which i thought since i first read that he was a master of disguise.

[Fat Mac]

and it would fulfill that "varys" is, in fact, just another persona, which i thought since i first read that he was a master of disguise.

Clearly his real name is Vaerys ;)

[Blazfemur]

Clearly his real name is Vaerys ;)

lmao. theyve been pronouncing it correct all along, just spelling it wrong

could he have an identity already? on the targ tree, are there a set of twins that have unknown outcome?

[Ramsay's Penguins]

Well if Varys is a eunuch, the male line I suppose is extinct.

[Blazfemur]

Well if Varys is a eunuch, the male line I suppose is extinct.

agreed, a loophole the illyrio's interpretation.

[Fire Eater]

I have considered Varys being a Blackfyre himself as well.

If he was a Blackfyre then he likely had to have known Maelys at some point. When I first thought of how the Blackfyres, Varys and Serra, came to be sold into slavery, I thought it was after the Wo9PK. Now, after hearing about the intra-house conflict, I agree that Varys may have been Daemon IV's son and Serra, his younger sister. Castrating Varys seems like a move to guarantee Daemon IV's line is extinct. Such actions don't surprise me given what we know about Maelys, being a usurper and kinslayer.

However, now I see a kind of Viserys-Dany parallel for Varys and Serra. Only Serra likely didn't have Varys to fill her head with Blackfyre propaganda, the IT that should be there's, how they were wronged by the Targaryens, etc. Given that, I wonder if Serra wanted to go along with their plan which would require her to separate from her only child, Aegon, given her likely lack of desire for her family to get the IT, and the history of repeated failed attempts to do so.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

I'd rather expect Varys/Serra to be Daemon's grandchildren, not his actual children. They are a bit on the young side to be his children.

Maelys killing Daemon has to happen somewhere about 250, but Varys and Illyrio seem to be in their forties, not their fifties. And Aegon with his 18-20 years is a bit young. Serra having her first child in her thirties/early forties? Unlikely.

[BitsOfBrains]

Could be.

It would explain why Varys would go around bald rather than wearing his natural white hair.

I am pretty sure male pattern baldness comes from a certain form of testosterone only produced in the balls.

[Colonel Green]

I am pretty sure male pattern baldness comes from a certain form of testosterone only produced in the balls.

Even if true, I think that's the kind of detail that GRRM would not be aware of.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I'd rather expect Varys/Serra to be Daemon's grandchildren, not his actual children. They are a bit on the young side to be his children.

Maelys killing Daemon has to happen somewhere about 250, but Varys and Illyrio seem to be in their forties, not their fifties. And Aegon with his 18-20 years is a bit young. Serra having her first child in her thirties/early forties? Unlikely.

Sure, they could be grandchildren, I suppose. The operative hinge is that they're Daemon's descendants whose fortunes fell when Maelys killed him.

[Fire Eater]

I'd rather expect Varys/Serra to be Daemon's grandchildren, not his actual children. They are a bit on the young side to be his children.

Maelys killing Daemon has to happen somewhere about 250, but Varys and Illyrio seem to be in their forties, not their fifties. And Aegon with his 18-20 years is a bit young. Serra having her first child in her thirties/early forties? Unlikely.

Or Serra could be his niece.

[Mithras]

There seems to be a resistance to Bittersteel's policies all along. He betrayed Daemon II. Aenys Blackfyre didnot support his strategy. Varys/Illyrio proceed with an entirely different approach which is the most succesful of all.

Maelys and Daemon IV were cousins. They might be grandsons of those unnamed sons of Daemon I after Aenys. I like to think that Maelys was also descended from Calla and Bittersteel through female line. That might explain his montrous size and savage nature.

I believe Varys and Serra are the children of Maegor Targaryen, possibly from different mothers.

I prefer Illyrio being the Blackfyre descendant from the female line perhaps through a daughter of Daemon I.

[Equilibrium]

Blackfyre line is explicitly said to be extinguished in male line after Maelys died.

I'm leaning towards Varys and Serra being children of Maegor son of Aerion, he is from Lys after all.