Callan S. Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Maybe the superheated air is a cognitive illusion. Your brain knows that if people are burning it must be hot so your brain edits in what it expects to find, like color in peripheral vision. This! Why would the air be hot any more than the dragons head is there? "But the guy burns! How could he burn if the air is not super hot?" That's the cognitive sleight of hand. The dragons breath just has to be an illusion convincing enough to make the god world do the next part. It's like if I write 'Chalk and...' or 'Fish and...', your mind maybe fills in cheese or chips. Make the air seem super hot and the god world fills in the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hello World Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 I’ve been thinking about Bakker’s quote saying that the big connection between Yatwer and the Womb-Plague is irony.Yatwer is referred to as the ‘Mother of Wombs’ and the ‘Mother of Birth.’ Compared to the ‘Womb-Plague’ which is also referred to as the ‘Death of Birth.’ That in itself is not ironic, however. What would be extremely ironic is if the ‘Mother of Birth’ came as a result of the ‘Death of Birth.’ Or if the ‘Mother of Wombs’ came as a result of the ‘Womb-Plague.’ There’s this theory that some individuals like Inri Sejenus (or Moënghus) could, upon their death, ‘ascend’ to the Outside and become Gods. Well, what about all the Cûnuroi women who died in a relatively short period of time? Did their souls collectively form the Yatwer entity in the Outside? Perhaps none of them were individually as ‘great’ as Inri Sejenus but there were hundreds of thousands if not millions who died almost together. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unJon Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 This! Why would the air be hot any more than the dragons head is there? "But the guy burns! How could he burn if the air is not super hot?" That's the cognitive sleight of hand. The dragons breath just has to be an illusion convincing enough to make the god world do the next part. It's like if I write 'Chalk and...' or 'Fish and...', your mind maybe fills in cheese or chips. Make the air seem super hot and the god world fills in the rest. What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 As different as chalk and cheese is apparently a thing. http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/chalk-and-cheese.htmlI think it should be updated to chalk and cum for this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callan S. Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 If the chalk be white and the cum be black, I suppose so. Clearly the chalk and cheese utterals would not work magic on your worlds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unJon Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Ive been thinking about Bakkers quote saying that the big connection between Yatwer and the Womb-Plague is irony. Yatwer is referred to as the Mother of Wombs and the Mother of Birth. Compared to the Womb-Plague which is also referred to as the Death of Birth. That in itself is not ironic, however. What would be extremely ironic is if the Mother of Birth came as a result of the Death of Birth. Or if the Mother of Wombs came as a result of the Womb-Plague. Theres this theory that some individuals like Inri Sejenus (or Moënghus) could, upon their death, ascend to the Outside and become Gods. Well, what about all the Cûnuroi women who died in a relatively short period of time? Did their souls collectively form the Yatwer entity in the Outside? Perhaps none of them were individually as great as Inri Sejenus but there were hundreds of thousands if not millions who died almost together. Any thoughts? I think this is a really cool and clever theory but I don't see any irony in it. What's ironic to me is that the No God, the great destroyer and Angel of endless hunger, was created by the Inchies to save their souls! Also ironic is that Yatwer, the goddess of birth, will feast on your tasty soul and torture you for eternity in the afterlife. The problem with "irony" is that it has many meanings and is so often misused. Which I guess is rather ironic in itself. Meta-irony??Bakker may very well mean "ironic" in the Hegelian sense given his philosophical background. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hello World Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 I think this is a really cool and clever theory but I don't see any irony in it. What's ironic to me is that the No God, the great destroyer and Angel of endless hunger, was created by the Inchies to save their souls! Also ironic is that Yatwer, the goddess of birth, will feast on your tasty soul and torture you for eternity in the afterlife.The problem with "irony" is that it has many meanings and is so often misused. Which I guess is rather ironic in itself. Meta-irony??Bakker may very well mean "ironic" in the Hegelian sense given his philosophical background. Well, it’s ironic of you to say this since you don’t know what irony means. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Well, Bakker is Canadian. He could be using Canadian irony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Drizztos Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Given that Kellhus knew Nil'Giccas' fate... What does that mean RE his meeting with the Non-Man Embassy who claim to be sent by NG? Yeah about that, how do people figure that Kellhus is playing the Nonmen just like he plays everyone else? He could have planned for Kosoter + gang to await Acca and make them his most likely company alright, but how would he predict what a Nonman king would do - surely an Erratic is beyond the Logos? It made for a pretty boring character in the first trilogy once you realized that KellhuSue can not go wrong and everything that happens happens according to his plan. I hope at least the Nonmen remain somewhat of a wild-card and mystery even to him for the sake of the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darzin Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 People have speculated Serwa can have nonmen babies, because she has nonmen blood, so he might turn them to him that way. Which I find plausible, but I hope Bakker doesn't go that way, having one if his strong female characters just ending up being pimped by her father, won't help his image any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Seswatha Jordan Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 People have speculated Serwa can have nonmen babies, because she has nonmen blood, so he might turn them to him that way. Which I find plausible, but I hope Bakker doesn't go that way, having one if his strong female characters just ending up being pimped by her father, won't help his image any. I don't know if Serwe is being pimped or not.....but someone is gonna make a Nonman a daddy. I thought the first read of the series, it was where Mimara and Cleric story was going. I mean Serwe is banging her step-brother, she's a bit promiscuous. It COULD be free-will and all. Like, "Damn, that Quya Mage and his Bar of Heaven just get me all worked up!" She don't have to be pimped.....it can still work for the story. Why? Just why?....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madness Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 TSACast gone soundcloud, finally. Link is also updated in my signature. We're trying to clean up the lost TSACast#4 (as SilentRoamer had mic difficulties that caused mildly annoying feedback). We also want to work to continue create content for the community while we become Erratic waiting for more The Second Apocalypse. To that end, I'll pitch my ongoing request again that the Westorsi become involved in the community-content creation. Anyone can donate a "script" for a TSACast (even a loose collection of ideas as a rough rubric/itinerary for a Cast). Anyone can coordinate with myself or Wilshire at Second Apocalypse, if they'd like to take part in a Cast. [The whole initial inspiration for the TSACasts were to feature new members on each episode because the community attracted to Bakker's works is probably more interesting than the books themselves.] Hope the soundcloud hosting faciliates our fandom :). Enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Drizztos Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Continuing here so as not to derail the other topic further. the point by contrast was to draw attention to the moderately risible argument that we need not recognize CuS to be a rapist because his culture doesn't.We certainly can, I'm just saying it's hard - for me anyway - to condemn him for that act alone when everything that happens all around him is just as bad or worse. Indeed, Bakker goes so out of his way to describe how fucked up everything and everyone in Earwa is, it's hard to fault Inchies for wanting to wipe it out, and I think we can agree that Inchies are morally more despicable than Cnaiür. I guess that speaks for Bakker's skill as an author if he can tempt us to root for an alien race of merciless rapists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Ent Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Indeed, Bakker goes so out of his way to describe how fucked up everything and everyone in Earwa is, … I can’t think of anything in Eärwa that is worse than our own world. The slave pits of the Nonmen, maybe? Sranc? (Don’t know if that counts, they’re not native.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sologdin Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 sranc are appliances, no? it'd be like blaming the toaster oven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jurble Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 toaster ovens and men have equal agency, either both deserve blame or neither Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Drizztos Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 I can’t think of anything in Eärwa that is worse than our own world. The slave pits of the Nonmen, maybe? Sranc? (Don’t know if that counts, they’re not native.) Bakker certainly does focus on the negatives to the point that one might think rape and slavery and suffering is all there is the common man can expect from life. What do we read of love? There is Akka's and Esmi's tragic relationship and the Cnaür-Serwe-Kellhus romance triangle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry of the Lawn Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 What about the race of lovers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Drizztos Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Is not native to Earwa. Although, if Inchies wipe out all inhabitants save a few thousand scattered across the entire globe (I think the 144k limit applies globally?), who's left to be loved? Doesn't seem like they really thought this through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scortius the charioteer Posted January 23, 2015 Share Posted January 23, 2015 Bakker certainly does focus on the negatives to the point that one might think rape and slavery and suffering is all there is the common man can expect from life. What do we read of love? There is Akka's and Esmi's tragic relationship and the Cnaür-Serwe-Kellhus romance triangle. It's not a romance triangle. Kellhus is incapable of that, it's more of a possession/manipulation triangle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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