Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted July 19, 2016 Author Share Posted July 19, 2016 12 hours ago, Hos the Hostage said: Great analysis! It's good to have all Cyvasse references in one place. I'm not convinced that black=win every time a color is mentioned, though your argument holds true for the known cases. I mean, it could be simply be a coincidence. Or not. 3/3 is fine, but if we have more cyvasse games, black winning say 6/6 times will be quite repetitive. I took the Myrcella/Trystane game to mean that a Lannister (Tyrion) will beat a Martell (Arianne or Doran) using a dragon. Arianne possibly joining TeamAegon which has GC and the elephants was the main cause for this thought. Only now did I realize Trystane was playing the age-old Dornish strategy. The Winds of Winter could make or break the pattern, I agree. I am hoping that more of such matches will be described in enough detail to either confirm the pattern, or dismiss it. Though, personally, I find it pretty convincing thus far But it's not actually 3/3. You could see it as 4/4. When Doran Martell summons his daughter, he has one goal: get his daughter to convince Myrcella to lie to Balon Swann.. Doran, during the entire time, is sitting on the side of the black cyvasse pieces, and is handling them. At the end of the day, he gets what he wants, when Arianne helps him convince Myrcella tell the lie. Arianne, on the other hand, wants to know who betrayed her plot. While she does gain answers to other questions during the conversation that follows, she leaves the conversation still wondering who betrayed her. So, she did not achieve her goal... In a sense, she "lost". Rather early during the conversation, Arianne sits down across from Doran at the cyvasse table. If the black pieces belong to one player (Doran), than the white should belong to the opposite player, and that is Arianne. So, not a true game as, for example, Tyrion and Aegon play, but the pattern is still there. 12 hours ago, Hos the Hostage said: The quote about Tyrion moving his dragon over the mountains struck me as a foreshadowing for Tyrion causing Dany to conquer the Vale or Casterly Rock. Now, I understand that not everything need be a foreshadowing for something else, but we can speculate some of them could be. I don't know who will conquer the Vale (if the Vale will be conquered), but there's this from TWOIAF: Almost three hundred years have come and gone since that day, however, and the last dragon perished long ago in King's Landing, so the future Lords of the Eyrie may once again sleep secure in the knowledge that their splendid seat remains forever invulnerable and impregnable. Though I'm not sure how much this means, knowing that winter has arrived and that the Eyrie's household has moved from the castle to below. 12 hours ago, Hos the Hostage said: Aegon's best chance conquering Vale is using an alliance, but Littlefinger is not likely to be enthusiastic about these plans. Because unlike Lannisters or Tyrells, Aegon is a formidable opponent (especially with Varys on hsi side) - for both Iron Throne and for Sansa's affections. LF won't want him growing stronger. Aegon will never ally with Lannisters (Tyrion was a special case), so he will have to take Casterly Rock by conquest. Maybe some of them will be ready to bend the knee, but of all the 7 kingdoms, Westerlands have the strongest reason to oppose Aegon. Why not? It would depend on what LF wants in the end, of course (because we still don't know that), but if LF wants to aim higher than control of the Vale through Sansa (like, the IT), than Daenerys beating Aegon won't help his cause... Sansa can't rule anything through Daenerys, but if Sansa becomes Aegon's queen, for example, LF would have much more power and control. That said, I have no idea who Aegon will marry. (or if he will marry). 12 hours ago, Hos the Hostage said: Dany on the other hand, will have much easier time than Aegon conquering the Vale - because she has dragons, and if she has Tyrion, they can make use of the Mountain Clans, too. With Casterly Rock, while Tyrion may be as hated as the Targaryens, he has an intimate knowledge of sewer systems and the 'friendship' of Second Sons who stands to gain a lot if Tyrion becomes Lord of Casterly Rock. Dany could make use of these resources to conquer to 'impregnable' castles, and that is sure to make some impression among Aegon's supporters. If she has the Vale's stores and the Rock's riches, defeating Aegon can be expected to go easier. This whole move, if executed, will be similar to Stannis following Jon's advice to strengthen his forces before engaging the main enemy. I agree that the connection between the Second Sons' scheme to enter Meereen, and Tyrion's knowledge of the drains and sewers of CR make the scenario in which Tyrion takes possession of CR through the sewers with Dany's support a very possible one. Taking CR could become a similar symbol of power as taking SE would be for Aegon.. a show of strength, a declaration of power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted September 23, 2016 Share Posted September 23, 2016 @Rhaenys_Targaryen, What did you makeep of the fact that Myrcella plays on a cyvasse board with three, not just two, colors in The Soiled Knight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted September 23, 2016 Author Share Posted September 23, 2016 38 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: @Rhaenys_Targaryen, What did you makeep of the fact that Myrcella plays on a cyvasse board with three, not just two, colors in The Soiled Knight? Could you perhaps quote the passage? I can't recall any mention of the color of the pieces in that chapter, at the moment., but if you can provide the passage, I'll take a look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted September 23, 2016 Share Posted September 23, 2016 17 minutes ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said: Could you perhaps quote the passage? I can't recall any mention of the color of the pieces in that chapter, at the moment., but if you can provide the passage, I'll take a look. Absolutely (there are the colors of the squares on the board, not the pieces)... Quote He had left her in her chambers, bent over a gaming table opposite Prince Trystane, pushing ornate pieces across squares of jade and carnelian and lapis lazuli. The Soiled Knight, Feast 13 That's green, red, and blue. (Now, where have I seen those colors before? Green Fork, Red Fork, Blue Fork... Kermit Tully, Elmo Tully, Grover Tully...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted September 23, 2016 Author Share Posted September 23, 2016 4 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said: Absolutely (there are the colors of the squares on the board, not the pieces)... The Soiled Knight, Feast 13 That's green, red, and blue. (Now, where have I seen those colors before? Green Fork, Red Fork, Blue Fork... Kermit Tully, Elmo Tully, Grover Tully...) Ah, ok, I had misunderstood you then. I thought you meant three different color for the pieces. I haven't really thought about it before. It does indeed bring the riverlands to mind, and the Trident in particular, I agree with that. And I can't help but connect it to the summary of Myrcella's cyvasse battles against Trystane “I understand you’ve fought some mighty battles too, Your Grace,” said Drey in his most cheerful voice. “It is said you show our brave Prince Trystane no mercy at the cyvasse table.” “He always sets his squares up the same way, with all the mountains in the front and his elephants in the passes,” said Myrcella. “So I send my dragon through to eat his elephants.” That's interesting, too, as dragons call to mind Daenerys (who has three dragons), and elephants the Golden Company, who fight for Aegon. So, perhaps, it is a reference to the upcomming Dance 2.0? Suggesting that there might be a major battle at the riverlands? I suppose, it might help if we learn more about the way the Golden Company behaves in battle ("He always sets his squares up the same way"). Does the Golden Company always array themselves the same way in battle? I guess we shall see.. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted September 23, 2016 Share Posted September 23, 2016 1 hour ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said: Ah, ok, I had misunderstood you then. I thought you meant three different color for the pieces. I haven't really thought about it before. It does indeed bring the riverlands to mind, and the Trident in particular, I agree with that. And I can't help but connect it to the summary of Myrcella's cyvasse battles against Trystane “I understand you’ve fought some mighty battles too, Your Grace,” said Drey in his most cheerful voice. “It is said you show our brave Prince Trystane no mercy at the cyvasse table.” “He always sets his squares up the same way, with all the mountains in the front and his elephants in the passes,” said Myrcella. “So I send my dragon through to eat his elephants.” That's interesting, too, as dragons call to mind Daenerys (who has three dragons), and elephants the Golden Company, who fight for Aegon. So, perhaps, it is a reference to the upcomming Dance 2.0? Suggesting that there might be a major battle at the riverlands? I suppose, it might help if we learn more about the way the Golden Company behaves in battle ("He always sets his squares up the same way"). Does the Golden Company always array themselves the same way in battle? I guess we shall see.. What do you think? I think Aegon, Daenerys, and Jon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaenys_Targaryen Posted September 23, 2016 Author Share Posted September 23, 2016 19 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said: I think Aegon, Daenerys, and Jon. Aegon would be green, Jon blue, Daenerys red? But why Aegon green versus Daenerys's red, instead of the pattern of green versus black (Dance 1.0), or, as per the Blackfyre theory, red (dragon) versus black (dragon)? Any ideas on that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted September 23, 2016 Share Posted September 23, 2016 24 minutes ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said: Aegon would be green, Jon blue, Daenerys red? But why Aegon green versus Daenerys's red, instead of the pattern of green versus black (Dance 1.0), or, as per the Blackfyre theory, red (dragon) versus black (dragon)? Any ideas on that? We see combinations of two and three of those four colors all the time. But we don't see red, black, and green, do we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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