JonSnow4President Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Shiny! Oh, are we doing #TeamObey vs #TeamProtect? Sure...why not #TeamProtect #TeamJustBendTheKneeAlready #TeamProtect has the best cookies, and we throw the best parties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 And that covers the staying there just fine. What I have yet to see is anyone present a remotely plausible argument as to why they would STAY there after finding this out. There is a clear heir in need of protection, with NO Kingsguard presence. Instead of sending at least one person to him, they continue to follow the orders of a dead crown prince, whose order-giving authority extended from a now dead king. Then, whenever Ned learns the complete situation, whatever it is, he considers them shining examples to the rest of the world. A man who has forsworn other vows to protect children. A man who I highly doubt would consider a dead crown prince's orders as overriding leaving a child unprotected against what they know Robert's advisers will do to potential rival claimants. There are very clearly details that GRRM had yet to give us... So if I were you, I would not expect to get that answer anytime soon, but that does not mean that a perfectly logical (but thus far hidden) explanation does not exists... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 That is the only way it makes sense. They stay at the ToJ initially because Rhaegar ordered them to. He's alive, Aerys is alive, and other qualified protection is available. You are saying 3 shining examples of Kings Gaurdom to the world hold a dead man's orders above protecting the king? Barriston certainly held Robert's words in high regard after Roberto had passed - when Cersei said "we have a new king now" & tore up Robert's declaration... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonSnow4President Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 There are very clearly details that GRRM had yet to give us... So if I were you, I would not expect to get that answer anytime soon, but that does not mean that a perfectly logical (but thus far hidden) explanation does not exists... Then it does mean certain people need to stop pretending that #teamprotect isn't currently the most logical answer, instead of relying on the hopeful release of future information to maybe present something to change that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonSnow4President Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Barriston certainly held Robert's words in high regard after Roberto had passed - when Cersei said "we have a new king now" & tore up Robert's declaration... At which point, he sided with the current king immediately. Can't have been that highly regarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 "Those were the King's Words" Had the decision been his (like the three king's guards @ ToJ) it seems he would have enforced the dead kings orders... Yet the decision was not his to make, It was Cersei's & the new King's, so Barriston followed his orders... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj4iy Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Martin has written 5 out of 7 books. He's 70% of the way through his story. Anyone who seriously believes that we don't have most of the answers by now and that we 'need to wait for hidden information' is just deluding themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Anyone who thinks that there will only be 7 books is in denial... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearQueen87 Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Anyone who thinks that there will only be 7 books is in denial... I know there are rumors of an 8th, but I don't think it'll go beyond that, and I'm not even sure we'll get the 8th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 "Those were the King's Words" Had the decision been his (like the three king's guards @ ToJ) it seems he would have enforced the dead kings orders... Yet the decision was not his to make, It was Cersei's & the new King's, so Barriston followed his orders... Perhaps GRRM included this parallel as a hint as to why the 3 king's guards remained at the ToJ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonSnow4President Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 "Those were the King's Words" Had the decision been his (like the three king's guards @ ToJ) it seems he would have enforced the dead kings orders... Yet the decision was not his to make, It was Cersei's & the new King's, so Barriston followed his orders... There's also a disconnect between the situations. Barristan is already protecting the apparent heir to Robert after Robert's death. Robert's orders don't involve leaving the heir to the throne unprotected in a dangerous situation, but rather who rules as regent until Joffrey comes of age. The proposed Rhaegar's orders involves 3 KG guarding Rhaegar's favorite sex buddy even though he's dead, while the heir to the throne flees for his life and is without KG protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 I know there are rumors of an 8th, but I don't think it'll go beyond that, and I'm not even sure we'll get the 8th At least 9-10 books, possibly more... too many loose ends to tie up... - Plus - "A Dream of Spring" sounds too much like Star War's Episode IV "A New Hope" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj4iy Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 I know there are rumors of an 8th, but I don't think it'll go beyond that, and I'm not even sure we'll get the 8th I would say it's denial to actually believe that Martin would ever GET to an 8th book XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 The proposed Rhaegar's orders involves 3 KG guarding Rhaegar's favorite sex buddy even though he's dead, while the heir to the throne flees for his life and is without KG protection. I'm sure you agree that we do not have the full story... GRRM has indicated that we will learn more about the ToJ... Surely he is not going to recover the same stuff, we are likely to get some new information, Right??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonSnow4President Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 I'm sure you agree that we do not have the full story... GRRM has indicated that we will learn more about the ToJ... Surely he is not going to recover the same stuff, we are likely to get some new information, Right??? I think Howland's description of whatever the hell he did to save Ned, as well as the R+L=J reveal certainly constitutes "learning more about the ToJ." If you stop assuming massive implications of the tiniest words in the text, I promise you there are less loose ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Then it does mean certain people need to stop pretending that #teamprotect isn't currently the most logical answer, instead of relying on the hopeful release of future information to maybe present something to change that. So you don't think we will ever get any additional information about the ToJ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 I think Howland's description of whatever the hell he did to save Ned, as well as the R+L=J reveal certainly constitutes "learning more about the ToJ." If you stop assuming massive implications of the tiniest words in the text, I promise you there are less loose ends. Lots of loose ends... Lots of things that are going to go down... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearQueen87 Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 At least 9-10 books, possibly more... too many loose ends to tie up... - Plus - "A Dream of Spring" sounds too much like Star War's Episode IV "A New Hope" You think DOS is actually the start of another series? And I really doubt it'll be 9-10 books. There are loose ends, but nothing states that he's going to answer every single question people have. There's also nothing that states he can't answer all the questions he intends to answer in books 6 and 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj4iy Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 Wait, wait. "A Dream of Spring"...in a series in which bad guys are directly connected to winter, and 'spring' would be reasonably construed as meaning the END of said series because winter would be over... Is now being unreasonably construed as the start point of a SECOND HALF of a 10-part series because "it sounds like Star Wars"? Why use logic and facts when you can make completely random correlations to press your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceFire125 Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 If Ned had at least as pure of the purest blood of the wolf in him, like Cregan Stark, he would've executed Jamie or send him to the wall. And he would risk an open war with Tywin for just that one act. To bring judgment to the murderer of King Aerys II... why?... because... For six days, while the court waited for news of Lord Corlys’s success or failure and the realm trembled at the thought of more war, Lord Cregan Stark held sway at court. This came to be known as the Hour of the Wolf.Yet in one thing, Lord Stark would not be dissuaded: the betrayers and poisoners of King Aegon II must pay the price. To kill a cruel and unjust king in lawful battle was one thing. But foul murder, and the use of poison, was a betrayal against the very gods who had anointed him. Cregan had twenty-two men arrested in Aegon III’s name—among them Larys Clubfoot and Corlys Velaryon. Cowed, the young Aegon III—who was eleven at the time—agreed to make Lord Stark his Hand.Cregan Stark served in that office for a single day, presiding over the trials and executions. Hind sight is 20/20, but I wished that Lord Eddard Stark would've demanded another 'Hour of the Wolf', to bring to justice all the Lannisters that were involved in many foul murders that day. But that is not the story that GRRM wanted to portray, he needed Ned to be that bearer of burden, to raise a child as his own in the act to protect him from a friend who was still hell bent in killing dragonspawns where ever they are, let alone, the true heir to the throne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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