Mossovy, CotF?

[LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse]

Beyond N’ghai are the forests of Mossovy, a cold dark land of shapechangers and demon hunters. Beyond Mossovy …

Are these Skinchangers? could Mossovy be another forest were Cotf dwell? In the Lands of Ice and fire the forest is shown with the same colour as the kingdom of the Ifeqevron and the northern westeros´s forests. Now that we know that (probably) CotF lived in the kingdom of the Ifeqevron, that means they were also in Essos at some point.

Skinchangers were sometimes called shapechangers:

“Warg,” said Jojen Reed.

Bran looked at him, his eyes wide. “What?”

“Warg. Shapechanger. Beastling. That is what they will call you, if they should ever hear of your wolf dreams.”

The names made him afraid again. “Who will call me?”

“Your own folk. In fear. Some will hate you if they know what you are. Some will even try to kill you.”

Old Nan told scary stories of beastlings and shapechangers sometimes. In the stories they were always evil. “I’m not like that,” Bran said. “I’m not. It’s only dreams.”

One of the Freys stepped forward, a knight long and lean of limb, clean-shaved but for a grey mustache as thin as a Myrish stiletto. “The Red Wedding was the Young Wolf’s work. He changed into a beast before our eyes and tore out the throat of my cousin Jinglebell, a harmless simpleton. He would have slain my lord father too, if Ser Wendel had not put himself in the way.”

Demon hunters? what exacly were they hunting? Notice that Mossovy limits also with the Grey Waste.

Crackpot: the Thousand Islands were broken by a hammer of waters. The Children fought a war against deep ones or their halflings...

Still farther east lie the so-called Thousand Islands (Ibbenese chartmakers tell us that there are in truth fewer than three hundred), a sea-girt scatter of bleak windswept rocks believed by some to be the last remnants of a drowned kingdom whose towns and towers were submerged beneath the rising seas many thousands of years ago

the thousand islanders are now afraid of the sea, and remain isolated because of that single terrifying event.

[Skinner]

"Crackpot: the Thousand Islands were broken by a hammer of waters. The Children fought a war against deep ones."

Now this has some merit. More CotF? I dunno, seems a bit much...

[aryagonnakill#2]

I like it, but I think they fought a war with the merlings/ squishers. I'm inclined to think the Old ones and Deep ones fought each other.

[Mrs.Grumpy]

I imagine shapechangers as like faceless men. The shapechangers that are mentioned in Westeros are skinchangers...but I think the ones in Asshai and Mossovy are like faceless men.

[Reginald blackfield]

Shapechangers and skinchangers likely are not the same thing otherwise they would have called them skinchangers not shapechangers.

[LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse]

"Crackpot: the Thousand Islands were broken by a hammer of waters. The Children fought a war against deep ones."

Now this has some merit. More CotF? I dunno, seems a bit much...

Why not? At some point the CotF were present in all the forests of westeros.. if they had presence in Essos as well one would imagine they also dwelled in all deep and dark forests of that continent..

I like it, but I think they fought a war with the merlings/ squishers. I'm inclined to think the Old ones and Deep ones fought each other.

i thought Merlings and Squishers were the Deep Ones.

I agree with the Old Ones of Leng. They are IMO what remains of the Mazemakeers.. ANd the Mazemakers of lorath were extinguished by the Deep ones..

[LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse]

Shapechangers and skinchangers likely are not the same thing otherwise they would have called them skinchangers not shapechangers.

the point being that sometimes the terms can be used interchangeably, as the example above.

also ignorants about warging mysteries think skinchangers do change their shape..

[TheSovereignGrave]

Why not? At some point the CotF were present in all the forests of westeros.. if they had presence in Essos as well one would imagine they also dwelled in all deep and dark forests of that continent..

i thought Merlings and Squishers were the Deep Ones.

I agree with the Old Ones of Leng. They are IMO what remains of the Mazemakeers.. ANd the Mazemakers of lorath were extinguished by the Deep ones..

I don't think the Hammer of Waters would be much of a help against the Deep Ones. It wouldn't drown them since they live in the seas, and in the end you just get more ocean (which is where the Deep Ones dwell to begin with).

Also, I don't think the Old Ones are Mazemakers. Primarily because I don't think the Mazemakers were a magical race at all; I think they were just an exceptionally tall race of men like the Lengii. Though the fact that Mazemakers and Lengii are both exceptionally tall and have subterranean ruins in interesting. Maybe the Lengii are descendants of Mazemakers in Leng, and there were once Old Ones in Lorath that the Mazemakers worshiped that were killed/driven off by the Deep Ones.

[Archmaester Drew]

I think this is quite possible.

Why not? At some point the CotF were present in all the forests of westeros.. if they had presence in Essos as well one would imagine they also dwelled in all deep and dark forests of that continent..

i thought Merlings and Squishers were the Deep Ones.

I agree with the Old Ones of Leng. They are IMO what remains of the Mazemakeers.. ANd the Mazemakers of lorath were extinguished by the Deep ones..

This is my opinion as well.

I'm also inclined to believe that the Children created the Iron Islands when they brought down the hammer of waters on the Neck... :)

[TheSovereignGrave]

I'm also inclined to believe that the Children created the Iron Islands when they brought down the hammer of waters on the Neck... :)

I don't think so, since if I remember correctly the Neck doesn't border the western coast. It's just along the Eastern coast, with there being a forest to the West. They also seem a bit too far South for that, and if such a massive chunk of ground was lost by the second Hammer of Waters I think we'd know about it.

[Archmaester Drew]

I don't think so, since if I remember correctly the Neck doesn't border the western coast. It's just along the Eastern coast, with there being a forest to the West. They also seem a bit too far South for that, and if such a massive chunk of ground was lost by the second Hammer of Waters I think we'd know about it.

There is marshland down to Oldstones and the Iron Islands are not that far. I suspect the hammer effected a larger area that the Neck proper. The areas with higher ground may have shed more of the water and in the thousands of years since forests have grown along the highground west of the Neck. There are many hints of the Iron Islands being hammered as well (The Grey King) and Nagga's bones are likely weirwoods. :)

[TheSovereignGrave]

There is marshland down to Oldstones and the Iron Islands are not that far. I suspect the hammer effected a larger area that the Neck proper. The areas with higher ground may have shed more of the water and in the thousands of years since forests have grown along the highground west of the Neck. There are many hints of the Iron Islands being hammered as well (The Grey King) and Nagga's bones are likely weirwoods. :)

I thought that the whole thing about the Nagga's bones being weirdwoods was just a theory, and not an exceptionally widely accepted one at that.

And also, wouldn't the First Men have likely already been there if they weren't islands previously? But as far as we know the first First Men to arrive sailed there.

[Archmaester Drew]

I thought that the whole thing about the Nagga's bones being weirdwoods was just a theory, and not an exceptionally widely accepted one at that.

And also, wouldn't the First Men have likely already been there if they weren't islands previously? But as far as we know the first First Men to arrive sailed there.

Have a look at this thread:

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/116612-theory-the-storm-god-represents-the-cotf-fixed-quoting-issues/?hl=%20nagga#39;s bones

:)

[TheSovereignGrave]

Have a look at this thread:

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/116612-theory-the-storm-god-represents-the-cotf-fixed-quoting-issues/?hl=%20nagga#39;s bones

:)

Well then, that actually makes quite a lot of sense.

[Archmaester Drew]

Well then, that actually makes quite a lot of sense.

:cheers:

[The Dragon Demands]

I got the strong impression that Mossovy has skinchangers who can control animals, like Bran and the wildlings.

[LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse]

I don't think the Hammer of Waters would be much of a help against the Deep Ones. It wouldn't drown them since they live in the seas, and in the end you just get more ocean (which is where the Deep Ones dwell to begin with).

Also, I don't think the Old Ones are Mazemakers. Primarily because I don't think the Mazemakers were a magical race at all; I think they were just an exceptionally tall race of men like the Lengii. Though the fact that Mazemakers and Lengii are both exceptionally tall and have subterranean ruins in interesting. Maybe the Lengii are descendants of Mazemakers in Leng, and there were once Old Ones in Lorath that the Mazemakers worshiped that were killed/driven off by the Deep Ones.

a) true... i guess i was thinking more in terms of making them loose a foothold from where they could reave the coasts of Mossovy.. The Deep ones were known to live in many islands around the world.

b) Why wouldn´t they be magical?

The Lengii have golden eyes and are said to be the Tallest men of the world. The subterranean ruins, are huge and described as labyrinth..

So yes, i was thinking of the Lengii being descendants.. half breed of Mazemakeers and humans.. while the Old Ones, the remaining Mazemakers, that live in those gigantic subterranean mazes under Leng

[LordToo-Fat-to-Sit-a-Horse]

I think this is quite possible.

This is my opinion as well.

I'm also inclined to believe that the Children created the Iron Islands when they brought down the hammer of waters on the Neck... :)

:agree:

There is actually quite some evidence about that.

In fact, i think Bloodraven, or Bran will finish the job at some point.

[TheSovereignGrave]

a) true... i guess i was thinking more in terms of making them loose a foothold from where they could reave the coasts of Mossovy.. The Deep ones were known to live in many islands around the world.

B) Why wouldn´t they be magical?

The Lengii have golden eyes and are said to be the Tallest men of the world. The subterranean ruins, are huge and described as labyrinth..

So yes, i was thinking of the Lengii being descendants.. half breed of Mazemakeers and humans.. while the Old Ones, the remaining Mazemakers, that live in those gigantic subterranean mazes under Leng

I don't think the Deep Ones would need a base of operations on land to raid the coast of Mossovy. :lol:

Well we don't really have anything that points to the mazemakers being magical. They're described as being really big. That's the only abnormal thing we know about them, and the Lengii are really big too. Also, the golden eyes don't necessarily mean anything; there are people in real life with golden eyes. I mean, people can have their own theories but I just believe that the mazemakers were simply men.

[Reginald blackfield]

I have always seen more of a connection between the CotF and the Ifequevron, both are described as small and diminutive and inhabit forests. More importantly on his way back from the thousand islands, Corlys Velaryon landed in the Kingdom of the Ifequevron and noted CARVED TREES, Haunted grottos and strange silences. Could these carved trees infact be Weirwoods?

I also believe that the iron islands were once part of the Westerosi mainland, as the first men were not a seafaring people.