The Parallel Journey of Daenerys Targaryen & ... Part I

[Liz Stark-Targaryen]

Beautifully said, Liz!

I'm going to touch on a just a little something in passing but you hit all nails on their heads.

The idea of home as a place is certainly true for both Dany and Arya, but the one thing that does further separate them is that Winterfell literally exists. The house with the red door did probably exist at one point (freaking lemon tree and all) but it has come to be much more symbolic and magical for Dany, much like the dragons that you pointed out "A dragon is a creature of magic. A creature that shouldn't exist, an unnatural creature."

Dany's house with the red door is a lot like that. Arya can always return to an actual place (well, so long as WF is standing I suppose) but we don't know if Dany can ever find that house with the red door ever again, which is why she starts thinking about every house being her house with the red door. You mentioned the King's Landing quote from her "home" conversation with Jorah. I'll mention two more: in her final POV of ASOS, while in Meereen, she starts looking for that house with the red door and can't find it there either, but the important part is the looking. And second, in a dream she has in ADWD where she dreams of a simple life. It's not even that specific Braavosi house with the red door she's dreaming of; it's just a home where she feels safe and warm. For Dany, she's going to have to make her own home and readjust her perceived reality of what home means.

I said this in our Dany Re-read so I'll just quote myself a bit: At the end of the day, a house is just a structure, red door or not. What makes a house a home are the memories you make and the feelings you associate with that house. That's why the red door is so important: the emotions it and the memories of it elicit for Dany, namely being safe and at peace. The Dothraki sea has no red doors (or doors for that matter) yet in GOT Dany III, we have her standing in the Sea, dirty and oiled and barefoot...and at peace. Vaes Tolloro had no red doors, yet Dany and her people began to create a life there, complete with safety and sweet tasting fruits (the peach) that Dany can savor and enjoy. They don't just rest there, they start to live. It's the city of bones, but from it comes life and renewal--and you see this with the work the khalasar puts into making the city livable again and on a more personal note, the way Dany starts to heal those around her, like tending to Jorah's wounds herself.

And it's when you bring this up that I do start to feel a little something for Viserys. He was mad and crazed and cruel, but he did have a burden of not only an entire family name on his shoulders, but an entire race. The dragon lords of Valyria on resting on him, like they now rest on Dany.

Love everything you've said here, BQ, drawing contrasts between Arya's real and tangible Winterfell and Dany's symbolic house with the red door. Thanks for reminding me that Dany began looking for that house in Meereen!

And yes, my impulse was to dislike Viserys as well, because I'm totally into Dany's POV. But by the end, and in retrospect, I pitied him in the Tolkienian sense. Just as pity so famously stayed Bilbo's hand on Middle-earth, pity was part of the reason why Dany's hand was stayed in Vaes Dothrak.

Yes, there were pragmatic reasons why she couldn't and didn't intervene. But I think she understood that her brother was miserable and descending to madness. And who wouldn't be, remembering the times before the fall of House Targaryen? If he isn't wandering the seven Hells, I believe he's reunited with Rhaella and Rhaegar.

For all Dany's longing for her family, it was only when she lost everything that she became who she was meant to be. Her dragons were born on that pyre, but Dany herself was reborn.

[Ser Creighton]

I understand the critique of Mladen's post but I don't think it is fair to be honest. From his perspective what he says is true. Like I couldn't tell him how much hate or abuse is thrown at Cat or Sansa because I am not on those threads as often as him. Though you will find me on many Dany bashing threads and I probably frequent them more than he does and less that others.

But as of the first of the year, I have see no less than 4-5 Dany bashing threads and it's been 7 days. I just don's see that level with other characters. I do think the sexism has died down some on all the female characters thanks to some posters who just won;t put up with it.

I think what bothers me about the Dany bashing threads is they are just that, it's not a debate or someone trying to discuss the character they are pure hate threads started by Troll level bias against a character. I am sorry but time and again they are nothing but fallacious arguments with with posters deliberatly going to extremes of broken logic, taking the text out of contact, and a disturbing level of head canon. One thread that is

\not even two days old has Dany as a malicious slaver, who is selling slaves to fund her war against Westeros, she does not have dragons, and Braavos hates her for disrupting the slave trade. And the level of excitment these posters get when they take a unsupported quote as far out of context as they can is disturbing. Nobody who has read the books can take something that far out of context.

I also remember all the threads that pop up attempting to justify slavery. Then those posters complain when you point out they are justifying slavery. "I am not justifying slavery but the economy needs it so Dany should leave them alone." "Slavers are not doing anything wrong from there perspective." Which pisses me off because at no time in history have slavers actually not know it was wrong. They didn't do it because they thought it was ok, or not bad. They wouldn;t reat there dogs like that, let alone their family. Slavers are slavers because it is easy money, they have the power, and they are willing to abuse people. They do it because they can. Not because they are morally confused. Morals are not a problem for slavers, they abuse the shit out them at pace few demons can match. You know how many times people have quoted Xaro' little speech and tried to use that as justification. Because he is an unbiased character with no hand in the slave trade.

Or the 163, how come the 163 is always about the slavers and how cruel she was to them? Why is it never about the 163 children the Masters butchered? Yeah she was cruel to them, there were extenuating circumstances. If you don't want someone to be mean to you or punish you, then being a slaver in an emancipation war who butchers babies and children, who rapes just about anything that moves, who tortures and punishes those who can't defend themselves is probably not the line of work you want to be in. They make sport out of dipping children in different substances and feeding them to bears. How many were forced into the fighting pits? How many have been raped, murdered, abused tortured, and forced to serve these monsters?

There is no argument for them, fuck there economy, fuck there culture, fuck them! How many fans would be up in arms if Jon was kidnapped, beaten, raped, had his manhood cut off, and was forced to kill Ghost and a baby just because some ass clown monster thought it would be funny? What if Sansa was one of the children who was crucified? Fuck people want the Boltons and Freys massacred, but the slavers well you know it's a cultural difference. Dany was cruel to them. Well the Boltons have been flaying people for thousands of years so it's ok, what Ramsey did was ok because you know it was how he was raised. Dany lives in the fucking land of Ramsey some of them make him look like an amature. Jon should ride down to Winterfell and kill the Boltons cause he got a mean letter. You know what Dany's letter looked like? 163 innocent babies that were butchered as a challange to her, where were all there little hands pointing? To Meereen.

"But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and provide new Guards for their future security."

Someone wants to debate weather she should of stoped in Meereen, or some of her choices like marrying a slaver, becoming to lax on slavers in order to find comprimise, allowing slavery outside her walls, those discussions I understand. But they are hardly ever discussed it's always some head canon biased extreme that goes well passed offensive and boarders on disgusting.

And Mladen this not pointed at you just ot be clear, I am only venting my frustration. I don't really care who people think is Azor or the Prince because we all have our opinions. But there are certain things not up for debate, it's not PC, it's not tact, it's fucking morality, and slavery is one of those things, it has zero excuses that's why it is illegal in every country in the world. It is as malicious an abuse of power as there is in the history of the world.

I even think Jorah was wrong when he told her to leave Meereen be.

"The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Mother of Dragons Do Nothing"

I think when the law of unintended consequences has it's final say on Slavers Bay, you will see the biggest boon in the history of the books. It has not been easy there, and none of the choices have been good ones, but slavery can be broken. The uprising is coming, Volantis will be free. Just like you get the feeling Ramsey, or Littlefinger or Roose is just not going to get to walk away from this story, from there atrocities, neither will the slavers.

I won't debate you that Sansa gets unfair treatment by some Fans and Cat as well, but nobody is even in Danys ballpark on this forum. It's pretty much everyday and the debates are pretty much nothing but offensive and stupid. I have even seen people try to use you in those debates and you did not want any of that stupidity.

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

BQ, I loved your essay :bowdown:

I especially liked the parts about both girls forming their own packs due to the loss of their families.

I also like the inverse "big brothers" for both girls, one is under the "big brother bully" trope and the other is the "big brother mentor" trope.

I also agree with Ellfoy that this re-read may end up showing many similarities between Dany and the Stark children, then one would expect.

I've often said in other threads that with the Starks assumed dead at the moment and Winterfell taken from them, that Dany one of the characters that sympathizes for the disadvantaged the most may compare the situation of her family being killed during the sack of KL, and her family also losing their home, with the Stark family being killed and Winterfell being taken from them.

Looking forward to the next one :)

[Ellfoy]

Can we drop the Dany hate debate please ? Even if it is to complain about Dany hate. There is enough of that in the main forum. This a no Dany hate thread, so no need to do pro-Dany verse.

@ Queen Alysanne, :cheers:

[MoIaF]

Can we drop the Dany hate debate please ? Even if it is to complain about Dany hate. There is enough of that in the main forum. This a no Dany hate thread, so no need to do pro-Dany verse.

@ Queen Alysanne, :cheers:

It's hard being a Dany fan around these parts because her threads so easily devolve. However, you are correct, we aren't here to bitch and moan, we are here to discuss parallels.

Let's bring it back to the parallel journey of Dany and Arya.

[MoIaF]

Can we drop the Dany hate debate please ? Even if it is to complain about Dany hate. There is enough of that in the main forum. This a no Dany hate thread, so no need to do pro-Dany verse.

@ Queen Alysanne, :cheers:

It's hard being a Dany fan around these parts because her threads so easily devolve. However, you are correct, we aren't here to bitch and moan, we are here to discuss parallels.

Let's bring it back to the parallel journey of Dany and Arya.

[BearQueen87]

BQ, I loved your essay :bowdown:

I especially liked the parts about both girls forming their own packs due to the loss of their families.

I also like the inverse "big brothers" for both girls, one is under the "big brother bully" trope and the other is the "big brother mentor" trope.

I also agree with Ellfoy that this re-read may end up showing many similarities between Dany and the Stark children, then one would expect.

I've often said in other threads that with the Starks assumed dead at the moment and Winterfell taken from them, that Dany one of the characters that sympathizes for the disadvantaged the most may compare the situation of her family being killed during the sack of KL, and her family also losing their home, with the Stark family being killed and Winterfell being taken from them.

Looking forward to the next one :)

Thanks QA!

i agree that this is going to be a great way to see parallels between Starks and Targs, two families that are often set up as antagonistic toward each other. They have more in common than is sometimes portrayed.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

Can we drop the Dany hate debate please ? Even if it is to complain about Dany hate. There is enough of that in the main forum. This a no Dany hate thread, so no need to do pro-Dany verse.

@ Queen Alysanne, :cheers:

The Forum we are on has become completely intertwined with all our discussions about the books, it is the nature of the beast. There is no way around it. I think there are plenty of threads where statements like this should be made in defense of Dany. And I totally agree that it should definitely not be the main focus of this thread, but it's bound to happen, as we have a hardcore group here of people who are totally ambushed in other threads and set upon by a lot of posters almost constantly in defense of our girl. I think allowances must be made if we want to vent a little about how stupid some of it is. Plus it gives us all a chance to figure out the best counter-arguments and to organize our defenses as we are still very much the minority.

[MoIaF]

Thanks QA!

i agree that this is going to be a great way to see parallels between Starks and Targs, two families that are often set up as antagonistic toward each other. They have more in common than is sometimes portrayed.

Indeed.

It always seemed to me that the parallels GRRM was drawing between the Starks (and Jon) were very important in understanding how these characters will react to one another.

For example, I can't imagine any of the Stark kids having any reservations towards Dany because they don't even know her. They don't think of her or have options about her. On the other hand, Dany's opinions and thoughts about the "Stark" i.e. Ned are well known, however, her thoughts on his children are none exciting. She doesn't know them or think of them.

Some, thus expect Dany to react negatively towards his children, which she might. But knowing Dany the person as we do she's also much more likely to sympathize with them and understand their plight much better than anyone else could having been through it herself. We also know her affinity towards children and those who are mistreated by the world.

What would she think of Arya when they first meet (I have no doubt they'll be meeting soon, most likely in Essos)? She will not meet Arya Stark, she will meet whichever version Arya presents to her I believe. I'm sure Dany will sympathize with her because she can't help herself, she's a sucker for the downtrodden. But the question is, if and when Dany finds out who Arya truly is what will her reaction be then? Will she cast out a child abandoned by the world because of her last name?Or will she realize there is a difference between those who fought the war and their children?

I find it interesting to think of these hypothetical.

[Ser Cold Fingers]

I have to say...This thread (along with the Bran Re-Read) has to be the most courteous and respectful thread in the entire forum! While there are some difference of opinions, nothing turns ugly!

And y'all cover everything I have to add, well before I have the opportunity to add it (since I only check in every so often).

Keep up the great work! All of you! And I'll continue to check in and be amazed! :D

[MoIaF]

I have to say...This thread (along with the Bran Re-Read) has to be the most courteous and respectful thread in the entire forum! While there are some difference of opinions, nothing turns ugly!

And y'all cover everything I have to add, well before I have the opportunity to add it (since I only check in every so often).

Keep up the great work! All of you! And I'll continue to check in and be amazed! :D

Thank you very much!

We at #teamkhaleesi try to be big boys and girls, especially in these kids of threads where we are really trying to learn something, instead of trying to be right.

[Liz Stark-Targaryen]

Can I just say that I adore Dany fans? #TeamKhaleesi is an amazing team to be on...

Indeed.

It always seemed to me that the parallels GRRM was drawing between the Starks (and Jon) were very important in understanding how these characters will react to one another.

For example, I can't imagine any of the Stark kids having any reservations towards Dany because they don't even know her. They don't think of her or have options about her. On the other hand, Dany's opinions and thoughts about the "Stark" i.e. Ned are well known, however, her thoughts on his children are none exciting. She doesn't know them or think of them.

Some, thus expect Dany to react negatively towards his children, which she might. But knowing Dany the person as we do she's also much more likely to sympathize with them and understand their plight much better than anyone else could having been through it herself. We also know her affinity towards children and those who are mistreated by the world.

What would she think of Arya when they first meet (I have no doubt they'll be meeting soon, most likely in Essos)? She will not meet Arya Stark, she will meet whichever version Arya presents to her I believe. I'm sure Dany will sympathize with her because she can't help herself, she's a sucker for the downtrodden. But the question is, if and when Dany finds out who Arya truly is what will her reaction be then? Will she cast out a child abandoned by the world because of her last name?Or will she realize there is a difference between those who fought the war and their children?

I find it interesting to think of these hypothetical.

The thing that strikes me about Dany is that she literally has no one. Jon is almost certainly her nephew, and his surviving half-siblings cousins are his family.

So through Jon, although Dany doesn't know it, she'd have distant relations by marriage. And like Jon, Sansa, Arya, Bran, and Rickon, she'd know the pain of being orphaned, exiled, running for one's life, being under threat of assassination.

Sure, GRRM could have a gigantic fire vs. ice battle set up with Starks on one side and Dany + dragons on the other. But I think it's more likely that she'd finally run into people who understood her experiences. I think it's the same with the link between Dany and her handmaid Missandei (little girl in the books, female friend on the show) -- in a sense, Dany was sold into marriage as much as Missandei was sold into slavery. Of course the two are NOT equivalent, but there's that connection.

Dany and all of the Stark kids know what it feels like to be coerced. Specific to BQ's excellent essay this week, I've seen the case being made that Arya was in effect a slave at Harrenhal. While it wasn't the permanent chattel slavery of Slaver's Bay, Dany very well could have ended up in the same position.

Although I know it won't happen, I'd love if Arya (and Tyrion, who irritates most on these boards) would join Dany's entourage as she heads West toward Westeros. After all, having a FM as a member of the Queensguard couldn't hurt...

[Mladen]

How many Azor Ahai threads are there every month? What are they all boil down to, that Jon is AAR so Dany just can't be it. What about the three head of the dragons? How many times I've seen people argue that it means one person and that person is Jon. How does that make any sense whatsoever? Dany is the Mother of Dragon, if it just meant one person it would be her. These are just example but there are so many of them and a lot of them quite frankly defy logic.

I think we tend to read sometimes too much into these things. For a long time, I believed that Dany isn't AAR solely because evidence are too overwhelming that it can be true. Than I realized that whole AAR thing is religious dogma and approached it that way. Three heads meaning one person isn't that crazy or misogynist, just how some people interpret it. If person in question argued the same thing for Dany, there would be even evidence for that. It is not about Jon v Dany, but about interpretation that there is one dragon in that sigil, not three, hence the interpretation. A lot of things I hear defy logic from both sides. So, before we all throw rocks at each other, we should always try to think that some things are not as we see them.

When I started here, (in 2011) I did notice some abuse of Dany along the lines that she was a "slut", "whore", "skank" as well as criticising her sex life in pretty crude terms. My impression is that is less common now. In any case, serious critics of her don't use such terms, and don't focus much on her sex life, which is not relevant to her leadership skills.

And those were indeed horrible and repugnant slurs. I laugh when I see that some of Dany "criticism" is who she sleeps with, but I also laugh when some genuine criticism is handled with "you are all misogynist pigs" lines... And truth be told, I can't even count how many Dany threads contained that word. We practically wore it off.

No one is ever going to say: "I hate Dany because she's a woman". No one says "I hate Catelyn because she's a woman" or "I hate Sansa because she's a woman" or "I hate [insert some other female character] because she's a woman".

LOL, I know that. No need to explain me something so basic.

People usually aren't aware of their own prejudices, and even if they were, they wouldn't admit them. It's only when you notice that 1) their arguments are inherently sexist, or 2) they tend to judge female characters very differently and much more harshly for some things than the male characters who do very similar things or have very similar traits. Examples of 1) would be things like, how dare Sansa refuse to have sex with Tyrion, or how dare Dany reject this or that dude and prefer this or that dude; or even more obviously, calling females sluts and whores etc; examples of 2) include all the times when Dany is called mad or evil or "entitled" (an extremely silly criticism against an individual member of the noble class in a world like Westeros where all nobility is "entitled") for the behaviors or traits those same fans don't mind or even like in Stannis. The irony of Stannis fans ranting against Dany for being harsh against her enemies and seeing things in black-and-white terms, or calling her "entitled" for thinking she deserves the Iron Throne, is something that never ceases to amuse me. You could also include all the times female characters like Dany or Sansa are called "shallow" for being drawn to physically attractive men or not being attracted to (specific) ugly men (even if they have few or no other reasons to want to be in a relationship with them anyway), as opposed to all the male characters who are rarely ever criticized for the same thing.

I agree with you. However, we should know when the criticism is based on prejudices and when it is simply that - criticism. When I was asked why I don't talk about "entitlement of male characters" in a Dany thread, I simply answered "well, open a thread and let we talk about it" It is that simple for me. I do see that Dany is being judged more harshly than some characters, but that is more because she is one of the heroes, and the standards are a bit higher. Truth be told, I am lucky to see the Daario threads gone... They were repugnant.

Of course, gender is not the only way people can be prejudiced: there's also, for instance, a phenomenon of fans hating the characters who are seen as heroic or good for having flaws, while adoring villainous characters who have similar flaws only up to 11th; like one fan on this forum who had a huge rant once about how much he/she hated Catelyn for her attitude towards Jon. Said poster is a big fan of Cersei! Apparently, being cold to your husband's bastard is much worse than having all your husband's bastard children murdered.

LOL... Yeah... I adore the gem of a Jon fan who once said that "Robert should have killed all the Targ children, without exception"

FWIW, I think they are both still victims; Dany might be less of a victim of hunger, poverty, abuse ect. But she is still an emotional mess, someone who believes no one can ever love her, the real her. That's pretty sympathetic to me.

I sympathize with her although I don't see her as a victim. Simply, I feel Dany has so many Cat moments, where every scenario is so terrible that she only has to choose between two bads and is judged for that. I sympathize with her but I don't give her free pass for some things. At the end, I have same position for Jon, Stannis, Arya etc.

[Ellfoy]

I have to say...This thread (along with the Bran Re-Read) has to be the most courteous and respectful thread in the entire forum! While there are some difference of opinions, nothing turns ugly!

And y'all cover everything I have to add, well before I have the opportunity to add it (since I only check in every so often).

Keep up the great work! All of you! And I'll continue to check in and be amazed! :D

This is a common thing to all re-read thread I think. I never came accross a re-read thread which wasn't courteous. (Well maybe the old ones were not, I wasn't around so I don't know). So, when one is tired of the stupid feuds among the fans but still want to discuss the books, one comes to the re-read section instead.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

I have to say...This thread (along with the Bran Re-Read) has to be the most courteous and respectful thread in the entire forum! While there are some difference of opinions, nothing turns ugly!

And y'all cover everything I have to add, well before I have the opportunity to add it (since I only check in every so often).

Keep up the great work! All of you! And I'll continue to check in and be amazed! :D

Thx Doll! I think we have done a fantastic job too!!! :)

[Liz Stark-Targaryen]

This is a common thing to all re-read thread I think. I never came accross a re-read thread which wasn't courteous. (Well maybe the old ones were not, I wasn't around so I don't know). So, when one is tired of the stupid feuds among the fans but still want to discuss the books, one comes to the re-read section instead.

Great tip. I'm relatively new here, and think I'll take this advice, especially for Dany and Arya. I'll likely stay here throughout this re-read, join any of Arya's, and stay in the R+L thread and TWOIAF boards. The general free-for-all is starting to wear me down.

(I also love Sansa, but I read ASOIAF different than many of her fans here, so I largely lurk on her threads.)

[BearQueen87]

Can I just say that I adore Dany fans? #TeamKhaleesi is an amazing team to be on...

The thing that strikes me about Dany is that she literally has no one.

#TeamKhaleesi4Life

My bear protests your point. He protests it while crying softly in a corner. My poor bear.

(but it is a good point especially from her POV where she views herself as almost 100% insular and cut off)

I sympathize with her although I don't see her as a victim. Simply, I feel Dany has so many Cat moments, where every scenario is so terrible that she only has to choose between two bads and is judged for that. I sympathize with her but I don't give her free pass for some things. At the end, I have same position for Jon, Stannis, Arya etc.

And I think that it is okay. For me it's when Dany get singled out either as ultimate good or ultimate evil, to play fair to both sides. And that's really why I was in favor of this particular re-read as it will give us all a chance to see how alike she might be to other characters.

[Liz Stark-Targaryen]

#TeamKhaleesi4Life

My bear protests your point. He protests it while crying softly in a corner. My poor bear.

(but it is a good point especially from her POV where she views herself as almost 100% insular and cut off)

Ah, see, I don't think Dany appreciates Jorah at his full worth! Things went South for her once he left that's for sure...

[Hrafntýr]

What a great idea for a thread! Thank you to those of you who dreamed this up and have taken on the work of writing essays! And great kick-off, BearQueen!

Liz Stark-Targaryen, I found your post exploring Dany's identification as a dragon, and the last dragon, to be quite striking and thought-provoking, especially in how this identification works to heighten Dany's sense of isolation; it was also very moving and sad :crying: . And I do think that the species with which each of our young women is identified really affects both the characters' self-perceptions, and readers' perceptions of the characters. For all that wolves can be threatening (hello, Nymeria, with your super-pack!), we recognize ourselves as humans in wolves, who are highly social animals who organize themselves hierarchically even as they work cooperatively to achieve their survival; as mammals, they nurture their young. When Arya says she is a wolf, even though we know that that can mean something fierce, it's still identifiably familiar. Dragons, not so much. I think that when Dany says "I am a dragon" it is more dehumanizing than when Arya identifies as a wolf. It would be very interesting to see precisely what circumstances provoke Daenerys and Arya to assume the identity of their animal alters, and whether the identification produces similar aims in them.

[BearQueen87]

What a great idea for a thread! Thank you to those of you who dreamed this up and have taken on the work of writing essays! And great kick-off, BearQueen!

Liz Stark-Targaryen, I found your post exploring Dany's identification as a dragon, and the last dragon, to be quite striking and thought-provoking, especially in how this identification works to heighten Dany's sense of isolation; it was also very moving and sad :crying: . And I do think that the species with which each of our young women is identified really affects both the characters' self-perceptions, and readers' perceptions of the characters. For all that wolves can be threatening (hello, Nymeria, with your super-pack!), we recognize ourselves as humans in wolves, who are highly social animals who organize themselves hierarchically even as they work cooperatively to achieve their survival; as mammals, they nurture their young. When Arya says she is a wolf, even though we know that that can mean something fierce, it's still identifiably familiar. Dragons, not so much. I think that when Dany says "I am a dragon" it is more dehumanizing than when Arya identifies as a wolf. It would be very interesting to see precisely what circumstances provoke Daenerys and Arya to assume the identity of their animal alters, and whether the identification produces similar aims in them.

Thanks Hrafntyr

It's an interesting question you pose about Dany, Arya and their animal familiar. Dany and Arya identify themselves as dragon and wolf, respectively, in AGOT throughout but, for me, there is a moment for each of them where they take on those identities firmly.

For Dany, it's after she's lost Rhaego and is having her fever dream. She sees Rhaegar in his armor and keeps hearing Ser Jorah's voice say "the last dragon" but when she opens the visor of the helm, it's her own face inside. When she wakes from her dream and sickness, she is stronger, more composed, the eggs are hotter than they've ever been, and of course this then leads to her entering the pyre thinking that she had known this all along.

For Arya, I think, it's at HH, her very last chapter in ACOK. Up until then, Arya describes herself as a lamb, a mouse, a ghost, Arry, Weasel, and Nan but she has put Arya aside. She's in front of the weirwood and she hears Ned's voice telling her that she is blood of the wolf. She remembers what that means, breaks the fake sword she was practicing with, proclaims that she is done with wooden teeth and then rounds up Hot Pie and Gendry to get the heck out of dodge.

So for both, we've got a lot of fear. Dany is very afraid and uncertain in her dream, trying to find her red door, trying to heal her body, ect. Arya is scared that Jaqen leaving made her a mouse again and that when Roose Bolton leaves, she'll be hurt or forced to become the mouse again. In both cases, then, the adoption of their animals identities comes at a time when they are in extreme danger.