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Bakker XXXV: Tyrant of Rat Nation, Worshipped as Rat of Rats


Madness

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So speaking of Blind Brain Theory, I think this universe is a simulation and I'm a brain in a jar. Had a "Dream" where I was told I'm "addicted to sleep" and was given a pill to remedy this situation. Following the pill, I was immobile and my vision was black for some amount of time. When I regain vision, I vomit out the pill.

If the dream were some sort of debug mode, then that immobile, black vision I experienced is reality, so far as I can tell, I'm a literal blind-brain-in-a-jar, hooked up to some sort of reality simulation.

You're partly right. This universe is a Peer-to-Peer simulation.

(So is Earwa, if you think every soul as a "player" entering the "simulation" of the Inward.)

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Fingers crossed for early 2016, in other words. The good thing is that it will at least be published, I know some of us began to question even that.

I wonder if the other two publishers only decided to get the last book of AE out before following in Penguin's footsteps.

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I remember you putting fort both of those before. What about my example with Akka killing Nil'gaccas? I don't see that being part of any Conditioned Ground, or for that matter,why would any one want that? Also, if Kelhuss/Moe purpose for the Skin Eaters was to keep an eye on Akka, well, didn't turn out so well.

Ah, you're talking about whether people are being manipulated and Kellhus' predictive capabilities. I think Kellhus may be precognitive, it's hard to say if being one of the Few means you can see around Time's corners...but if the Judging Eye is approaching the mortal limit of divine comprehension I think being of the Few is the first steps toward that limit....

In any case Bakker has said the Probability Trance is akin to having multiple versions of the possible future and then selecting one of those. I recall likening it to a greedy algorithm but he noted it wasn't computational in that sense (this was years ago, he may have changed his mind about that!).

So I'd say Kellhus is using some instinctual Psi that gives him a feel for what the best possible futures are (see above link to Peer 2 Peer Hypothesis) BUT he also has numerous redundancies in his plans. So if Cleric is killed maybe this is a bad thing because it lowers Mimara's chance of survival, OTOH if Akka couldn't make Cleric an Intact then better off the nonmen is dead. Or perhaps the key is that his ashes are the quirri Akka & Mimara need to survive.

Of course, from a meta level the text is written in such a way that we have a hard time figuring out the limits of Kellhus' abilities.

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Music fans pressure that industry all the time. We need to bring that kind of ethic here ;). With tents and beer.

Wilshire is trying to get a TSACast going tonight. I think we're looking at 6pm EDT. If anyone is interested.

Sweet, looking forward to next TSAcast.

I was really excited to tent and beer it until I realized that "The Overlook Press" in Woodstock is just some small local publication.

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Yeah, I really hope it happens. Bolivar volunteered for one but twice we had issues with the individuals recording suddenly disappearing. Poor Bolivar probably thinks we're the sloppiest operation ever (which we are, being just random pioneering fans, but at least when Wilshire is recording we know we'll get a Cast out of it). Now we just need one more person to volunteer (so far it'll be Wilshire, SilentRoamer, and myself - topic undecided; we might do some KOMH since the second half is out now).

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Oh I should [note] it was originally Nerdanel who brought up Shortest Path as a Greedy Algorithm, which made a lot of sense at the time when it was generally agreed Big Moe fucked up by getting himself blinded.



Now that's been cast into doubt by Lockesnow's excellent analysis so....


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Yeah, I really hope it happens. Bolivar volunteered for one but twice we had issues with the individuals recording suddenly disappearing. Poor Bolivar probably thinks we're the sloppiest operation ever (which we are, being just random pioneering fans, but at least when Wilshire is recording we know we'll get a Cast out of it). Now we just need one more person to volunteer (so far it'll be Wilshire, SilentRoamer, and myself - topic undecided; we might do some KOMH since the second half is out now).

I'd volunteer but I don't have the technology where I'm at today, and would probably be reduced to butchering quotations in my best approximation of the character's voices anyway.

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Yeah, I really hope it happens. Bolivar volunteered for one but twice we had issues with the individuals recording suddenly disappearing. Poor Bolivar probably thinks we're the sloppiest operation ever (which we are, being just random pioneering fans, but at least when Wilshire is recording we know we'll get a Cast out of it). Now we just need one more person to volunteer (so far it'll be Wilshire, SilentRoamer, and myself - topic undecided; we might do some KOMH since the second half is out now).

By the way, is there a way to subscribe to the podcast with rss as was the case before the move to Soundcloud? Or is that not possible anymore?

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Yeah, I really hope it happens. Bolivar volunteered for one but twice we had issues with the individuals recording suddenly disappearing. Poor Bolivar probably thinks we're the sloppiest operation ever (which we are, being just random pioneering fans, but at least when Wilshire is recording we know we'll get a Cast out of it). Now we just need one more person to volunteer (so far it'll be Wilshire, SilentRoamer, and myself - topic undecided; we might do some KOMH since the second half is out now).

:idea:

In order to avoid all these audio troubles have you considered doing a textual podcast? Like, instead of talking to each other out loud you can all just post to each other. Kind of like what we’re...

Oh, wait...

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By the way, is there a way to subscribe to the podcast with rss as was the case before the move to Soundcloud? Or is that not possible anymore?

No idea. I'll look into it.

:idea:

In order to avoid all these audio troubles have you considered doing a textual podcast? Like, instead of talking to each other out loud you can all just post to each other. Kind of like what were...

Oh, wait...

Lol, we do have a chatbox at Second Apocalypse.

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Oh I should [note] it was originally Nerdanel who brought up Shortest Path as a Greedy Algorithm, which made a lot of sense at the time when it was generally agreed Big Moe fucked up by getting himself blinded.

Now that's been cast into doubt by Lockesnow's excellent analysis so....

Fwiw, I used to think nerdanels moenghus conspiracies to be crazy, now we are probably on the same page.
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Oh I should [note] it was originally Nerdanel who brought up Shortest Path as a Greedy Algorithm, which made a lot of sense at the time when it was generally agreed Big Moe fucked up by getting himself blinded.

Now that's been cast into doubt by Lockesnow's excellent analysis so....

Right, I get where your coming from. I'm just of the opinion that the outcome of Akka&Mimara with the Skin Eaters/Cleric, isn't the outcome anyone could possibly have the foresight to see. Akka killed (rather Cleric let Akka) Cleric, and I can't imagine Kelhuss could see this outcome through the Probability Trance. Well, if he really is a God, well that's another story.

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Right, I get where your coming from. I'm just of the opinion that the outcome of Akka&Mimara with the Skin Eaters/Cleric, isn't the outcome anyone could possibly have the foresight to see. Akka killed (rather Cleric let Akka) Cleric, and I can't imagine Kelhuss could see this outcome through the Probability Trance. Well, if he really is a God, well that's another story.

Isn't that the whole point of the probability trance? To meditate on all the possible futures?

I would assume that having an Erratic around by their very nature would make it increasingly difficult to predict anything, but it's likely that he had a few outcomes worked out in his trance.

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Isn't that the whole point of the probability trance? To meditate on all the possible futures?

I would assume that having an Erratic around by their very nature would make it increasingly difficult to predict anything, but it's likely that he had a few outcomes worked out in his trance.

Yes, but, how likely does that outcome seem to be? Also, this all was about free will, the Probability Trance, really isn't manipulation and conditioning, in and of itself. And,as I said before, I do t see where Akka killing Cleric, was a thought out manipulation. Was using as an example of free will.
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Yes, but, how likely does that outcome seem to be? Also, this all was about free will, the Probability Trance, really isn't manipulation and conditioning, in and of itself. And,as I said before, I do t see where Akka killing Cleric, was a thought out manipulation. Was using as an example of free will.

Could also be just chaotic and random chance. The probability trance lets him see possible outcomes, it doesn't let him predict the future 100%. Then he tries to manipulate stuff so that his favored outcomes are more likely to happen. So for the Skin Eater / Akka / Mimara arc maybe he just figured that whatever he wanted to happen, his best shot was just to send them all off LotR / BM style and hope for the best. Maybe he wanted a Judging Eye in the North. Maybe he wanted Akka and NG to help him storm Golgoterrath, but couldn't figure a better way to get Akka up there than to send him to Ishual. And the destroy it so Akka figures, "what the hell, might as well go do the tourist thing and check out dagliash and Golgoterath while I'm in the neighborhood". It's entirely possible he never foresaw how it would turn out, but that he figured it was his best chance and doubled down on it.

Definitely frustrating not having any more Kellhus povs.

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I already did that in post 61 and elsewhere.

No, that post is you going through the steps of confirming your own position.

We're talking about an attempt to disconfirm your own position. The sort of thing confirmation bias studies suggest people don't do.

Look at how the psukhe could possibly be a dead end.

On the other hand you’ve said that Kellhus needed the Gnosis to ‘outrun the damnation machine,’ which is totally supported by the text, of course.

No, I haven't. I assure you I have some mastery of caveat (indeed, my use of 'some' in this sentence is a caveat).

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