(TWOW Spoilers) From Pawn to Player: Rethinking Sansa XXII

[Dya of Oldstones]

I don't think Varys hired him. He's just a bounty hunter who heard about the reward Varys put out.

Given current events in King's Landing, though, if I were Shadrich I'd be inclined to sit on this information for now and see how things pan out there. The city isn't a particularly stable or safe place to visit at the moment.

Given how secretive Varys is, I was always suspicious of Shadrich just blurting out to Brienne that he was hired by Varys to find Sansa. I'm still not convinced he's Howland Reed like some have said, but as crackpot it works a lot better than the HS theory for me. I'm still going over the Rat Cook references with him and old gods/weirwood symbolism on the colors of the mouse on his sigil, and even grasping at straws here thinking of Bloodraven.

Speaking of LF's hedge knights, Ser Morgarth was mentioned briefly as someone she danced with at the feast, but I didn't find any mention of the third, younger hedge knight. I have a feeling all three of them will become important sometime, but so far all but Shadrich have been put on the back burner.

Lyn Corbray was a bit of a surprise for me, and I'm also suspecting he may be working with the Mad Mouse and both of them may have tag teamed her.

This whole chapter has a calm before the storm feel about it, but I haven't come up with any solid theories on which way things will go yet.

[Harry the Hair]

Yes, I suspect the comment was along the lines of wanting to make him look worse in Sansa's eyes, trying to isolate her and leave her with only one person to trust: Lord Baelish. I've generally felt that the glance and smile that Lyn Corbray gave Brune in AFFC suggested a more than platonic interest

but maybe I'm too influenced by all the slash porn in the UK politics thread :dunno:

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LOL. Looks like Mya has to rescue Lothor from Ser Lyn's advances. XD

[Lyanna Stark]

“Soon or late you must meet Myranda Royce,” Petyr had warned her. “When you do, be careful. She likes to play the merry fool, but underneath she’s shrewder than her father. Guard your tongue around her.”

If LF speaks like this about a person, that one should definitely be the mastermind. Wherever Nestor goes, Randa should be the actual person to be on the wheel. And these two became cronies of LF.

And we should trust Littlefinger why? :) He always speaks the absolute truth? No, I think it's worth re-evaluating Littlefinger's truth on almost everything.

Yes, I suspect the comment was along the lines of wanting to make him look worse in Sansa's eyes, trying to isolate her and leave her with only one person to trust: Lord Baelish. I've generally felt that the glance and smile that Lyn Corbray gave Brune in AFFC suggested a more than platonic interest

but maybe I'm too influenced by all the slash porn in the UK politics thread :dunno:

.

Hah, well there is that. Lyn definitely smiles at Lothor in a..well, odd place. :P Who knows, maybe Lothor could be swayed? Granted, Corbray supposedly looks nothing like Mya Stone, but stranger things have happened.

Weirdly, Lyn smiles at Lothor and then Sansa describes it as a smile she didn't like. Clearly she is on to Lyn's illicit thoughts about Brune apple-eater!

[Milady of York]

I turn my back for a little while, and everyone comes with lots of good thoughts to chew on . . .

In general: Even if news still travel, the focus on the news is on big things going on more than on LF having acquired an uncommonly pretty bastard daughter. With so many things going on and so much strife, fighting and winter around the corner, it seems to me people's focus will be elsewhere than LF's bastard daughter. Besides, we do know it is considered impolite to comment or inquire after a man's "natural daughter", as LF himself points out earlier. (Making Alayne's commentary to Harry the more interesting.)

You make a good case for each, Lyanna. On the topic of not asking about a man's bastards, it seems to be a rule of courtesy to be applied to everyone save for one exception so far as we've seen: the woman the man who fathered the bastard is involved with or expected to be involved with, that isn't the mother. Catelyn, as wife to Eddard, could ask who Jon's mother was and was entitled to a reply which her lord husband couldn't give for reasons of importance; and here we have her daughter doing the same. It wouldn't be a breach of etiquette done this way, and could be seen as probing into the man's character, morals and motivations, like when Catelyn wanted to know if Ned still loved that other woman. In this context, it makes sense that Alayne would decide to ask Harry about his bastards, since she's expected to be betrothed to him and as such does have the right to ask. It'd be different if someone else, say, Myranda, were the one asking. But, I do concur that it's interesting that she asked, because it could indicate Alayne wants to find out by herself and for her own motivations what kind of man Harry really is, not just accept what she's been told about him.

Given that we met Shadrich while he was taking a hired job for money, it's possible that he just fortuitously took a job with Littlefinger and then realized that Alayne is Sansa. Some might call that contrived, but it's not like coincidence hasn't happened before in this story, or in real life.

What I do wonder about this angle is, how exactly does Shadrich recognize Sansa? He's never seen her, as far as we know, and it's not like there are photographs of her for him to look at (or even portraits, seemingly -- portraiture seems strangely underdeveloped in Westeros).

On his first appearance in AFFC, talking to Brienne he says this:

“I know no Sansa Stark,” she insisted. “I am searching for my sister, a highborn girl . . .”

“. . . with blue eyes and auburn hair, aye. Pray, who is this knight who travels with your sister? Or did you name him fool?” Ser Shadrich did not wait for her answer, which was good, since she had none. “A certain fool vanished from King’s Landing the night King Joffrey died, a stout fellow with a nose full of broken veins, one Ser Dontos the Red, formerly of Duskendale. I pray your sister and her drunken fool are not mistaken for the Stark girl and Ser Dontos. That could be most unfortunate.” He put his heels into his courser and trotted on ahead.

So, he knows she fled with Ser Dontos, and knows her appearance: auburn hair and blue eyes, and her age. The data he gave away indicates that he did some research, so we can assume he came to the same conclusion as Brienne did at one point: that she might have gone to her aunt in the Vale. So, he might have gone to the Vale on purpose and took service with Littlefinger on purpose too, since Lady Lysa was dead already but he still could at least nose about in the Arryn household to see if there were clues leading to Sansa. And voilá, the same day he's hired, the Lord Protector, Lysa's widower, introduces him to his daughter, who has brown hair, sure, but . . . she is of Sansa's age and she has blue eyes. For a smart man, that'd be enough to make him suspicious, because it's just too much of a coincidence that Lysa Tully's husband has this daughter. And since he's been in the castle for a while now, he might have made some enquiries as to when that girl arrived to the Vale, must've heard the "official" story about her, and that sort of clues he can piece together. No need for portraiture and having met Catelyn in his case, as he already knew what to look for: he went to the Vale with a purpose and with eyes wide open.

With regards to Sansa/Alayne being captivated by Harry's beauty, it is interesting to note what she thinks of Lyn (and we definitely know she doesn't fancy him).

Ser Lyn is very handsome, for an older man, she thought, but I do not like the way he smiles.

Alayne/Sansa in AFFC already seems able to divorce physical beauty from personality traits. It seems unlikely Harry would sway her with handsome looks alone.

Definitely! And it doesn't help Harry's case that the first person he evoked in Sansa's mind even before opening his mouth was none other that our never-missed Joffrey of all people she could think of. Besides that, there's also the detail that Joffrey has been the only man in Sansa's list of crushes with blond hair, which Harry also has. Sansa tends to prefer men with dark hair (black and brown) as her track record of voluntary and not imposed infatuations demonstrates; and of all them Joffrey was the one she didn't choose but was chosen by her parents, so here again we have another parallel in that now her "father" has chosen this blond boy and imposed him on her.

[Milady of York]

Holy double-posting, Batman!

[Colonel Green]

In general: Even if news still travel, the focus on the news is on big things going on more than on LF having acquired an uncommonly pretty bastard daughter. With so many things going on and so much strife, fighting and winter around the corner, it seems to me people's focus will be elsewhere than LF's bastard daughter. Besides, we do know it is considered impolite to comment or inquire after a man's "natural daughter", as LF himself points out earlier. (Making Alayne's commentary to Harry the more interesting.)

Milady brought my attention back to this, which I had meant to comment on before: I agree with this. Alayne wouldn't really be big news initially, particularly as she spent most of her time up in the Eyrie with few visitors.

Her existence would only have started to attract real interest in the last [however long it's been; month?] since her betrothal to Harry the Heir was seemingly announced. "Littlefinger has a hot daughter" isn't terribly important; "Littlefinger has a hot daughter and he's trying to marry her to the heir of the Vale" is a politically significant matter.

[Lyanna Stark]

Milady brought my attention back to this, which I had meant to comment on before: I agree with this. Alayne wouldn't really be big news initially, particularly as she spent most of her time up in the Eyrie with few visitors.

Her existence would only have started to attract real interest in the last [however long it's been; month?] since her betrothal to Harry the Heir was seemingly announced. "Littlefinger has a hot daughter" isn't terribly important; "Littlefinger has a hot daughter and he's trying to marry her to the heir of the Vale" is a politically significant matter.

Logistics:

Given the commentary about how long knights et al have been staying at the Gates, it's been well over a month since Sansa and LF came down from the Eyrie. The visitors have been staying for over a month already according to Randa, which means we have Sansa and Lf thinking up the tourney, sending out invitations, organising everything, getting everyone to arrive etc. I'd say closer to three months down from the Eyrie if not longer, if they should realistically have time to set everything up, order and not to forget, receive the gifts from traders in KL, Braavos or elsewhere. I don't know how long it would take for traders to actually get the wares to LF in the Vale, but my guess is "a while", since war is all over the area, there are pirates in the step stones, slaver ships as far north as the Bay of Seals, Saltpans are sacked,Storm's End is under siege and the Ironborn are sacking the Reach. All in all a shortage of safe routes and good trading ports.

Information: In general I agree that under normal circumstances there will be people interested in LF's hot daughter being promised to the heir of the Vale. However, if we are looking closer at who will be privy to this information and whether it will be meaningful to them, another picture emerges.

Mace Tyrell and Randyll Tarly surely know. Mace Tyrell is too dumb to do anything with it and he's probably more worried about imprisoned Margarey, seriously injured Loras and besieged Willas to actually spend any remaining brain cells on LF's daughter. Tarly might spare a thought, but then he got Dickon betrothed with a rich lordling's daughter in Mootown anyway so he'd probably think "I'd do the same thing given the opportunity". Tarly is sort of quietly ambitious. He will also be very pre-occupied with sorting out the Tyrell forces in Kings Landing and deal with the Faith so he probably doesn't have the time to mull over this one, nor do I think Tarly cares all that about weird marriages apart from assuming it was done out of ambition, and he would not be wrong in this case. LF is known to be very ambitious, and getting his bastard daughter to marry the heir of the Vale is definitely scheming that will be noticed, but for its own sake I imagine.

Doran Martell will probably have got the information and he might figure out what it means, but who is he going to tell? Arianne is AWOL on her way to Storms End to meet fake!Aegon and the Starks existence or not is currently not high up on Doran's list of Things To Do either. Potentially the Sand snakes on their way to Kings Landing, but as of the end of ADWD, they have not yet arrived. And again, they are new to Kings Landing and will need to establish their presence there, plus why should they care about Sansa Stark? They don't know her and have no dealings with her, they probably only know she is lost and that Cersei thinks she and the imp are in cahoots about killing Joffrey.

Tyrion is lost in Essos and mixed up in Dany's war, or he might have figured it out. Jon Snow is at the Wall with his own issues and a knife waiting for his back. Stannis is either on his way to Winterfell or stuck in the snow. Tywin is dead. Roose Bolton is either marching to a wedding or stuck waiting for Stannis. Walder Frey is probably more upset that Harry the Heir is not marrying one of his daughters than worrying where Sansa Stark-Lannister has gone. The northern lords are probably more fixated on the Winterfell debacle and on the Boltons, and Manderley has his eyes set on Rickon, not to mention that the lords of the north would not accept a Sansa Stark Mrs Lannister with bonus Lannister imp son of Tywin "Rains of Castamere" to lord it from Winterfell.

Rumours might have moved into the Riverlands too, but the people we have there who might know are either missing (Jaime), in hiding (Brynden Tully), captives (Brienne, Pod) too busy with fighting a guerilla war (the BWB) to really bother too much with the heir of the Vale marrying LF's bastard daughter. If nothing else, they will probably think "Oh another power grab by that ambitious little arse, when is he going to come sort out Harrenhall the lazy bugger?" The Riverlands are also more concerned with a mixture of Lord Frey and King Bread, I believe. Their main issue with the Vale is probably going to be the withholding of food, not the succession of lords and their future wives.

Conclusion: the information may be there, but the people being able to make sense of it, or to suspect LF of masquerading Sansa as Alayne are all either not in a position to get this information, or they might get their hands on it, like Doran Martell, Randyll Tarly and Mace Tyrell, but they either don't understand what it means (Mace Tyrell, Tarly) or they can't act on it (Doran). I mean hell, even Cersei probably knows that LF has a bastard daughter in the Vale, but for all her "when I am done with her she will be begging the Stranger for his kiss" commentary, she hasn't added two and two together either. And unlike Tarly, Tyrell and Doran Martell, Cersei was very actively invested in looking for Sansa.

Hence why I really believe there is nothing anywhere supporting that anyone outside of Lothor Brune, daddy Kettleblack and Littlefinger know who Sansa is. The ace in the hole here is Ser Shadrich, who is certainly no fool and may be the only one who has figured out the cover up.

(However, if we are looking at the official timeline, then LF and Sansa organised the tourney in about four weeks time, while the visitors also stayed there for four weeks, potentially making them telepathic, which is pretty awesome!! Given we assume that the news Oswell Kettleblack rode up with on a lathered horse was that KEvan wanted the Kettleblack brothers either sent to the Wall or have them fight Ser Gregor the un-dead in Trial by Combat.)

[Ragnorak]

...

I am thinking more along the lines of a quiet get the hell outta dodge getaway once LF is gone. Potentially with the assistance of some of the people who might take over after LF, like Bronze Yohn, Anya Waynwood or Myranda Royce. OR, she might not extricate herself at all, given that everyone and their dog knows she is married to one Tyrion Lannister and as such, she cannot be married again. However, she is still put in a difficult position as Sweetrobin's not quite guardian, yet she does have influence over him. I guess it depends who that guardian will be. If it's Bronze Yohn Royce, I doubt she'd get a lookin with regards to ruling, but with someone else...potentially? It will also depends strongly on the time scale and who comes knocking, whether that is Brynden Tully, Aegon the fake Targaryen or Daenerys Stormborn with Drogon. These impending visitors would surelyinspire different responses.

Following that idea, Sansa has done a great deal of following in Ned's footsteps. We learn through Davos that Ned fled the Vale by way of the Sisters so perhaps we can expect Sansa to travel by the same route. There are Sistermen at this Tourney. That leads to speculation about whether Godric will have a third If you lose you were never here moment or if perhaps Sansa Stark might be a treasure worth keeping. Based on the name of the islands alone I would wonder if that might be the reunion place for Arya and Sansa.

I like your reasoning on who has and hasn't put together Sansa's identity though there are a couple points I'd like to raise.

Bronze Yohn

The only caveat I'd raise with your reasoning is that Sansa is wanted for execution by Cersei. Bronze Yohn exposing her also exposes her to Cersei's fatal wrath-- and Littlefinger too. I could see a Bronze Yohn not wanting to get Sansa killed as a means of disposing of his Littlefinger problem. That's not disagreement with your position, just some hesitancy.

Varys

While Varys no longer has an official position, from the epilogue we know he's still infesting the walls of the Red Keep and therefore still has access to the information that passes through there. Varys is no longer funded by the crown but he still has Illyrio and the monetary assets that come with him. Additionally Illyrio tells Tyrion that both he and Varys had grown fabulously wealthy. What happened to Varys's half of the wealth? So I think Varys still has access to a great deal of money.

He also still has access to information in Kings Landing though likely not as thoroughly as he used to. He used to have most factions coming to him and confessing their schemes to ask for his help like we saw with Tyrion and Cersei. That makes intel gathering rather simple and also makes it easy to put any small tidbits of data into the proper context. He still has KL intel but not the same amount and not from the same vantage point. Also, Kings Landing intel is becoming increasingly less important. Meereen, Winterfell, White Harbor, the Wall, Sunspear, the Vale, Braavos, Oldtown, whatever hill the BwB is hiding under are all more likely to sway future events far more than anything happening in Kings Landing especially after Varys unleashes his crossbow bolts-- those bolts were designed to render KL ineffectual. In many ways Varys is also falling victim to his own brand of scheming. He kept a secret "Targ" off the grid to ambush a war torn chaotic realm with a savior to find his plans about to be threatened by a host of secret Starks currently off his grid.

Varys probably wants Sansa in his control by the time Aegon lands or shortly afterwards. Her marriage to Tyrion safeguards Sansa's usefulness to him against anything LF is likely to do, but he'll want Sansa in his camp by the time the Aegon has landed ravens fly. So I do think Varys still has access to money and a significant portion of his KL information sources, but agree with the essence your end state conclusions about their usefulness.

The Tyrells

I think any of the Tyrells who were in on the Purple Wedding know Alayne is Sansa. They intended to steal Sansa for Willas and it ought to be blatantly obvious to them that LF claim jumped. That being said, you are completely correct in saying they all have bigger fish to fry. Also Tyrion didn't die so Sansa isn't of much use to them anyway until that happens. Tarly seems to place similar value on her. Were she the heir to Winterfell he'd be very interested, but with Tommen giving Bolton the North and marrying "Arya" to Ramsay anyone committed to the Lannister/Tryrell alliance has little use for Sansa and that shows in Tarly's indifference.

The big takeaway from Tarly is that he throws out Sansa in the Vale as something obvious. Once someone has a good reason to care and starts really focusing on where Sansa could be in the Vale, it isn't hard for anyone to guess. She'd run to Lysa. LF married Lysa and magically acquired a gorgeous Sansa aged blue eyed bastard daughter.

The Shadow of Bloodraven

Sansa has plenty of watched by Bloodraven material in her chapters. LF thinks he can outbid everyone with money, but he is utterly oblivious to Varys's access to Illyrio's assets (and the Iron Bank and Stannis.) He also seems to think that his intel network is as good as Varys. His little meet me in the godswood move was designed to circumvent what he seemed to believe was Varys's one trick pony but is the very place of Bloodraven's power. Shadrich the Mouse refers to Sansa as a bag of dragons and our first subtle Varys reference came in Dany's wedding gift of the gown made of a thousand mice. This Varys/LF bidding war for Sansa reminds me of the old crone at the slave auction in Meereen-- And one. Is Bloodraven in this bidding war too? Does the story of the Winged Knight refer to Bran? GRRM spent almost two books teasing us with Sansa being rescued by her brother Robb. Are we in for a subtle twist on that with Sansa being "rescued" by her winged knightly brother after all? Obviously it wouldn't be something explicit, but are the winged knights that are supposed to make Sweetrobin brave really more like the walls of Snow Winterfell that made Sansa stronger?

[butterbumps!]

wow, we've moved so much so quickly! forgive the quick backtrack.....

Intriguing possibility. That would depend on how well the communications between Vale and North are going at present, and even though the winter up North is being felt much harder at this stage, there seems to be still plenty of open channels for communication with the south, based on the news Jon and Davos were receiving at the Wall and Sisters/White Harbour. But my guess is that the news of the Vale are being filtered through the Manderly's port for now as the land routes are being closed in the Vale due to snows. Could the Manderly people be the first ones to hear of Alayne in the Vale amongst the Northerners?

On the Bolton-Redfort relations, do we to know that it was because of Roose and not his wife's House or family that Domeric was fostered there? Some northern houses seem to have strong ties with the Vale, and Lady Dustin's seemed to me to be one of those, so I wonder if Domeric went there thanks to his maternal family's connections. In any case, Bolton must know by now that Baelish is at the Vale, it's common knowledge, but as for whether he'd piece together that Sansa is the bastard daughter, it would depend on how much intelligence Bolton has on Littlefinger's backstory. For Varys and the Tyrells, it'd be easier because they know LF and they'd know he doesn't have a daughter, the former in particular, but we have no idea of what Bolton knows; so I'm thinking that perhaps he won't. But more than anything it's because of how things are going on for the Boltons: between Cersei's fall and Stannis at the Gates, the Boltons have enough trouble on their plate for the revelation of Sansa at the Vale to perhaps be of much greater impact than that, and more so if Rickon reappears first. Littlefinger is practically in the same position as them, in a way, as both depend on a Stark girl to succeed, and without the Stark girl, they're in trouble. I'd be looking for parallels in both Bolton-Baelish situations, therefore.

I think it does stand to reason that White Harbor would be the first Northern location to hear of LF and Alayne's presences in the Vale, as you say. I wonder, though, what do the Manderlies do with that information? I could also see the info getting directly to the Wall via the port of Eastwatch, in the event it bypasses the rest of the mainland North somehow.

On Bolton-Redfort, I'm not actually sure whether it was Bolton or Ryswell that led to the fostering (and I don't think we're told either way), though I assumed (perhaps incorrectly), that Bolton and Redfort would have developed fairly close relations just by virtue of the fostering. But I do agree completely with your assessment of how Varys and the Tyrells would be able to fairly easily deduce Sansa's whereabouts, and that Bolton would need a bit of extra info. Though, that's why I'm so curious about the Redforts as a potential connection there to fill in some blanks. We don't know if Roose knows that LF is the one who procured "Arya" in the first place, but Roose definitely knows it's not actually Arya, and if he knows that LF is in any way connected to that farce, then he might be particularly keen on watching him. (The other interesting Bolton informant is Qyburn, but that's beyond the scope here I think).

But that said, I do agree with you that there's already a lot on Bolton's plate without adding this into the mix, especially in the near future. If it comes to pass, I figured it would happen via a Jon-Sansa cooperation wrt the Vale's food stores or because Winterfell is one of LF's desired targets, which puts them all at odds.

[Lyanna Stark]

Following that idea, Sansa has done a great deal of following in Ned's footsteps. We learn through Davos that Ned fled the Vale by way of the Sisters so perhaps we can expect Sansa to travel by the same route. There are Sistermen at this Tourney. That leads to speculation about whether Godric will have a third If you lose you were never here moment or if perhaps Sansa Stark might be a treasure worth keeping. Based on the name of the islands alone I would wonder if that might be the reunion place for Arya and Sansa.

That is certainly one route that would be interesting. I guess it can go one of two ways: either towards the North directly, potentially via the Sisters, or Sansa needs a route through the Riverlands. I'd imagine there needs to be some closure to the quests to find her by the three broken knights she has left in her wake: Jaime, Brienne and Sandor. All three have been "dumped" in the Riverlands and all three are somehow on the look out for Sansa.

I like your reasoning on who has and hasn't put together Sansa's identity though there are a couple points I'd like to raise.

Bronze Yohn

The only caveat I'd raise with your reasoning is that Sansa is wanted for execution by Cersei. Bronze Yohn exposing her also exposes her to Cersei's fatal wrath-- and Littlefinger too. I could see a Bronze Yohn not wanting to get Sansa killed as a means of disposing of his Littlefinger problem. That's not disagreement with your position, just some hesitancy.

This is true. We don't have enough information to form a complete picture of Bronze Yohn Royce. However if Royce does know, it seems to me there should be some sort of hint somewhere that he does. So far we don't have anything about from him asking Sansa if he knew her, a notion which he was quickly dissuaded from.

Varys

While Varys no longer has an official position, from the epilogue we know he's still infesting the walls of the Red Keep and therefore still has access to the information that passes through there. Varys is no longer funded by the crown but he still has Illyrio and the monetary assets that come with him. Additionally Illyrio tells Tyrion that both he and Varys had grown fabulously wealthy. What happened to Varys's half of the wealth? So I think Varys still has access to a great deal of money.

He also still has access to information in Kings Landing though likely not as thoroughly as he used to. He used to have most factions coming to him and confessing their schemes to ask for his help like we saw with Tyrion and Cersei. That makes intel gathering rather simple and also makes it easy to put any small tidbits of data into the proper context. He still has KL intel but not the same amount and not from the same vantage point. Also, Kings Landing intel is becoming increasingly less important. Meereen, Winterfell, White Harbor, the Wall, Sunspear, the Vale, Braavos, Oldtown, whatever hill the BwB is hiding under are all more likely to sway future events far more than anything happening in Kings Landing especially after Varys unleashes his crossbow bolts-- those bolts were designed to render KL ineffectual. In many ways Varys is also falling victim to his own brand of scheming. He kept a secret "Targ" off the grid to ambush a war torn chaotic realm with a savior to find his plans about to be threatened by a host of secret Starks currently off his grid.

Varys probably wants Sansa in his control by the time Aegon lands or shortly afterwards. Her marriage to Tyrion safeguards Sansa's usefulness to him against anything LF is likely to do, but he'll want Sansa in his camp by the time the Aegon has landed ravens fly. So I do think Varys still has access to money and a significant portion of his KL information sources, but agree with the essence your end state conclusions about their usefulness.

I agree that the extent of Varys' powers now when he has been removed and replaced by Qyburn are difficult to assess, yet it seems that he will be focusing on helping JonnConn and Aegon if he can by promoting chaos in Kings Landing. I also agree completely with your view on that Varys has become the victim of his own scheming, by spreading the important events and players to places where he cannot see. If his spread out network of spies are still reporting to Kings Landing, those reports will at least primarily land with Qyburn, not with Varys. Of course, Varys probably spies on Qyburn, but he doesn't have magic eyes to read all correspondence. Here I think wealth is perhaps less important than location, location, location. Varys still has his wealth, he still has his spies, but he has lost his location centrally on the council and as Master of Spies. Qyburn is certainly no Varys, but he's also not an idiot.

The Tyrells

I think any of the Tyrells who were in on the Purple Wedding know Alayne is Sansa. They intended to steal Sansa for Willas and it ought to be blatantly obvious to them that LF claim jumped. That being said, you are completely correct in saying they all have bigger fish to fry. Also Tyrion didn't die so Sansa isn't of much use to them anyway until that happens. Tarly seems to place similar value on her. Were she the heir to Winterfell he'd be very interested, but with Tommen giving Bolton the North and marrying "Arya" to Ramsay anyone committed to the Lannister/Tryrell alliance has little use for Sansa and that shows in Tarly's indifference.

The big takeaway from Tarly is that he throws out Sansa in the Vale as something obvious. Once someone has a good reason to care and starts really focusing on where Sansa could be in the Vale, it isn't hard for anyone to guess. She'd run to Lysa. LF married Lysa and magically acquired a gorgeous Sansa aged blue eyed bastard daughter.

I'm not so sure about that. The Tyrells who were in on the purple wedding were most likely Olenna and potentially Garlan and even more potentially Margaery. Hence the ones we have left is maybe, possibly Margaery as the only one who knows. Olenna is gone to Highgarden so she is nowhere near, Garlan is gone, Loras was probably never involved and Mace is too dumb to have been in the know. Olenna may suspect LF to claim jump, but then it doesn't matter since Tyrion is still alive. Sansa's usefulness is basically zero after she was married to Tyrion and as long as Tyrion is alive. The Tyrells were only interested in Sansa as long as (to borrow from the Lannister meeting in ASOS) "the rose could get into bed with the direwolf". Currently Tyrion is cockblocking any potential claim jump by way of Sansa.

While Tarly surely thinks Sansa has gone to Lysa, the fact that Sansa hasn't surfaced and Lysa is dead is probably throwing that theory in disarray.

The Shadow of Bloodraven

Sansa has plenty of watched by Bloodraven material in her chapters. LF thinks he can outbid everyone with money, but he is utterly oblivious to Varys's access to Illyrio's assets (and the Iron Bank and Stannis.) He also seems to think that his intel network is as good as Varys. His little meet me in the godswood move was designed to circumvent what he seemed to believe was Varys's one trick pony but is the very place of Bloodraven's power. Shadrich the Mouse refers to Sansa as a bag of dragons and our first subtle Varys reference came in Dany's wedding gift of the gown made of a thousand mice. This Varys/LF bidding war for Sansa reminds me of the old crone at the slave auction in Meereen-- And one. Is Bloodraven in this bidding war too? Does the story of the Winged Knight refer to Bran? GRRM spent almost two books teasing us with Sansa being rescued by her brother Robb. Are we in for a subtle twist on that with Sansa being "rescued" by her winged knightly brother after all? Obviously it wouldn't be something explicit, but are the winged knights that are supposed to make Sweetrobin brave really more like the walls of Snow Winterfell that made Sansa stronger?

Hah, yes, the imagery of Bran there is pretty strong. So far Sansa's chapters at least through AFFC and this one have been clinically free of anything magical. About time we got some warging or weirnet or something in them.

[brashcandy]

That is certainly one route that would be interesting. I guess it can go one of two ways: either towards the North directly, potentially via the Sisters, or Sansa needs a route through the Riverlands. I'd imagine there needs to be some closure to the quests to find her by the three broken knights she has left in her wake: Jaime, Brienne and Sandor. All three have been "dumped" in the Riverlands and all three are somehow on the look out for Sansa.

Any closure Jaime and Brienne receive might come by way of Lady Stoneheart, but Brienne's last words to Jaime are that the Hound has Sansa, and if there's any clear, unfinished business left in this scenario, it's between those two.

As to the route she might take, while the Ned parallels certainly hold evocative possibilities, Sansa's time in the Vale is heavily slanted towards an association with her mother's experiences, and another female relative in Lyanna Stark. Harry the Heir may cause her to think of Joffrey, but for readers his closest parallel is to Robert Baratheon, Lyanna's betrothed, and the one she knew would never be able to stay faithful to her. If Harry's two bastards didn't already foreshadow him as Bobby 2.0., his insensitive regard for the women he sleeps with only reinforces the impression. Lyanna is crowned as QoLaB at Harrenhal, and Littlefinger tells Sansa at the Hand's tourney:

“Your mother was my queen of beauty once,” the man said quietly. His breath smelled of mint. “You have her hair.” His fingers brushed against her cheek as he stroked one auburn lock. Quite abruptly he turned and walked away.

Now Sansa is set to be crowned, as she too operates covertly at the tourney she helped to organise, and with her own "mystery knight" problem to solve in who will receive her favour in the competition. With the threat of Shadrich and other unknown factors in play, I wonder if we might not see a rumour given out that Sansa has been kidnapped as Lyanna was thought to be, only to have it be a ruse that Sansa herself is complicit in.

Hah, yes, the imagery of Bran there is pretty strong. So far Sansa's chapters at least through AFFC and this one have been clinically free of anything magical. About time we got some warging or weirnet or something in them.

Her last chapter in Feast did contain some provocative allusions to her warg identity with Lady - as I like to read it - in the "ghost wolf" that she hears in the howling wind. This at least hinted that we can expect to see further exploration of Sansa's connection to her Northern roots and that her true identity - like the hair that is now glowing in the firelight - cannot be concealed for much longer. Sansa and Bran are the two Starks linked to the "winged" imagery in the books, with Sansa as the "little bird" now building an order of winged knights, which so strongly evokes the theme of knighthood in her arc, and her ideal of "true knights."

[Elba the Intoner]

Gah! All this excitement had to happen over a week when I was away on vacation in an area that did not have great internet access. I did manage to read the chapter and am just catching up now on this thread. I was thrilled to see an Alayne chapter released and could barely contain my excitement. It was not easy to find some private time to read it but it was not even a question that I would do so immediately. Some initial observations:

I think I like Sweetrobin now. He is really thriving under Sansa's care. Loved her thought about Ned as her father before she switched to her Alayne mode. I also loved the description of her running with Randa and how it reminded her of times at Winterfell with Jeyne and Arya. We are definitely getting glimpses of the real Sansa hanging on very strongly. I liked her interaction with Lothor Brune and also the younger Waynewood with the stutter and how she put him at ease. I think he may turn out to be another ally for her as will Lothor. Though Sandor was not mentioned by name, I think the very last sentence about finding someone to give her favor to is meant to be a reminder of him.

ETA I also wanted to mention that it's clear from her thoughts that She has no idea about LF wanting to kill sweetrobin.

[Ragnorak]

Any closure Jaime and Brienne receive might come by way of Lady Stoneheart, but Brienne's last words to Jaime are that the Hound has Sansa, and if there's any clear, unfinished business left in this scenario, it's between those two.

As to the route she might take, while the Ned parallels certainly hold evocative possibilities, Sansa's time in the Vale is heavily slanted towards an association with her mother's experiences, and another female relative in Lyanna Stark. Harry the Heir may cause her to think of Joffrey, but for readers his closest parallel is to Robert Baratheon, Lyanna's betrothed, and the one she knew would never be able to stay faithful to her. If Harry's two bastards didn't already foreshadow him as Bobby 2.0., his insensitive regard for the women he sleeps with only reinforces the impression. Lyanna is crowned as QoLaB at Harrenhal, and Littlefinger tells Sansa at the Hand's tourney:

“Your mother was my queen of beauty once,” the man said quietly. His breath smelled of mint. “You have her hair.” His fingers brushed against her cheek as he stroked one auburn lock. Quite abruptly he turned and walked away.

Now Sansa is set to be crowned, as she too operates covertly at the tourney she helped to organise, and with her own "mystery knight" problem to solve in who will receive her favour in the competition. With the threat of Shadrich and other unknown factors in play, I wonder if we might not see a rumour given out that Sansa has been kidnapped as Lyanna was thought to be, only to have it be a ruse that Sansa herself is complicit in.

Her last chapter in Feast did contain some provocative allusions to her warg identity with Lady - as I like to read it - in the "ghost wolf" that she hears in the howling wind. This at least hinted that we can expect to see further exploration of Sansa's connection to her Northern roots and that her true identity - like the hair that is now glowing in the firelight - cannot be concealed for much longer. Sansa and Bran are the two Starks linked to the "winged" imagery in the books, with Sansa as the "little bird" now building an order of winged knights, which so strongly evokes the theme of knighthood in her arc, and her ideal of "true knights."

The part I find most interesting about the Sisters route is that Ned travelled via the Sisters to raise the North. That is the most evocative aspect of the parallel for me.

If Lady Stoneheart is an Alyssa Arryn parallel, we can expect her tears to reach the Vale which holds the potential to wrap up the Jaime and Brienne threads that are tied to Sansa. Sandor is likely more involved but could also be connected to Lady Stoneheart in the Vale. My current crackpot notion is a Trial by Seven in the Vale that pulls all the above there.

Of course the biggest thread that needs to be dealt with is Littlefinger. Does he meet his end in Winterfell or the Vale? Plotwise the Vale seems most likely, thematically I'd like to see his head on the gates of Winterfell-- but then he has to live longer...

I'm not so sure about that. The Tyrells who were in on the purple wedding were most likely Olenna and potentially Garlan and even more potentially Margaery. Hence the ones we have left is maybe, possibly Margaery as the only one who knows. Olenna is gone to Highgarden so she is nowhere near, Garlan is gone, Loras was probably never involved and Mace is too dumb to have been in the know. Olenna may suspect LF to claim jump, but then it doesn't matter since Tyrion is still alive. Sansa's usefulness is basically zero after she was married to Tyrion and as long as Tyrion is alive. The Tyrells were only interested in Sansa as long as (to borrow from the Lannister meeting in ASOS) "the rose could get into bed with the direwolf". Currently Tyrion is cockblocking any potential claim jump by way of Sansa.

I think we agree completely but we're just taking two different perspectives. Yes, the Tyrells are not going to have a spare thought to impact Sansa in the Vale absent some other major development. My focus was on them possessing the knowledge period. For example, looking way out we can expect Tyrion to return to Westeros and if he's with Dany and Dragons that knowledge of where his wife is would suddenly become very important.

People potentially knowing gets teased a good deal, but not necessarily in a clue dropping fashion one would expect from puzzle pieces GRRM is giving us. It could just be nothing more than the dramatic tension of suspense that's also designed to reinforce the theme of Sansa bleeding through Alayne like the hair in the torchlight.

I agree that the extent of Varys' powers now when he has been removed and replaced by Qyburn are difficult to assess, yet it seems that he will be focusing on helping JonnConn and Aegon if he can by promoting chaos in Kings Landing. I also agree completely with your view on that Varys has become the victim of his own scheming, by spreading the important events and players to places where he cannot see. If his spread out network of spies are still reporting to Kings Landing, those reports will at least primarily land with Qyburn, not with Varys. Of course, Varys probably spies on Qyburn, but he doesn't have magic eyes to read all correspondence. Here I think wealth is perhaps less important than location, location, location. Varys still has his wealth, he still has his spies, but he has lost his location centrally on the council and as Master of Spies. Qyburn is certainly no Varys, but he's also not an idiot.

So I did a little speculative musings and the conversation Arya overhears came to mind:

“This is no longer a game for two players, if ever it was. Stannis Baratheon and Lysa Arryn have fled beyond my reach, and the whispers say they are gathering swords around them.

What I can do, I will,” the one with the torch said softly. “I must have gold, and another fifty birds.”

She let them get a long way ahead, then went creeping after them. Quiet as a shadow.

“So many?” The voices were fainter as the light dwindled ahead of her. “The ones you need are hard to find… so young, to know their letters… perhaps older… not die so easy…”

“No. The younger are safer… treat them gently…”

“…if they kept their tongues…”

“…the risk…”

Littlefinger… the gods only know what game Littlefinger is playing. Yet Lord Stark’s the one who troubles my sleep.

So the Vale is beyond Varys's reach-- or at least the Eyrie is. It also seems that there are "the whispers" and the "little birds." The whispers would seem to be the intelligence network belonging to the Iron Throne. This would have passed entirely (or nearly so) to Qyburn. Then Varys has his little birds in KL that are his and his alone.

There's also the bit about him requesting gold from Illyrio. What do we make of that? Varys has a budget for bribes, a nice salary and virtually no habits or hobbies to account for him ever spending a copper on disposable income items. So asking Illyrio for gold is probably a hefty sum. Either Varys paid for some big ticket items or he's funding a separate intel network from the Iron Throne's. The latter seems likely because I can't think of anything involving gold that he did to orchestrate a longer peace. It does suggest that any wealth Varys had was dumped in with Illyrio's for this venture or he wouldn't be asking Illyrio for funds. So he may have a spy network that might still report to him and he still has access to the secret passages and reports from the little birds, but his actual reach doesn't seem to extend much beyond Kings Landing.

As a side note I found the line about fearing Ned the most quite interesting given all the talk of Littlefinger. That Varys fears moral and honorable men most while LF subscribes to the Jaime Lannister Give me honorable enemies rather than ambitious ones school of thought is a telling difference between the two.

[brashcandy]

The part I find most interesting about the Sisters route is that Ned travelled via the Sisters to raise the North. That is the most evocative aspect of the parallel for me.

If Lady Stoneheart is an Alyssa Arryn parallel, we can expect her tears to reach the Vale which holds the potential to wrap up the Jaime and Brienne threads that are tied to Sansa. Sandor is likely more involved but could also be connected to Lady Stoneheart in the Vale. My current crackpot notion is a Trial by Seven in the Vale that pulls all the above there.

Of course the biggest thread that needs to be dealt with is Littlefinger. Does he meet his end in Winterfell or the Vale? Plotwise the Vale seems most likely, thematically I'd like to see his head on the gates of Winterfell-- but then he has to live longer...

My interest in Cat is also that I see Sansa fulfilling a similar peacemaking/political advisory role, especially as she's currently trusted companion and mother figure to the Lord of the Vale. She would be ideally positioned to assist a Northern host fleeing the Others and general political upheaval. Concerning Littlefinger's fate, he might need to live longer, but I tend to think he'll be displaced from power in the Vale for a significant time before his head is on the walls of Winterfell.

[Milady of York]

As a side note I found the line about fearing Ned the most quite interesting given all the talk of Littlefinger. That Varys fears moral and honorable men most while LF subscribes to the Jaime Lannister Give me honorable enemies rather than ambitious ones school of thought is a telling difference between the two.

It also speaks to what does and doesn't work for their own agendas. Varys can rely on ambitious and scheming opponents to resort to all sorts of dirty trickery which he can counter with his own assortment of tricks and spy networks. But a honourable man won't play the way he needs to and when he needs it; and they will maintain the stability when he needs chaos and strife. Jaime and Littlefinger share the opposite view for different reasons: Jaime hates intrigue and scheming and prefers "clean" fighting, stuff he can solve with a sword in hand, pre-maiming at least, and honourable men tend to accept that way of dealing with things, to be upfront and stab you with the longsword if all else fails, not with the dagger in the back. Littlefinger, on the other hand, prefers honourable enemies because, in his own words in this chapter, honourable and foolish "sometimes amount to the same." He must be thinking of Eddard and Jon Arryn, two honourable men who succumbed to his dirty scheming. It benefits him to have this sort of opponents, who will choose to do the right thing and suffer for it and are manipulable; but ambitious enemies are more formidable opponents if that ambition is wed to zero scruples, like happens with him.

Speaking of daggers, would you say that Brune knows of Littlefinger's double-crossing of Lord Eddard? We're not told when he took service with Baelish, but it had to happen somewhere between the Hand's Tourney and the Tourney of Gnats, then there might be a possibility however remote that he does know, and that makes him even more valuable if he is swayed to Sansa's side, as he'd be the one to tell. Oswell Kettleblack wasn't in King's Landing, and I cannot think of why Littlefinger would let him know of this in particular.

[Colonel Green]

Speaking of daggers, would you say that Brune knows of Littlefinger's double-crossing of Lord Eddard? We're not told when he took service with Baelish, but it had to happen somewhere between the Hand's Tourney and the Tourney of Gnats, then there might be a possibility however remote that he does know, and that makes him even more valuable if he is swayed to Sansa's side, as he'd be the one to tell. Oswell Kettleblack wasn't in King's Landing, and I cannot think of why Littlefinger would let him know of this in particular.

Is there something at the Hand's Tourney that states he isn't in anybody's service at the time? It's been a while since I read that, and I don't have my books with me. Littlefinger later refers to him as having been in his service "a long time", as I recall, which seems like more than a year or so, which is all it could have been if Littlefinger had hired him somewhere at the end of AGOT.

Even if he hadn't been in his service, he may still know. I never got the impression that Littlefinger's stabbing Ned in the back was some big secret in court -- it's just, unfortunately, not something Sansa ever heard about, since there's no particular reason anybody would mention it to her (which is also, incidentally, a plot hole in the show's version, where they have Varys trying to stop Sansa from going with Littlefinger, but it never occurs to him that the easiest way to do that would be to tell her about how he sold Ned down the river).

[Milady of York]

Is there something at the Hand's Tourney that states he isn't in anybody's service at the time? It's been a while since I read that, and I don't have my books with me. Littlefinger later refers to him as having been in his service "a long time", as I recall, which seems like more than a year or so, which is all it could have been if Littlefinger had hired him somewhere at the end of AGOT.

Even if he hadn't been in his service, he may still know. I never got the impression that Littlefinger's stabbing Ned in the back was some big secret in court -- it's just, unfortunately, not something Sansa ever heard about, since there's no particular reason anybody would mention it to her (which is also, incidentally, a plot hole in the show's version, where they have Varys trying to stop Sansa from going with Littlefinger, but it never occurs to him that the easiest way to do that would be to tell her about how he sold Ned down the river).

Brune is referred to as a freerider in the Hand's Tourney, and nothing else is said of him. Sansa wouldn't have a way of knowing who he served then, so we have to go by the description of freerider, which she presumably knew because of the heraldry and weaponry used. Freerider means a mounted sellsword serving whoever pays for temporal contracts, and he seems to have gone to the tourney along hundreds of other knights, freeriders and various adventurers to try his fortune. He didn't get past the eliminations stage, which speaks of his prowess. It's in the Tourney of Gnats on Joffrey's nameday that we finally hear he is "a freerider in the service of Lord Baelish," so it's then when we know he is his man, but not before. My own understanding is that Baelish hired him after the Hand's tournament.

As for him knowing even if he wasn't in his service, I am not sure that's the case. It's not something that is common knowledge outside the castle, and if Brune wasn't in his service, he wouldn't live in the castle. And even within the castle, not everyone saw the confrontation. What Baelish did was public, but not "everyone" was in the throne room, and those who were are soldiers mostly, not counting the royal family, the Hound, Ser Barristan, the Kingsguard, Slynt, etc., and the two men implicated. And none of them have a reason to tell Sansa. But then, consider this: who knows that Littlefinger betrayed Lord Eddard? They would have had to know of the Gold Cloaks agreement, for example, and that's something the people present didn't know, so to them Baelish putting a dagger to Ned's throat would merely look like him being loyal to the Lannisters and taking their side. Sansa saw him in the first Council session after she was freed from confinement, and to her at that stage, with her ignorance of how Baelish operates, it would also look like him being loyal to the regime. The ones that knew that are still alive are the Lannister siblings, Varys, and Littlefinger himself. The Hound was there, too, but whether he did know about the Gold Cloaks is doubtful unless he heard something from Cersei, and that would account for why he never mentions to Sansa how her father was arrested. In any case, considering the things Sansa already knows of Littlefinger, she'd need to know it was him who put the dagger to her father's throat, not necessarily all the minutiae of the betrayal, to realise what happened.

[Lyanna Stark]

The Ultimate Ser Lyn Corbray collection

Some more stuff on Lyn Corbray because we all love us some sausage (sorry for the extremely bad pun :P ). Ser Lyn is peculiarly placed in the TWOW spoiler chapter and while there have been some posts on him before, we haven't spent a lot of the Sansa pages discussing him. However, he seems to have a more and more prominent position in Sansa's story line and may be worth an extra look.

Part 1: AGOT-AFFC

Our first introduction to Corbray is from Tyrion, who describes him as early on as before his Trial at the Eyrie. The words he used are "slender as a sword".

Later, we get some choice words from Corbray, which could be potentially interesting:

"The gods favour the man with the just cause," said Ser Lyn Corbray, "yet often that turns out to be the man with the surest sword. We all know who that is." He smiled modestly.

Well. Very modest man indeed, Ser Lyn.

The next time we see Ser Lyn, Lysa is eating a blackberry off his dagger. Catelyn comments on his unsuitability as a suitor to Lysa.

Catelyn was hard-pressed to say which man was more unsuitable. Eon Hunter was even older than Jon Arryn had been, half cripped by gout, and cursed by three quarrelsome sons, each more grasping than the last. Ser Lyn was a different sort of folly; lean and handsome, heir to an ancient but impoverished house, but vain, reckless, hot-tempered...and, it was whispered, notoriously uninterested in the charms of women.

So Cat knows which way Lyn swings, but unlike Littlefinger she does not reference "boys", just that he is uninterested in the charms of women.

Ser Lyn also comments on Tyrion's trial that first he'll have a trial, and then an execution, as if it was a done thing. He is also the one who gets to usher Tyrion out the Bloody Gate and is then described as "stone faced".

In AFFC we get Nestor Royce and Littlefinger in a conversation where Nestor comments that Lyn Corbray is a dangerous man and Littlefinger says that Ser Lyn has taken a dislike to him, but that he will still be invited to the Eyrie. Initially, Littlefinger even describes Ser Lyn as "some Corbrays" he invited. It's only when Nestor enquires that he specifies it is Ser Lyn.

Another man who views Ser Lyn as dangerous is Kevan Lannister, who talks about it in a meeting of Lannisters in Kings Landing. If Kevan thinks Ser Lyn is dangerous, it means Tywin thinks he is too, since as Tyrion says, Kevan hasn't had a thought that Tywin didn't think first. Kevan discusses with Tyrion, Cersei and Tywin that Littlefinger has agreed to woo lady Lysa and to become the Protector of the Vale, effectively queue jumping Ser Lyn Corbray, Horton Redfort and Bronze Yohn Royce, which are all mentioned and labelled "dangerous men, all in their own way, and proud".

Littlefinger later comments in AFFC specifically on Lyn Corbray.

"Ser Lyn is not the sort of man to stay away when blood is in the offing."

This does not soothe Sansa's fears, and she reflects that Ser Lyn has killed as many men in duels as he has in battle. We also know that Lyn Corbray cut down Prince Lewyn Martell of Dorne, although the prince was said to have been badly wounded already. Littlefinger cautions Sansa against mentioning this though.

"That's not a point you'll want to raise with Corbray, though.Those who do are soon given the chance to ask Martell himself the truth of it, down in the halls of hell."

Littlefinger then goes on to explain that while Lyonel Corbray is swayed to Littlefinger's side, Ser Lyn goes his own way independent of his older brother. Then we get an interesting commentary on how Lyonel spent his energy on saving his father while Ser Lyn picked up the sword Lady Forlorn and went on killing. Littlefinger continues with some comments on how Ser Lyn feels about his brother Lyonel.

"..whilst Ser Lyn... well, he loves Lyonel as much as he loves me. He wanted Lysa's hand for himself."

Sweetrobin then confesses to not liking Ser Lyn and that he does not want to have him in the Eyrie. In AFFC we get Sansa's description of Ser Lyn as he comes up to the Eyrie with the Lords Declarant.

The youngest man in the party had three ravens on his chest, each clutching a blood-red heart in its talons. His brown hair was shoulder length; one stray lock curled down across his forehead. Ser Lyn Corbray, Alayne thought, with a wary glance at his hard mouth and restless eyes.

When Bronze Yohn seems to at first recognise Alayne as Sansa, and when she is then explained to be Littlefinger's bastard daughter, Ser Lyn shows himself as being quite rude and uncouth.

"Littlefinger's little finger has been busy," said Lyn Corbray, with a wicked smile.

Lady Waynwood asks how old Alayne is, and gets the reply that she is four and ten, and not a child but "a maiden flowered", at which point Lord Hunter (one of the younger ones now who helped off the father) comments that she's hopefully not deflowered.

"Yet," said Lyn Corbray, as if she were not there. "But ripe for the plucking soon, I'd say."

Lady Waynwood then tells Corbray that he is being rude and to mind his tongue.

"My tongue is my concern," Corbray replied. "Your ladyship should take care to mind her own. I have never taken kindly to chastisement, as any number of dead men can tell you."

When the Lords Declarant files into the Eyrie solar, they all sit side by side, apart from Nestor Royce who sits down closer to Littlefinger and Lyn Corbray who goes to stand beside the hearth instead. Sansa observes him.

Alayne saw him smile at Lothor Brune. Ser Lyn is very handsome for an older man, she thought, but I do not like the way he smiles.

When Littlefinger suggests that the Lords Grafton and Lynderly send him their sons as wards to be fostered with Sweetrobin, Ser Lyn seems dismissive.

Lyn Corbray laughed. "Two pups from a pair of lapdogs."

When Bronze Yohn Royce sets the ultimatum that they will have Lord Sweetrobin or else, it seems they reached an impasse in the negotiations. However, this is when Corbray makes his move.

For a moment it seemed as though they had come to an impasse, until Lyn Corbray turned from the fire.

"All this talk makes me ill. Littlefinger will talk you out of your smallclothes if you let him long enough. The only way to settle his sort is with steel." He drew his longsword.

Petyr spread his hands. "I wear no sword, ser."

"Easily remedied." Candlelight rippled along the smoke-grey blade of Corbray's blade, so dark it put Sansa in mind of Ice, her father's greatsword. "Your apple-eater holds a blade. Tell him to give it to you, or draw your dagger."

She saw Lothor Brune reach for his own sword, but before the blades could meet Bronze Yohn rose in wrath. "Put up your steel ser! Are you a Corbray or are you a Frey? We are guests here."

Lady Waynwood pursed her lips, and said, "This is unseemly".

"Sheathe your sword Corbray," Young Lord Hunter echoed, "you shame us all with this".

"Come, Lyn," chided Redfort in a softer tone. "This will serve for naught. Put Lady Forlorn to bed."

"My lady has a thirst," Ser Lyn insisted. "Whenever she comes out to dance, she likes a drop of red."

"Your lady must go thirsty." Bronze Yohn put himself squarely in Corbray's path.

"The Lords Declarant." Lyn Corbray snorted. "You should have named yourself the Six Old Women.

He slid the dark sword back into its scabbard and left them, shouldering Brune aside as if he were not there. Alayne listened to his footsteps recede.

Overall, Cat's initial assessment of Ser Lyn seems correct. He comes across as vain, reckless and hot-tempered.

To be continued...

[brashcandy]

I love the Ser Lyn collection, Lyanna! :D The continuation should be just as revealing. It's interesting how all the quotes amount to a strikingly singular impression of the man: dangerous, volatile, and ambitious. Ser Lyn has been playing the game for a long time, and it's no wonder that he's quite fed up by the time of this new chapter. Littlefinger was smart enough to co-opt the most hot-tempered man in his potential enemies, yet these quotes show he's underestimated the extent of Lyn's appetites. The image of him feeding Lysa a blackberry off a dagger says it all really. In the meeting with the other Lords Declarant, it is Horton Redfort who speaks to him in a "softer tone" and Mychel Redfort of course used to squire at one point for Lyn. If Sansa wanted a way into Lyn's confidence, she might have tried Mychel by way of Mya, but her approach in Winds seems to be tackling the problem directly on her own. It's a dangerous game for everyone, however, as Lyn is really a wildcard in the truest sense of the word.

[Lyanna Stark]

I love the Ser Lyn collection, Lyanna! :D The continuation should be just as revealing. It's interesting how all the quotes amount to a strikingly singular impression of the man: dangerous, volatile, and ambitious. Ser Lyn has been playing the game for a long time, and it's no wonder that he's quite fed up by the time of this new chapter. Littlefinger was smart enough to co-opt the most hot-tempered man in his potential enemies, yet these quotes show he's underestimated the extent of Lyn's appetites. The image of him feeding Lysa a blackberry off a dagger says it all really. In the meeting with the other Lords Declarant, it is Horton Redfort who speaks to him in a "softer tone" and Mychel Redfort of course used to squire at one point for Lyn. If Sansa wanted a way into Lyn's confidence, she might have tried Mychel by way of Mya, but her approach in Winds seems to be tackling the problem directly on her own. It's a dangerous game for everyone, however, as Lyn is really a wildcard in the truest sense of the word.

Yes! I was surprised myself when compiling the quotes what a clear picture actually emerged of Ser Lyn Corbray and wow is he a piece of work, and not in a pleasant sort of way either. He really is rude, short tempered, volatile and proud. Cat had the right of it in AGOT and it makes it even more amazing how willing Littlefinger is to play with fire here. Lyn Corbray is not just a dangerous man, he is a volatile dangerous man very close to an explosion. Given that Ser Lyn is comfortable threatening Lady Waynwood and then drawing cold steel a la Frey basically shaming himself and his companions for money really makes him seem like someone close to going off the rails completely. It makes you wonder what on earth LF is thinking annoying the man.

What is perhaps the strangest thing is how upset Ser Lyn seems about being displaced as Lysa's suitor, although he could hardly have had any interest in Lysa as a woman or a person.