Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Ran

[Book Spoilers] EP501 Discussion

Recommended Posts

Brienne is depressed over what happened in the last season finale. She didn't think one of Lady Cat's daughters would choose the Hound over her and run. She will snap out of it (next week, since the previews show her fighting someone).



So the show has clearly established Dany has no control over the Dragons, which seems to lead to her scene was Drogan down the road. It also opens the door for the Dragon Horn. How do they introduce the horn if they even bother without the Grey Joys? The Martells?


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've finally managed to watch the season opener - here are some thoughts:



+ The opening scene with Young Cersei was pretty well done; the flashback was a nice way to introduce as to Cersei's childhood. The casting of Nell Williams was excellent; the entire scene had me excited.


+ Nice scenes with Tyrion and Varys. Those two are definitely a pairing with an interesting dynamic. I had to love out loud at Tyrion's "I killed my father with a crossbow" and then Varys' answer: "I never said you were perfect". By the way, I love that Pentos setting.


+ I liked the bed scene of Daario and Daenerys (although I still don't understand what it is she likes about Daario apart from his body :D) and the background information about Daario. He's right about his comment that Dany can't be a dragon queen with no dragons. Emilia Clarke's acting worked fine for me; the frightening confrontation with her dragons was intriguing. Magnificient inclusion of Viserion and Rhaegal; it's always a delight to see the dragons.


~ Everything about the Wall was okay. Not good, not bad - not really involving, I felt. Mance's fear was consistent; it added a lot of credibility to his character. So, I suppose we won't see Mance/Rattleshirt?


~ The following scenes surrounding the plots in King's Landing were not as captivating as the introduction, but still good stuff. The Jaime/Cersei scene was nice, and I liked to see Kevan and Lancel again. Good decision to include a conversation between Loras and Margaery; they definitely deserve some attention as brother and sister.


- How often will we still have to see Lorasex-scenes? I can't stand that Olyvar. The rest of the scene (Loras' and Margaery's dialogue) was cool, though.


- Grey Worm and Missandei seem to be pointless, although I like Nathalie Emmanuel's acting. Her scene with Grey Worm seemed boring nevertheless.


- I didn't get the point of those Pod/Brienne and Sansa/Littlefinger scenes at all. Filler scenes, in my opinion, and definitely nothing that will stay in my mind.



Good season opener, but I hope the next episode will be more interesting with the introduction of Dorne and the House of Black and White.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was surprised by the lack of interesting and memorable quotes in this episode. Usually at least there's one or two, but all the conversations seemed toned down and bland this time around. They're not bad, but they definitely didn't keep things engaging.



Dunno how I feel about all the changes. I try not to judge the show only based on the books and how well it presented the given material (I'm all for changes, so long as they're interesting and work), so I'll reserve judgment and see where they take things. Might turn out well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How is LF going to convince Sansa that wedding Ramsay is in her best interest in avenging her family?

I don't know but I'm worried they go to some simplification like that (Roose Bolton killed your family, marry his son in order to be close to them and avenge yourself by killing them, now that you're an independent strong woman and all)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know what I really loved about this episode, that feeling that the Starks are right Winter is coming. Like when we are in KL and it's all sunny and warm, I could feel the cold, Or when we were in tropical Pentos all sunny and the ocean, very chilly feeling. The Vale where you can see Sansa, Littlefinger, and Royce in the lush green lanscape near the lovely ocean sweating in the shade. Oh and the hot baked sands of Meereen giving one the feeling of frost. Cant's to get the chilly cold darkness of the Water Gardens of Dorne. I mean I can see the fear of Winter coming most at the wall, where while the ground is mostly black dirt and mud, you could see light sprinklings of of powdered sugar here or there and it was nearly a centimeter deep in some spots.

The ability of D&D to relate the cold of late autumn early winter on the show is amazing. Truly a skill. Guys where should we film the lush Water Gardens of Dorn, or the cold hard Iron Islands? Mmmmmmmm, well we will probably be forced to film in some place like Spain and it will be all pretty and warm. And this suppose to be early winter and we do need to start relating the cold threat of winter, so the Iron Islands... Ha I 'm just fucking with we are going to party... film in Spain. Any more Greenland shoots? Fuck noooo, I am thiking of moving the Wall set location to the Bahamas.

Winters coming? Ha! More like it's better in the Bahamas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The scenes on the wall were amazing. Jon shooting Mance, giving him "mercy",so to speak, is probably the highlight of this episode, On the flipside, I don't really see the point of Davos being present on the wall yet. He hardly seems like himself.



Young Cersei was surprisingly good, albeit probably a bit older. Leaving out the valonqar didn't bother me at all actually, whereas I got the feeling reading previews they somehow mucked it up.



Tyrion and Varys added some comedy. It was good, but quite ordinary. Varys particularly annoyed me with his constant patriotism.



Brienne and Pod- don't know where they are headed now that Lady Stoneheart is probably out of the picture.



I feel sad for what they turned Loras into. Seems like a walking, talking stereotypical gay character that would be more in place at Two and a Half Men than King's Landing. On the brightside, his "force to be reckoned with" condolence was quite amusing, even if highly out of character from the books.


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is anyone else's cable constantly pixelating and freezing during this episode?

Yes, we also had that problem. We knew it wasn't our satellite - no clouds or rain. We were seriously getting concerned about it - afraid we would miss something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The episode wasn't bad. I kinda enjoyed the thing. I have a lot of criticism that has nothing to do with the plot (surprisingly) or the deviations. But I have to speak up about this: I'm getting very tired of the sexposition and Loras being treated like all he does is have sex with dudes because he's gay. We got it, he's gay. Does he have a disease in which he could die if he doesn't have sex or something? I'm not a prude. It would be very hypocritical of me to say "oh, noes... two naked dudes!", but come on. I was actually considering to turn out the tv because that was one of the most unnecessary scenes I've ever seen in a tv show, and I won't even mention the fact that is very much character assassination .o.

Give them a chance and wait to see what Loras' arc is this season. Good chance they are heading towards someone like Cersei finding out beyond a doubt he's gay then punishing him to get back at margaery. If this is the case, that scene was extremely necessary.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I liked the introduction scene with Maggy the Frog. They left out the final part of the prophecy as not to give too much away to the show watchers. But a good scene.


Cersei put up a good shield during Tywin’s funeral. Remember the show lacks the internal dialogue that the books have, so seeing her be cold is pretty accurate.


Lancel being a religious fanatic, seems the tone of this season is fanaticism, not only religious but political adding to the mix. Dave and Dan putting their spin in the story that doesn’t belong in a Dark Ages story.


I enjoyed Stannis and Jon Snow, Jon did good with Mance at the end. Also, Stannis is correct, it is a fair deal for The Wildlings, he needs more troops, and he needs troops who know terrain and cold weather, he needs them to overwhelm Bolton and the North and to send a signal to the rest of Westeros.


First time they’ve made Stannis seem human since season 3.


Dany and the Sons of the Harpy, a good introduction. A story straight from the books, and not a bad looking Harlot either (Hottie!) .


Daario was all right, he has no butt, but he was all right. Dany is afraid of her dragons, you see Dany bungling ruling like she did in ADWD. Good job by Emilia Clarke.


The Olyvar/Loras scene, . . pass . . not my thing. I turned to A.D.


Tyrion and Varys were great, Dinklage is the best actor left on this show. The show will struggle without Dance, and some of the other strong actors who were killed off in Season 3 and 4.


A good episode, not a great episode.


Weakest Season premier, on par with Season 2 . . .


Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I feel sad for what they turned Loras into. Seems like a walking, talking stereotypical gay character that would be more in place at Two and a Half Men than King's Landing. On the brightside, his "force to be reckoned with" condolence was quite amusing, even if highly out of character from the books.

Wait...how is Loras anything LIKE the stereotype of gay men? I've heard a great many stereotypes of gay men and Loras doesn't match any of them. I don't see how laying in bed with another man makes him a 'stereotypical gay man'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wait...how is Loras anything LIKE the stereotype of gay men? I've heard a great many stereotypes of gay men and Loras doesn't match any of them. I don't see how laying in bed with another man makes him a 'stereotypical gay man'.

High risk sex=gay stereotype.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

High risk sex=gay stereotype.

High risk sex = everyone in the show. Are they gay stereotypes, too?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

High risk sex = everyone in the show. Are they gay stereotypes, too?

Actually the majority of people in the show never have sex at all or have sex outside of a committed relationship. "Everyone" in the show doesn't have high risk sex.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually the majority of people in the show never have sex at all or have sex outside of a committed relationship. "Everyone" in the show doesn't have high risk sex.

Uh, no. That's incorrect

Oberyn (brothel)

Tyrion (whores)

Tywin (sleeping with Tyrion's whore)

Cersei (sleeping with Lancel and Jaime)

Robert (sleeping with everyone)

Jon (Ygritte was definitely not a virgin, as she said herself)

Dany (sleeping with Daario)

Theon (sleeping with a random chick on a boat)

Robb (sleeping with Talisa, whom he didn't know very well)

Stannis (sleeping with Melisandre, who is definitely not a virgin)

And just because you are in a committed relationship with someone doesn't mean you are having 'safe sex'...especially during a time when little was understood about STDs and their transmission.

Edited by sj4iy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Uh, no. That's incorrect

Oberyn (brothel)

Tyrion (whores)

Tywin (sleeping with Tyrion's whore)

Cersei (sleeping with Lancel and Jaime)

Robert (sleeping with everyone)

Jon (Ygritte was definitely not a virgin, as she said herself)

Dany (sleeping with Daario)

Theon (sleeping with a random chick on a boat)

Robb (sleeping with Talisa, whom he didn't know very well)

Stannis (sleeping with Melisandre, who is definitely not a virgin)

And just because you are in a committed relationship with someone doesn't mean you are having 'safe sex'...especially during a time when little was understood about STDs and their transmission.

LMAO, what does not being a virgin have to do with anything? High risk sex is sex with a stranger or a whore. You can't count Robb and his wife or Jon and Ygritte, that's takes away any meaning to the term of high risk sex. But, whatever, you think Loras who has sex with an untrusthworthy male prostitute who has betrayed him is not anything close to a gay stereotype, great, but many people don't agree.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wait...how is Loras anything LIKE the stereotype of gay men? I've heard a great many stereotypes of gay men and Loras doesn't match any of them. I don't see how laying in bed with another man makes him a 'stereotypical gay man'.

When laying in bed with another men is the most important thing he does in the show, it becomes stereotypical. When other people talk about him, the thing they talk about is his sexual orientation. Even his grandmother! When he has some dialogue, his most important lines of the show were fucking marriage fashion tips. If you still believe this is not a gay stereotype, I don't know what is.

Try asking book readers or show viewers what is the first thing they think about Loras. Book readers will tell you how good a jouster he his, how loyal he his,... and some will tell you that he's gay. Show viewers will almost unanimously tell you: "that's Margaery's gay brother, right?".

Show Loras only exists on the show to be the gay guy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Give them a chance and wait to see what Loras' arc is this season. Good chance they are heading towards someone like Cersei finding out beyond a doubt he's gay then punishing him to get back at margaery. If this is the case, that scene was extremely necessary.

I agree. I think it could prove pivotal when the high Sparrow plot arc begins. Margery has been seen in the same room as her naked brother.

In this scene Margery is telling her brother to be discrete. Does she follow her own advice? Well who knows but it is priming the audience for what is on its way.

Brienne is depressed over what happened in the last season finale. She didn't think one of Lady Cat's daughters would choose the Hound over her and run. She will snap out of it (next week, since the previews show her fighting someone).

So the show has clearly established Dany has no control over the Dragons, which seems to lead to her scene was Drogan down the road. It also opens the door for the Dragon Horn. How do they introduce the horn if they even bother without the Grey Joys? The Martells?

No, she has no control over those particular two. A given person can only ride one dragon. Perhaps Drogon is already bonded with Dani so she cannot ride the other two.

The Greyjoys have to make some sort of reappearance at some time. But maybe thats for Season 6. Why introduce the dragon horn to the plot before Dani can even ride one of them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×