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Lord Varys

[Book Spoilers] Is Aegon truly gone for good?

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With Varys 'coming together with some like-minded people to bring about a Targaryen restoration' it is entirely likely that Aegon is going to show up next season, is it not?



The Golden Company has already been mentioned last season, and if Tyrion is not traveling with Aegon the perfect way to introduce him would be next season with his surprise invasion in the Stormlands.



The fact that Illyrio is not in Pentos could also be used for a story purpose - although it would have more to do with the actor's availability - as Illyrio could, in this scenario, be with Aegon and Jon Connington when they invade.



Any thoughts on that? If the show kills off many characters that are still alive in the books there should be no trouble to introduce Aegon in season 6.


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Really? I've read speculations about that but this doesn't make any sense, or does it?



Aegon might end up marrying Myrcella so this could be done in the show with some plot-connection to the books but Doran wouldn't work with an impostor...


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Only problem with Aegon beeing alive is Varys. He would never advocate for Dany, if Aegon was alive (in the series) He would not want to send a man as brilliant as Tyrion to what can be considered an rival for the throne.


That would risk a new Blackfyre v Targaryan conflict. Atleast considering many belive Aegon is a Blackfyre pretender. So we can safely assume at this point that Aegon is not included in the series. ( For the time beeing)


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Really? I've read speculations about that but this doesn't make any sense, or does it?

Aegon might end up marrying Myrcella so this could be done in the show with some plot-connection to the books but Doran wouldn't work with an impostor...

A Targaryen marrying a Lannister? I doubt that will happen, considering who killed the Mad king and sacked the city. The Lannisters have no friends left in Westeros. Petyr has allready betrayed them, Bolton's can barely hold on to the North. The Tyrell will dispise the Lannisters by the end of this season (i hope) So i think House Lannister is the first house that will actually be exterminated. Lannisters will only survive if Tyrion befriends Dany, and takes his RIGHTFUL!!! place as the head of the house. Even that is a long shot.

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Illyrio seems to be sending Tyrion to Dany in ADwD, too. Just along with Aegon. It remains to be seen whether Varys is going all the way with Tyrion to Dany. If the Jorah plot is not changed then Varys may actually intending to meet Aegon/Illyrio/the Golden Company at Volantis and travel with them to Meereen - which is not going to happen if Varys and Tyrion are separated.



Any proof/confirmation about Trystane being Aegon?



If the Golden Company captures Lady Nym/Myrcella on the way to KL she could become a hostage and eventually the first bride of Aegon. It could serve as means to ease his ascension to the throne and force the Tyrells into submission (especially if Tommen dies or flees the city). Afterwards she would have an accident - possibly a similar gruesome fate as both Helaena and Jaehaera Targaryen (who died on the spikes in the dry moat outside of Maegor's Holdfast).



Connington was the end the line of the usurper, and Aegon most likely does not want a disfigured queen.


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The scene where he says "who said anyhing about HIM" in my opinion doesn't confirm aegon's exclusion from the show. Aegon might still be alive (saved by varys) but he doesn't have any dragons. Varys being a practical person understands that dany has he upper hand as she has dragons and so, supports her instead of young griff. Varys probably wants aegon to marry dany later on but at this very moment his cards are on dany not aegon.

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Aegon is out of the show. It would make no sense after last night that Varys has some other secondary secret agenda, especially since the show generally makes things more direct and straighforward than the books. He's gone, along with Stoneheart and the Greyjoys.


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I think there is still a chance fAegon can make it ino the show (I hate it if they do Trystane=fAegon). I will state my reasons later.


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Well, Aegon doesn't do anything in the first half of ADwD. He just is there. He only does something when he invades Westeros. If they have moved that to season 6 they could also introduce him there, especially since a few episodes with Aegon before his disappearance would simply not work this season (or make it as weird as their Greyjoy plots).



Considering that there is a chance that this will run for ten seasons we are roughly around the half right now, and nothing suggests that they are slowing down the KL plot or are inventing interesting stuff or character arcs. A Tyrell-Lannister civil will also not work with effectively non-existent Tyrells.



Varys talking about Dany is the same as Illyrio talking about Dany in ADwD. Tyrion is led to believe that Dany not Aegon is savior - and perhaps that's what they actually mean at that time. Aegon was clearly conceived as Prince Consort to Daenerys I Targaryen when Varys/Illyrio decided that he should marry the Mother of Dragons.


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Well, Aegon doesn't do anything in the first half of ADwD. He just is there. He only does something when he invades Westeros. If they have moved that in season 6 they could also introduce him there, especially since a few episodes with Aegon before his disappearance would simply not work this season (or make it as weird as their Greyjoy plots).

Considering that there is a chance that this will run for ten seasons we are roughly around the half right now, and nothing suggests that they are slowing down the KL plot or are inventing interesting stuff or character arcs. A Tyrell-Lannister civil will also not work with effectively non-existent Tyrells.

That isn't really compelling evidence - the Martells don't do anything either but they've been included. If anything, I imagine they would have introduced Aegon with Tyrion and finished the season with his invasion of Westeros. That might not seem like a lot, but it's a lot of progress to show in ten episodes.

There's absolutely no way this show runs for ten seasons. D&D have said seven seasons, and it looks like the most we'll get is a longer seventh season split across two years to give us a total of 74-6 episodes.

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Well, if they wanted to reach the end quickly they should have made one ASoS only one season, no?



According to George's talk with the HBO guys they have aimed at ten seasons from the start. That may have changed or still change but if it does not change that Aegon could easily be introduced next season.



And I imagine the Martells are there for a reason. Considering that there is no Quentyn it does not seem likely they'll ally with Dany. Which means they either stage a war entirely on their own or they end up backing somebody else - Aegon, be he Trystane or not.


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Well, if they wanted to reach the end quickly they should have made one ASoS only one season, no?

According to George's talk with the HBO guys they have aimed at ten seasons from the start. That may have changed or still change but if it does not change that Aegon could easily be introduced next season.

And I imagine the Martells are there for a reason. Considering that there is no Quentyn it does not seem likely they'll ally with Dany. Which means they either stage a war entirely on their own or they end up backing somebody else - Aegon, be he Trystane or not.

Yes, you're right, they should have. But then they would have overtaken the books more quickly.

George has said that HBO want this show to last for ten years. But D&D - the ones who make the decisions - have said they want seven seasons, or somewhere between 70-80 hours. There's no room to introduce Aegon in the show with only two seasons left after this season. And again I'll ask - why delay him when it makes so much more sense to introduce him through Tyrion?

I imagine the Martells may support Trystane/Myrcella on the throne. I agree that it's unlikely they'll end up on the same side as Dany, because that seems too convenient.

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Not confirmed yet but very likely cut from the show.

GoT could go for 8 seasons, I don't believe D&D have ruled it out and S6-S7 could include Aegon's invasion, a small scale DoD 2.0 and death if those things happen.

I also like the Trystane = Aegon theory, it would bring 2 storylines together very smoothly without having to cast a dozen other characters who've taken care of Aegon. If they go for this, I would support it 100%.

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I guess D&D can always leave and HBO can hire new show runners, no?



In the end, HBO will decide how things go through, I imagine.



I'm also not sure if Aegon being introduced through Tyrion this season will make sense if the plan is to extend Tyrion's arc into TWoW territory - say, make him a dragonrider. Having Aegon would mean to spend some time on him rather than have him just stand around there for 1-2 episodes. If they want to rush AFfC/ADwD Tyrion's journey will have to go much quicker.



As nothing suggests that Dany is going to Westeros soon we should assume that there must be some sort of plan for conflict in Westeros in the mean time. Kevan being reintroduced also suggests we might get the Epilogue double murder, although not necessarily committed by Varys.



There would be no reason to cast all the characters surrounding Aegon, anyway. Connington would suffice, and Illyrio could also hang out with him. That would be enough.


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Sure, HBO could fire D&D after seven seasons... but they're not going to. There have been numerous articles published with HBO stating that, as much as they wish the show could go on for ten years, they respect D&D's decision. Here's an example:

"If they weren’t comfortable going beyond seven seasons, I trust them implicitly and trust that’s the right decision – as horrifying as that is to me.

“What I’m not going to do is have a show continue past where the creators believe where they feel they’ve finished with the story."

As I stated earlier, it's looking more and more likely that the show will end with somewhere between 70 and 80 hours, probably 74-6. They have the rest of their story mapped out and they're heading towards the finale, whether we like it or not.

Now, moving onto whether Aegon's introduction would be best suited in season 5 or 6, I'd argue that introducing him through Tyrion makes the most sense. We've known for a few months now that Jorah will resurface in episode 3, meaning that to keep Tyrion's story at the same pace as it is, any potential introduction of Aegon would had to have been in the first 3 episodes. As far as I'm concerned, this is pretty feasible. He could have been introduced in the premiere and then they could have separated by the end of episode 3, which would allow enough time to introduce him as a character whilst still keeping Tyrion's arc moving rapidly. He then could have resurfaced at the end of the season when he invaded Westeros. So I don't think the speed of Tyrion's arc is compelling evidence.

I'd also disagree with your assertion about Daenerys. In fact, it looks to me like she should be in Westeros by mid-season 6 at the latest, considering how fast they're moving through Tyrion's arc. We know that Daznak's is episode 9, but as far as I'm aware we have no idea what comes after that in the show. For all we know, Dany could leave Meereen in the finale and march to Westeros. It certainly looks like they're heading towards concluding the Meereenese arc this season.

There is also plenty of material to cover in the beginning of season 6: Cersei's trial, whatever the Martells are planning, the aftermath of whatever happens with Brienne/Sansa/Littlefinger/Stannis/Winterfell this season, the aftermath of whatever happens at the Wall, the reintroduction of Bran, etc.

I'm assuming that season 6 will focus on Dany's invasion of Westeros, with season 7 focusing on winter and the arrival of the Others.

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Aegon is about as likely as Lady Stoneheart turning up in the S4 finale. Its not happening guys.



The show is already way to full at the moment so they are condensing plots and cutting characters galore.


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I suspect that Aegon has no need to appear so he is skipped/



Most likely that his storyline is dead-ended in the book or could be combined/with another characters - half story to Dany and half story to Trystane.



My personal theory about missing characters from the book is



1) They show up in next season (Greyjoy storyline)


2) Their storyline in the book ends with their untimely death


3) Their storyline in the book have no impact on larger storyline and major characters (ex. Lady Stoneheart kills couple of Freys but doesn't end up killing any major characters such as Jaime or Brianne).


Furthermore their storyline (and end results) could be taken over /shared between other characters



So, by totally skipping a major characters or assigning his/her path to other existing characters, by itself is a major book spoiler for me.


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I think Varys' comments confirmed it. Unless he was, of course, lying.

He said he and Illyrio met after Robert was crowned King and they realised he would be a bad King (something like that: I saw the show translated). In books, whether is truth or not, their plan seemed to have preceded the Rebellion. In the show, they seemed to have been fine with Robert until they saw the need to replace him with someone fitter. Luckily for them, Dany and Viserys were still alive. By the time Robert was crowned, Aegon and Rhaenys were dead.

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