How would you rate episode 502?

[Cyvasse Khal]

Only 5/10 for me this week, but I'm a harsh critic. I just felt a lot of dialogue was rushed in a lot of scenes tonight and they crammed a lot of story lines in. There was a lot of information and future planning for the characters to give and it just felt like they wanted to get it all out of the way this episode before moving on to more important events.

Pros

- I love Braavos, and they do a great job with the Titan, I get a kick out of seeing it.

- Meereen. I think the pace is quick enough moving through this story. They captured Dany's failing rule and her second guessing herself well this episode.

- Jaime going to Dorne. I think I like this change. I'm not 100% sure yet, but this feels like a better scenario than Jaime cleaning up Riverrun. His motivations are clear, and keeping Bronn active in the show will be a plus.

- Money well spent on the CGI Drogon, he looks awesome.

- 998th LC vote. This felt a little rushed and maybe a bit underwhelming, but I overall still enjoyed it and Sam's speech was great.

Cons

- Introduction to Dorne. This felt really underwhelming to introduce Dorne with a conversation between Ellaria and Doran that repeated stuff already known. Dorne will be big this season and to get people excited about it I think you needed the Sand Snakes in there right off the bat.

- Introducing Arya's next story. Similarly to the above, the HoBW will be a big part of this season and I really feel they didn't need to wait til the end of the episode to get Arya in there, and why would the Kindly Man/Faceless Man have the same 'Jaqen' face that Arya knows? That face should have been long discarded or at the very least not used for a long time.

- Brienne and Pod. D&D's solution to Brienne not wandering aimlessly is to have her create another enemy for herself and go on a seemingly fruitless tracking mission. We'll see what she does in the next encounter with Sansa, but i'm not holding much excitement for Brienne stuff.

- Tyrion and Varys. The only point to this scene was that people would be annoyed if Tyrion wasn't in an episode.

- Hizdahr's accent has slipped into almost completely British. Not quite what's needed there.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Cyvasse Khal

[Nictarion]

I really don't know. She is SO inconsistent, I worry for Sarah Connor.

Emilia has badass down. It's some of the more subtle stuff in the show she hasn't been great with. I think she'll be good as Sarah Connor.

I guarantee it'll bether than Kit in Pompeii. :P

Edited April 20, 2015 by Nictarion

[Balerion the kitten]

That is your opinion. I believe Barristan Selmy is lost at sea of bad acting all around him. Emilia Clarke has been consistantly the worst actress on the show.

That's a bit harsh. Sure the portrayal is different but I feel she's doing a pretty good job. Season 1 was great, the acting felt natural and realistic for the plot. After that it did start to go wobbly but that was entirely bad character development and writing on the writers part. She plays daenerys realistically, which is quite hard as they've rushed her character growth.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Balerion the kitten

[Charlie Hustle]

7 until I saw Drogon. Brought it up to a 9.

[A Redeemed Hound]

Gave it a 4, which was a struggle for me. So far my fears are coming true for this season and it is turning out as disappointing and convoluted as season 2. I get that changes will be made but this is plain stupid. So for the sake of NOT having Lady Stoneheart, we have to watch Brienne chase Sansa like a stupid cartoon chase and now Jaime is going to Dorn. Jon becoming Lord Commander was about as dramatic as watching ice melt. How great/simple would it have been if a crow lands on his shoulder after a tie is called and croaks "Snow" and then have Maester Aemon cast his vote for Jon? Would have been awesome. But this is what we are dealing with. Writers and show runners who are not true fans.

At least Bronn was brought back in and Kevin Lannister was great. I am okay with Jaqen coming back to train Arya as long as he eventually does what he does in the books. Same for Varys and Tyrion. As long as Varys does what he does in the books, all is fine.

Mereen is just as dull as in the books. No biggie. Showing Drogon now was also anti-climatic. I assume the fighting pit scene will never happen.

Anyone giving this episode high ratings cannot be book readers. I might go back and give it a 2 the more I think about it.

Edited April 20, 2015 by A Redeemed Hound

[lostinwesteros]

Will have to admit that although I gave it a 9 last night on another forum, with further thought and consideration (very good points raised by others on forum which didn't initially occur to me), I only gave it an 8 in this thread.

There were many aspects that I really liked:

• Sam's exposure of Janos Blount's cowardly behavior during the battle defending the wall (and reference to finding him "standing in a puddle of his own making" :lol:
  
• Maester Aemon's little smiles at Sam's speech and also at Jon's election
  
• The Shireen/Gilly/Sam scene. Though the Shireen focus in tv series is significantly more than it was in the books, I like it and can see the point in that

  I think Mel will try to sacrifice Shireen, as foreshadowed when she told Selyse that Shireen must accompany them to the Wall, and foreshadowed as well in Selyse's comment in this episode that Shireen was foolish/naive and knew nothing of real life. If so, I hope that will be the point at which Stannis breaks with Mel. He may not break with her at all, but one can hope.

  
  
• The portrayal of Prince Doran, which I thought was much stronger than in the books.
  
• I think the Jaime/Bronn/Dorne arc will be a good one
  
• Jaqen is back !!! Yay !!!
  
• Liked that we're finally getting to the HBW, but . . . (see not so favorite parts below)
  
• Liked the interaction between Jon and Stannis, especially that Jon couldn't resist a little smile when he read Lyanna Mormont's note to Stannis; thought the expression on Jon's face when offered legitimization as a Stark and the Lord of Winterfell was well done - subtle but so honest and telling of Jon's deepest feelings that he's had the integrity not to dwell on; and liked that Stannis basically approves of and likes Jon
  
• Liked that Ser Baristan had the courage to be so direct with Dany about factors in Aerys's demise and liked that she was wise ruler enough to change her mind accordingly
  
• Loved Dany's scene with Drogon
  
• Qyburn's request to take the head "may prove useful in my work" :lol:
  
• Kevin standing up to Cersei and walking out
  

Didn't care for:

• Brienne/Pod scene
  
• What I saw as the brevity and lack-luster-ness of Tyrion/Varys scene
  
• Dany's execution decision (though I thought the hissing of the former slaves was interesting)
  
• I felt the Arya/HBW piece didn't get nearly the coverage it should have, especially given the ep title
  
• Ellaria's portrayal - "finger by finger", please. What happened to Oberyn's strong stance of "We don't treat children in Dorne like that"
  

Edited for clarity

Edited April 20, 2015 by lostinwesteros

[RhaenysBee]

I know the fault is with me, but this was as dull as episode 1.

As much as I like Darth Sansa, attire and attitude both, the whole ordeal with Brienne, Pod, Littlefinger, Sansa and the Knights just gave me a headache. It was a very long, very pointless and very unnecessary excuse to get Podrick and Brienne to the river book readers expect a certain corpse to be found floating in. They could simply have came upon that bloody river trying to water their horses.

Dorne looks cool but the introduction did no justice to them. The dead viper with the lannister necklace was badass though.

While it's usually a delight to see Bronn, His scene with Lollys was as boring as it was long and pointless. I am very happy to have Bronn back in the fold with Jaime Fucking Lannister. And let me just say, it was one wise and brilliant notion of D&D to send Jaime to Dorne instead of Ser AnotherCharacterNobodyWillRememberOrCareAbout Oakhart.

Tyrion is still drowning in wine and self pity who on earth would have ever guessed?

As for Arya in Bravos, Maisie made those scenes worth watching, even though they weren't anything special. Thumbsup Maisie.

Kit Harington actually got emotions through, OMFG, *lifts applause sign* he pulled off the whole Jon for Lord Commander scene! His acting was close to enjoyable! Sam is so smart and sweet.

One scene I loved was the library one with Gilly, Shireen and Sam.

another scene I loved was Ser Kevan walking out on Cersei! What a pleasant moment to watch.

And here's another salute to D&D. I would have to reread to see if it makes more sense for a second time, but as far as now goes, D&D poured more content into Daenerys's Meereen storyline than ADWD managed to. And this time Emilia pulled it off. I loved Drogon's return, it was the same feeling when my dog who was lost for a week returned at the weekend. I must say though, season 4 Drogon was much more handsome than season 5 Drogon. Well, there's still season 6 and men look better at 30 than at 20 in any case, should be the same with dragons. and Drogon is a male dragon I assume. But getting over dragons and their looks, most of the show was really meh. Not bad, but not good either.

Oh and all the chatter about dragon looks gave me this idea that I really miss having a Game of Thrones crush. Drogo is dead, Oberyn is dead. Everybody crush-worthy is dead. Even Lord Tywin in dead. And show-Daario is painfully mediocre. Me misses a strong male character to drool over.

So it's a pass with 60%. Thanks to Drogon, the library and giving meaning to the Meereen ordeal. Oh yeah, the water gardens looked lovely too.

[Pashernate Reader]

LOL. I agree, Sophie's performance, which I have always liked, seems really strange to me, she did seem like she could barely stay awake in last night's episode.

To be fair to Sophie, I struggled at times, and I was only watching.

[Balerion's Whiskers]

All of the plotlines are so scattered that you just get glimpses into each story. There is so much material and what stays and what goes must be hard decisions. I gave it an 8 (actually about a 7 1/2) My non-book reader husband didn't like it at all.

I liked the Wall and the Jon/Stannis interaction, but the close election didn't win me over at all. Lyanna Mormont's letter was a good thing though. Sam roasting Janos Slynt was the best speech of the night! I liked Shireen and Gilly together too.

Tyrion and Varys are always good, but they could have used that screen time to show us some Sand Snakes. We get it that Tyrion is in the process of drinking himself to death and doesn't care.

Liked the Braavos scenes and the HoB&W...just wish there were more.

Pod and Brienne are going to have to come up with a plan.

I liked Jamie and Bron and can see where this journey could be interesting.

Small Council and Kevan's speech was great too.

All in all, entertaining, but it did seem like the Intro Episode v.2

[The hairy bear]

I've given it a 6. It owuld have been a 5, but the acting and the visual effects for Drogon added a whole point. Nothing really wrong with this one, but also nothing really good. The introduction of Dorne was bland, the election of the Jon as LC felt rushed and laked epic, the triming of Arya's list or the changing of Lord Stokeworth to Lady Stokeworth were yet another messes with the show's continuity. Dany's scenes were OK, but it was basically the remake of Lord Karstark's beheading.

[jarl the climber]

I gave it an eight.

I actually did not care for the Small Council scene. It would have been better for Cersei to have her discussion with Kevan privately. It didn;t really make sense in a lot of ways and now the Tyrells know that Cersei does not have the complete support of her House. Also how can Cersei rule if she is not Regent and does not have legal authority as Kevan implied? I suppose it worked well enough but not a great scene.

I actually liked the Mereen scenes. Dany is sitting on a powder keg. She has the love of the freedmen but if she gives them what they want, it will mean civil war. The Masters have no reason to love her and many reasons to hate her but she has to get them to buy into what she is doing. The Mossander character had some potential, I'd rather have had the Shavepate but it was a shame to see him go so quickly.

I'm not hot about the Breinne/Pod storyline but they have to start tieing things together to give the story better structure. Maybe they could have found a better way but it was needed.

They covered things at the Wall well enough. I didn't like the Dorne scene that much but I felt they did a bad job establishing the Ellaria character last season, frankly they've done a bad job in establishing Dorne period. A non reader freind wonders why Dorne didn't rise up and back Renly or Stannis if they hate the Lannisters that much. Hopefully they can get the Dornish arc straightened out this season.

[Modesty Lannister]

That's a bit harsh. Sure the portrayal is different but I feel she's doing a pretty good job. Season 1 was great, the acting felt natural and realistic for the plot. After that it did start to go wobbly but that was entirely bad character development and writing on the writers part. She plays daenerys realistically, which is quite hard as they've rushed her character growth.

And I did say I blamed the writers, didn't I? Everyone was great in season 1, because season 1 was adaptation of GRRM's book. Actors knew who their characters were and had great dialogues to work with. But, that was then ...

[Balerion the kitten]

And I did say I blamed the writers, didn't I? Everyone was great in season 1, because season 1 was adaptation of GRRM's book. Actors knew who their characters were and had great dialogues to work with. But, that was then ...

My bad, sometimes there's a bit of the comment I read but then I miss the rest. My comment was only towards the Emila Clarke being a bad actress, I hadn't read the rest.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Balerion the kitten

[LittleMissTyrell]

I gave it a 6/10 it didn't wow me as my favorite episode and I wasn't completely thrilled with it either

That scene with Shireen and Gilly reading was good

Meeren wasn't bad I like the Daenarys scenes

The House of black and white was okay

Kevan Lannister being a badass

Scenes I didn't like:

Dorne was terrible in my opinion

Jaime and Bronn in Dorne

Cerseis Small council was to small

[Tolsimir]

It was much better than the first one. I gave it a 6/10. It was actually enjoyable to watch, though it did have several silly moments.

Worst was the Cersei-Jaime scene AGAIN. The more I watch those two the more I believe that the showrunners just favour Headey for some reason and don't want her to appear in a completely negative light. So now characters around her have to suffer for it. Show Jaime is just a complete mess at this point.

Next failure are the Sansa/Brienne/LF scenes. Now I see why people speculated Sansa will get married to Ramsay. Which still makes no sense at all. Brienne is still just a thug. And apparently Sansa's transformation made her a douchebag.

Tyrion/Varys dialogue was just bad. And not because of the actors.

Dorne was....awkward. Maybe it's just me but I don't remember Ellaria having a Spanish accent. I also did not appreciate the show turning her into a silly saturday morning cartoon villain. Doran was excellent at least.

The last Daenerys scene was stupid. I was literally facepalming the whole time and when the hissing started I couldn't watch anymore. It was just so bad.

Looking at the list above maybe 6 is too generous. But the change this episode, compared to the last, was that I actually enjoyed it. Yes some parts were a complete mess and didn't make sense, but I had fun for the most part.

Most enjoyable was definitely the Wall storyline. The only thing I was missing was Mormont's raven.

The first Mereen scene was OK too. As was Arya's storyline.

[Ser Creighton]

I liked the Meereen story in Episode 501, but this week felt like they were doing the complete opposite of what GRRM wrote. A trial for an ex-slaver (instead of question sharply) and a swift execution in front of the entire city for a former slave? I tilted my head to one side and just went "wut...?"

I did love the Drogon/Dany stuff. I'll never say no to my Queen and her baby.

One more thing to add to why I'm not feeling this episode quite as much: can I have Jorah back now please?

It's intresting that nobody wanted to really question the guy with the Harpy mask who you know works for them. Hi where did you get the mask. Though you never get a chance, as he is murdered. The fact that a public execution is choosen made little sense and the show did not even address it, they just wanted the scene. What bothered me is that in the books the slavers often refer to the slaves as nothing more than animals. So D&D decided to depict them as hissing, snarling, teeth baring animals. I mean look at the body language in that scene, with former slaves getting down on their hands, and swaying as if to strike, while hissing, snarling, baring their teeth, and flaring their noses. Dare god way to enforce the slavers beliefs. I can't imagine how D&D read the books. Oh the slavers say they are like animals we should probably make them act like dumb animals, ok everyone snalr and bare your teeth, you people over thier get down on your hands and act like dogs who are about to attack, we need more snarling and teeth baring, remember your former slaves and slaves act like animals.

Because just acting angry and yelling, and throwing stoness won't get the point across that your upset. Act like animals grrrrr lets see those teeth. I need more nose flaring and teeth baring come on now, you are freed slaves. Maybe we should have them bark? No lets have them hiss and sway like serpents. Great body language direction. I just glad they were not biting anyone in the ankle and chewing on bones. Maybe next week, got to make sure they are anamalistic idiots. Of course the slavers are being depicted as easy to negotiate with. Oh Yunkai has agreed to all your terms, done and done. And Hiz, here let me give you good advice and more good advice while me and Darrio are all buddy buddy.

Darrio: I keep telling her she should let me take your head. (Sly Grinn)

Hiz: Hey that's not funny, she might do it. Oh how can I stay mad at you, look at that grin. We work so well together.

Darrio: Oh my super powers tell me their is a slave behind this wall and his leg is right here. Just how did he get in the wall? Did he plaster himself in their? No hidden door an actual solid all.

Love that all the men are making either noble or smart choices, while the woman? Well I guess thinking goes out the door for them on this show. Sansa, bad choice after bad choice. Cersei, don't have to say much. Selyse, yeah don;t have to say much. Mel, I like cock, cock gives me shadow baby power, and I am dark and scary. Ellaria, grrrrr kill children who have done nothing wrong. Dany hey I know lets have ap ublic execution now put all the slaves here and the slavers here. This going to go over big. Missy, do you have a penis, Marg, plot, plot, plot, manipulate child, Arya oh kill, kill, kill, dead eyes, Gilly I know what an S is, yeh an S. Lollys I am so sweet and stupid OMG Jaime Lannister, breath, breath. Shit Dany made a good choice about the law being the law and holding a trial for a criminal, quick stupid public execution and lets not even bother with a reason for it, but lets make sure to show the men making the right call and Dany making the wrong one. Note the Tyrion comment, Cersei' best part and his. Not that Cersei is a good person, just consider it an overall theme that D&D are enforcing.

Yep, that's ummm that is a great way to depict women. So empowering D&D, good thing all the men are around to guide them and show them how to do things the right way.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Ser Creighton

[Ran]

254 votes in, 7.15 average, 7.26 with top/bottom 5% removed.

This is the second lowest rated second episode in the series to date, behind only "The Night Lands"

[Ser Muradin the Small]

I rated it 7. While there were lots of positives, like Drogon, Shireen&Gilly, Lyanna Mormont etc the LC election was quite a let down for me personally. They didn't manage to transfer the tension around it too well.

[Bluetiger]

8/10

+ KEVAN & small council meeting

+ riot in Mereen

+ Braavos

+ Bronn & Lollys

+ Doran

+ Lyanna Mormont

+ Sam, Gilly, Jon, Stannis, elections, Aemon

- X-ray Daario

- Dany's speech during execution

Edited April 20, 2015 by Blue Tiger

[intheswamp]

Love that all the men are making either noble or smart choices, while the woman? Well I guess thinking goes out the door for them on this show. Sansa, bad choice after bad choice. Cersei, don't have to say much. Selyse, yeah don;t have to say much. Mel, I like cock, cock gives me shadow baby power, and I am dark and scary. Ellaria, grrrrr kill children who have done nothing wrong. Dany hey I know lets have ap ublic execution now put all the slaves here and the slavers here. This going to go over big. Missy, do you have a penis, Marg, plot, plot, plot, manipulate child, Arya oh kill, kill, kill, dead eyes, Gilly I know what an S is, yeh an S. Lollys I am so sweet and stupid OMG Jaime Lannister, breath, breath. Shit Dany made a good choice about the law being the law and holding a trial for a criminal, quick stupid public execution and lets not even bother with a reason for it, but lets make sure to show the men making the right call and Dany making the wrong one. Note the Tyrion comment, Cersei' best part and his. Not that Cersei is a good person, just consider it an overall theme that D&D are enforcing.

Yep, that's ummm that is a great way to depict women. So empowering D&D, good thing all the men are around to guide them and show them how to do things the right way.

Cersei and Margaery are depicted in a much better light on the show than they are in the books. GRRM's female characters tend to be stupid, crazy, and/or sex-crazed. The main exception is Arya, a tomboy and killer.