Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Yup. I'd say white walkers and wights showing up after thousands of years, alone, qualifies Qhorin's statement as true. And I said from the beginning, 'north of the Wall' is another matter entirely. The fact remains that old powers are awakening in Westeros, just as much as they are in Essos, if not more so. Westeros went from having a population of zero giants and skinchangers, to suddenly having several. Westeros went from corpses staying dead, to a sudden flux of undead neighbors and citizens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfmaid7 Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Yup. I have no idea how many Blackwoods exist. But there is only 1 living Targaryen (possible hidden targs aside), and 4 living Starks. Hey you're the one that stirred this pot, not me! LOL So you agree the old powers are waking? Because that means they were once asleep... Noooo i agree they are stirring,where once they were not.Stirring as in to take an active part.Contacting Bran,sending the Starks the Direwolves etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfmaid7 Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Yup. I'd say white walkers and wights showing up after thousands of years, alone, qualifies Qhorin's statement as true. And I said from the beginning, 'north of the Wall' is another matter entirely. The fact remains that old powers are awakening in Westeros, just as much as they are in Essos, if not more so. Westeros went from having a population of zero giants and skinchangers, to suddenly having several. Westeros went from corpses staying dead, to a sudden flux of undead neighbors and citizens. Wait you confusing me,you can't have your cake and eat it too.Everything is still North of the Wall.The only undead currently South of the Wall is LSH. Are you not including North of the Wall as part of Westeros?Because it sounds like if you aren't and then you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaegarslance Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Really.6 kids from the same household as wargs. And direwolves at that. And south of the Wall. And one a greenseer.The wights themselves are a big jump. And Beric and Stoneheart are something newish crazy.The alchemists can produce better wildfire.Magic is on the rise and spreading. That's just the way GRRM wrote the story.And I bet the main reason Robert Strong is 'alive' is because of the newly renewed magic. I'm talking strictly Westoros magic. Beric/Stoneheart/alchemists are all eastern types of magic. We don't know how Robert's animated so I can't say for sure what's animating him and whether or not it's the native Westoros magic or the foreign eastern magic. The point is though, I'm not dismissing that magic is on the rise. I agree. I'm simply saying that Westoros type magic (warging, skinchanging, greenseeing, giants, etc) has always been there and never waned like eastern magic did. It might be on the rise as well, but they're not suddenly re-discovering old powers like the alchemists and red priests are. That's only the Others and wights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Wait you confusing me,you can't have your cake and eat it too.Everything is still North of the Wall.The only undead currently South of the Wall is LSH. Are you not including North of the Wall as part of Westeros?Because it sounds like if you aren't and then you are.Othor and Jafer were south of the Wall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 I'm talking strictly Westoros magic. Beric/Stoneheart/alchemists are all eastern types of magic. We don't know how Robert's animated so I can't say for sure what's animating him and whether or not it's the native Westoros magic or the foreign eastern magic. The point is though, I'm not dismissing that magic is on the rise. I agree. I'm simply saying that Westoros type magic (warging, skinchanging, greenseeing, giants, etc) has always been there and never waned like eastern magic did. It might be on the rise as well, but they're not suddenly re-discovering old powers like the alchemists and red priests are. That's only the Others and wights.If we are treating the Others as a non-westerosi form of magic, I guess I agree. But they seem like a very big problem with your statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfmaid7 Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Othor and Jafer were south of the Wall Yeah they were,it doesn't contradict what i'm saying.They were "brought" South by the idiots who didn't think they should be burn.You still didn't clarify though the red bolded. And I said from the beginning, 'north of the Wall' is another matter entirely. The fact remains that old powers are awakening in Westeros, just as much as they are in Essos, if not more so. Westeros went from having a population of zero giants and skinchangers, to suddenly having several. This actually validates what i'm saying about there being a concentration and gathering of magical beings in Westeros. They all for various reasons are heading there beinging their abilities with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Cooterian Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Alas! I almost wish Season F**e had not even started. I don't even know where to plug in any more without the risk of someone's warhammer shattering the rubies off my breastplate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Yeah they were,it doesn't contradict what i'm saying.They were "brought" South by the idiots who didn't think they should be burn.You still didn't clarify though the red bolded. Sure, no problem. From the wiki: Westeros is one of the four known continents in the known world, the others being Essos, Sothoryos, and Ulthos. Most of the area of Westeros is covered by a political entity known as the Seven Kingdoms, while the far north beyond the Wall includes the free folk. So there is one region of Westeros north of the Wall, and another region of Westeros south of the Wall. Just as all the Free Cities are in Essos, not all of Essos is contained within the Free Cities. This is how I am using the term Westeros. Not all of the continent exists south of the Wall. The Seven Kingdoms of course lie to the south, but that land is still a part of Westeros... as are the the lands of the far north beyond the Wall. The Fist is in Westeros. The Lands of Always Winter are in Westeros. Just as Quarth, the Mother of Mountains, and Meereen are in Essos. If you want to talk about the Seven Kingdoms, specifically, let's recap. The dead in the 7K used to stay dead. Now, not one, not two, but four corpses that were once dead as doornails have risen from the dead. Two of them rose north of the Neck with eyes that burned blue like those of white walkers. Two of them rose from the dead south of the Neck, and their eyes didn't burn. For as long as anyone can remember, the dead rot in the ground. Now, four corpses have risen to walk among the living in the 7K. Two of them were escorted from Westerosi lands beyond the Wall to Castle Black on the southern side. South of the Neck, one living corpse kissed another corpse and brought it to life after it had been dead for quite some time. So if we are just talking about the part of Westeros south of the Wall, it went from an undead population (in all of remembered history) of zero... and now suddenly within the last two years, there have now been four citizens of the realm that have risen from the dead. If we include the land of Westeros north of the Wall, that number is of course far higher. No matter how you slice it, I'm still seeing Qhorin tossing his hands one-and-a-half hands in the air saying, "Well yeah?! I told you the old powers were waking!" Alas! I almost wish Season F**e had not even started. I don't even know where to plug in any more without the risk of someone's warhammer shattering the rubies off my breastplate. I hear the Inn at the Crossroads has free WiFi now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Cooterian Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 I hear the Inn at the Crossroads has free WiFi now... I would be afraid that the Hound would be there looking for free "chickens" and Arya with needle nicking my achilles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 I would be afraid that the Hound would be there looking for free "chickens" and Arya with needle nicking my achilles.Free WiFi is not without risks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Cooterian Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Free WiFi is not without risks Exactly...you never know who is listening in on the other side of the "weir-net". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Exactly...you never know who is listening in on the other side of the "weir-net".And who knows what the hackers with glass candles are able to see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Cooterian Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Well, couldn't you also ask who might be hacking (if that is possible) into the weirwoods?I'm not in a position to state this accurately but I suppose a case could be made that Bloodraven was hacking into Mel's pyro-worship with the R'Hollor. Not sure if we've seen the reverse have we.....fire proponents hacking "the other"? ETA: and I'm using the term "the other" very loosely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Sure I gotcha. That is passing strange isn't it, her seeing BR and Bran at work. Maybe she hacked into the surveillance system. I have my suspicions regarding Quaithe as well, but who doesn't :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 We've seen that Marwyn is able to see much and more in his unflickering flame as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Cooterian Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 And who knows what the hackers with glass candles are able to see Sure I gotcha. That is passing strange isn't it, her seeing BR and Bran at work. Maybe she hacked into the surveillance system. I have my suspicions regarding Quaithe as well, but who doesn't :) Interesting that you stated Quaite, as I had just hit the search button on "glass candles" and was surprised at the instances of where they had supposdely been used in the text. Quaite, not withstanding, was at the top of the heap. I think "glass candles" might be a worthwhile topic. And with that, the Voice has yet submitted another example...... We've seen that Marwyn is able to see much and more in his unflickering flame as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 :cheers: I tryBurning Dragonglass seems to provide a technicolor glimpse into the matrix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaegarslance Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Sure I gotcha. That is passing strange isn't it, her seeing BR and Bran at work. Maybe she hacked into the surveillance system. I have my suspicions regarding Quaithe as well, but who doesn't :) I don't think she actually saw them, nor did they actually see her. A face took shape within the hearth. Stannis? she thought, for just a moment . . . but no, these were not his features. A wooden face, corpse white. Was this the enemy? A thousand red eyes floated in the rising flames. He sees me. Beside him, a boy with a wolf's face threw back his head and howled. She's seeing a representation of them (Bran with a "wolf's face"). She's not actually opening a portal and actually looking into the cave and seeing them, otherwise Bran would be, well Bran. Nor is Bloodraven following her back through her vision and seeing her. He's seeing her through his agents (his "thousand red eyes"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Cooterian Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Wanted to thank the Voice for allowing me to vent some steam. If nothing else came out of our little exchange is that the subject of "glass candles" has never really been totally vetted through Heresey. Certainly glass candles have been discussed from time to time and those (Marwyn, Quaithe, etc.) who might have attempted to use them; but never in Heresey Project. I'm sure Black Crow will correct me. Anyway, trying to return to your normal programming schedule, I noticed that an old familiar posted earlier today: You are quite right, Rhaegarsiance. Bloodraven has been watching probably since before Ned was born, but I think we can assume magic was always there even if it was very weak. The arrival of direwolves and dragons signaled that magic was growing in strength, and there has been much discussion much in the spirit of which came first the chicken or the egg. Many like Matthew below believe Dany's sacrifice of Rhaego, Mirri and Drogo was necessary to hatch dragon eggs but such a process is magic in itself. Didn't Dany dream or know intuitively what to do? How did this information or intuition come to her? Is there a dragon-side version of Bloodraven? And if Bloodraven or the Children are behind ushering in the dire wolf pups, why pick that specific moment? Having access to the weirwood memories and learning from the past must certainly be the impetus for the timing, and the wisdom for Bloodraven (and ???) to recognize the moment when it arrives. Can Bloodraven see the future? I think he's stated that he's glimpsed possibilities (not exact wording). Feather...welcome back.... :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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