Ser Triston Stark Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 So as we've seen in the book by the end of the book Tyrion and Jon are at the same time, but Jon has Greyscale, from only dipping his hand in to help Tyrion out. But Tyrion was fully amerced and even drinks some of the water, so how does he not have Greyscake but Jon does? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wolfswood Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 More like a natural immunity, rather than immunization. It is one of the clues that people latch onto to state that he is a secret Targaryen. It is a widely held belief that the Valyrian Dragon Lords and so the Targaryens had a really strong super immunity to all sorts of contagious diseases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Suburbs Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Not all Targs have immunity, as many died during the Great Spring Sickness and at other times. But it could be one of many abilities that arise from being Blood of the Dragon, which not all Targs necessarily have. Sometimes it may show up as fire resistance, sometimes in prophecy or dragon dreams, sometimes as madness. Or maybe Tyrion just got lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night's Princess Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Or maybe Tyrion does have greyscale and it's just taking its sweet time to manifest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinner Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 Plot armor and possible long time effects. It would be delicious to watch the Imp turn to stone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 What makes you say that he didnot get greyscale? “How long must I continue to torture myself? When will we be certain that I’m clean?”“Truly?” said the Halfmaester. “Never. You swallowed half the river. You may be going grey even now, turning to stone from inside out, starting with your heart and lungs. If so, pricking your toes and bathing in vinegar will not save you.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daenerys Flint Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 Valyria vs Rhoynar - Garins Curse & Greyscale... I can't make sense of this - Garins curse a.k.a. Greyscale... was called by the Rhoynar to bring down the Valyrians... lots of Valyrians died in the flooding when the Mother Rhoyne rose up to destroy the conquerors. Leaving in it's wake - a kinda LOTR - 'Dead Marshes' type-river with the souls trapped beneath the surface. The area around the sorrows has an "unnatural" mist surrounding it and this is essentially the grey-scale quarantine zone... so if Greyscale was meant to bring down the Valyrians (hence being referred to as Garins Curse) then the argument that Tyrion is a Targ coz he hasn't caught it is redundant... but... I can't find any reference to Valyrians actually being affected by Grey-scale... anyone? Is this a failed curse by the Rhoynar that kinda backfired and now grey-scale kills everyone except Valyrians... or am I missing something here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 The fact that two people are exposed to the same disease doesn't mean they both are going to get sick. We don't know how the greyscale really spreads either. Narratively, the plot requires Jon to get sick because he needs to start making rushed impulsive decisions as he's now running against the clock. Tyrion's plot wouldn't go that way or maybe he is revealed to get sick later. Another explanation is that we don't know exactly what happened when Jon jumped to rescue Tyrion. Maybe the stoneman that got Tyrion hurt Jon or bit him. There is also the small theory that they were spying on the boat when they crossed and heard when YG was revealed as a Targaryen, a valyrian descendant, and they targeted him, hence, they purposely sickened Jon so he would transmit the disease to him. Greyscale seems to be more magical than anything, and maybe, they can choose who get sick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 Valyria vs Rhoynar - Garins Curse & Greyscale... I can't make sense of this - Garins curse a.k.a. Greyscale... was called by the Rhoynar to bring down the Valyrians... lots of Valyrians died in the flooding when the Mother Rhoyne rose up to destroy the conquerors. Leaving in it's wake - a kinda LOTR - 'Dead Marshes' type-river with the souls trapped beneath the surface. The area around the sorrows has an "unnatural" mist surrounding it and this is essentially the grey-scale quarantine zone... so if Greyscale was meant to bring down the Valyrians (hence being referred to as Garins Curse) then the argument that Tyrion is a Targ coz he hasn't caught it is redundant... but... I can't find any reference to Valyrians actually being affected by Grey-scale... anyone? Is this a failed curse by the Rhoynar that kinda backfired and now grey-scale kills everyone except Valyrians... or am I missing something here?Garin's curse is killing Valyrians. Essos is full of people of Valyrian descent. Shireen Baratheon has Valyrian blood. We do not have much data, but I cannot recall that the Great Spring Sickness affected Dorne. I really do not know if Jon Connington has any Valyrian blood, but I'd say that only the Rhoynar are immune to greyscale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daenerys Flint Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 @ Modesty Lannister - thanks! good point! Don't think quoting is working but yeah - so I was missing something... Shireen, as you pointed out, is a good example of having Valyrian blood and being afflicted by Greyscale... so I guess anyone who thinks Tyrions immunity to Greyscale is evidence of a Targ bloodline is mistaken - unless they are specifically referring to "blood of the dragon" which is slightly different. I get confused with Garins curse as its hard to work out if Garins curse actually refers to the Mother Rhoyne rising up and drowning people or if it refers to the greyscale aftermath... When the Valyrians sent 300 dragon riders to take out Garins army and turned the Mother Rhoyne to steam with their fire - I was wondering if this combination of water magic + fire magic somehow created greyscale... and wasn't actually a curse as such... just an accident of war... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 @ Modesty Lannister - thanks! good point! Don't think quoting is working but yeah - so I was missing something... Shireen, as you pointed out, is a good example of having Valyrian blood and being afflicted by Greyscale... so I guess anyone who thinks Tyrions immunity to Greyscale is evidence of a Targ bloodline is mistaken - unless they are specifically referring to "blood of the dragon" which is slightly different. I get confused with Garins curse as its hard to work out if Garins curse actually refers to the Mother Rhoyne rising up and drowning people or if it refers to the greyscale aftermath... When the Valyrians sent 300 dragon riders to take out Garins army and turned the Mother Rhoyne to steam with their fire - I was wondering if this combination of water magic + fire magic somehow created greyscale... and wasn't actually a curse as such... just an accident of war... The books are pretty sure that Garin's curse is greyscale. Let me remind you. "We'd do well not to breathe the fog either," said Haldon. "Garin's Curse is all about us." The only way not to breathe the fog is not to breathe. "Garin's Curse is only greyscale," said Tyrion. The curse was oft seen in children, especially in damp, cold climes. The afflicted flesh stiffened, calcified, and cracked, though the dwarf had read that greyscale's progress could be stayed by limes, mustard poultices, and scalding-hot baths (the maesters said) or by prayer, sacrifice, and fasting (the septons insisted). Then the disease passed, leaving its young victims disfigured but alive. Maesters and septons alike agreed that children marked by greyscale could never be touched by the rarer mortal form of the affliction, nor by its terrible swift cousin, the grey plague. "Damp is said to be the culprit," he said. "Foul humors in the air. Not curses." "The conquerors did not believe either, Hugor Hill," said Ysilla. "The men of Volantis and Valyria hung Garin in a golden cage and made mock as he called upon his Mother to destroy them. But in the night the waters rose and drowned them, and from that day to this they have not rested. They are down there still beneath the water, they who were once the lords of fire. Their cold breath rises from the murk to make these fogs, and their flesh has turned as stony as their hearts." ADWD, Tyrion V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted to snow Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 GRRM loves to torment & further disfigure Tyrion... I would imagine that Tyrion has to chop his own fingers off, one at a time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sword of the Evening Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Garin's curse is killing Valyrians. Essos is full of people of Valyrian descent. Shireen Baratheon has Valyrian blood. We do not have much data, but I cannot recall that the Great Spring Sickness affected Dorne. I really do not know if Jon Connington has any Valyrian blood, but I'd say that only the Rhoynar are immune to greyscale. It did not touch Dorne or the Vale since both closed they roads into their domains in 209 AC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 It did not touch Dorne or the Vale since both closed they roads into their domains in 209 AC. Or maybe because the Dornish of Rhoynar descent are immune? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 It did not touch Dorne or the Vale since both closed they roads into their domains in 209 AC. That was the Great Spring Sickness. It was not grey plague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 That was the Great Spring Sickness. It was not grey plague. And what is the Great Spring Sickness? It was never clarified, was it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 And what is the Great Spring Sickness? It was never clarified, was it? No, it is not described in detail. We do not know the symptoms. Meanwhile, Yandel counts many different sicknesses. Whatever its true extent, the southern continent is an unhealthy place, its very air full of foul humors and miasmas. We have already seen how Nymeria fared on its shores, when she attempted to settle her people there. Blood boils, green fever, sweetrot, bronze pate, the Red Death, greyscale, brownleg, wormbone, sailor’s bane, pus-eye, and yellowgum are only a few of the diseases found here, many so virulent that they have been known to wipe out whole settlements. Archmaester Ebrose’s study of centuries of travelers’ accounts suggests that nine of every ten men visiting Sothoryos from Westeros will suffer one or more of these afflictions, and that almost half will die. The sullen wet heat oppressed their spirits, and swarms of stinging flies spread one disease after another: green fever, the dancing plague, blood boils, weeping sores, sweetrot. The young and very old proved especially vulnerable to such contagions. Seven-and-seventy years after the Doom of Valyria, however, it is said their stink reached even the nostrils of the gods, and a terrible plague emerged from the slave pens of Gogossos. The Red Death swept across the Isle of Tears, then the rest of the Basilisk Isles. Nine men of every ten died screaming, bleeding copiously from every orifice, their skin shredding like wet parchment. If the Great Spring Sickness was similar to one of these sicknesses, Yandel would mention it. So, this plague and its symptoms were never seen before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 No, it is not described in detail. We do not know the symptoms. Meanwhile, Yandel counts many different sicknesses. Whatever its true extent, the southern continent is an unhealthy place, its very air full of foul humors and miasmas. We have already seen how Nymeria fared on its shores, when she attempted to settle her people there. Blood boils, green fever, sweetrot, bronze pate, the Red Death, greyscale, brownleg, wormbone, sailor’s bane, pus-eye, and yellowgum are only a few of the diseases found here, many so virulent that they have been known to wipe out whole settlements. Archmaester Ebrose’s study of centuries of travelers’ accounts suggests that nine of every ten men visiting Sothoryos from Westeros will suffer one or more of these afflictions, and that almost half will die. The sullen wet heat oppressed their spirits, and swarms of stinging flies spread one disease after another: green fever, the dancing plague, blood boils, weeping sores, sweetrot. The young and very old proved especially vulnerable to such contagions. Seven-and-seventy years after the Doom of Valyria, however, it is said their stink reached even the nostrils of the gods, and a terrible plague emerged from the slave pens of Gogossos. The Red Death swept across the Isle of Tears, then the rest of the Basilisk Isles. Nine men of every ten died screaming, bleeding copiously from every orifice, their skin shredding like wet parchment. If the Great Spring Sickness was similar to one of these sicknesses, Yandel would mention it. So, this plague and its symptoms were never seen before. That is all fine, but it does not mention the Great Spring Sickness, so we have no idea what it actually was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 That is all fine, but it does not mention the Great Spring Sickness, so we have no idea what it actually was. Since it does not mention Great Spring Sickness among these well known plagues, the most reasonable assumption is that Great Spring Sickness was a unique disease seen only in the spring of 209 AC. The only symptom that we are told about the Great Spring Sickness is that a man could wake up healthy in the morning and die by the evening from the plague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Suburbs Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 I missed that part about the Red Death. It sounds like Ebola. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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