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[Spoilers] EP505 Discussion

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Heres my line of thinking on that. She knows that one of the families must be at the very least funding the Harpies. So she takes the heads of all the families down to threaten them with the dragons to get them to talk. She picks one shes confident about that's not the leader and feeds him as an example. The reaction is all the other masters bow before Hizdahr (or her hard to tell) almost like they are begging him to stop it before they all die. Or maybe its simply that he was the one who wasn't afraid. Either way she picks up on this. Stops the torture and sends them to their cells. She has her man. So what should she do. She kills him he becomes a martyr for the Harpies and they continue their attacks. If she proposes to him he thinks he's reaching his goal of becoming the top man and taking her down. The attacks stop as they aren't necessary anymore. She now has bought her time to formulate a plan to take down the entire organization at once, probably with the reopening of the pits.

This seems to be giving dany credit for much more savvy than she's shown; especially when enraged after losing her best advisor.

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From reading the comments, it seems like this is one of those divisive episodes. Some people really hated it while others loved it.



I'm on the side that loved it. I think it was the best of the season so far and one of the best in the series. Very well written in my opinion, almost every scene made me feel something, and even though there are a lot of book deviations, it felt thematically true to ASOIAF. I don't mind the "slow-burn." I think it's the character moments, and not the action, that make this story great.



I thought Tyrion and Jorah bonding in Valyria and reciting that poem was particularly good, as well as Stannis recognizing Sam's role to play in the series, and encouraging him in his own way. Also continue to love that the show makes us question Dany and Jon's leadership decisions, much as the last two books do. Stannis is the only grown up in this world right now, and unfortunately it looks like his clock is ticking.



I think the writers are definitely setting Stannis up to fail. I believe Stannis will win the battle in the village in WoW, but might stumble while trying to take Winterfell or after if the Northern lords turn on him. Even Asha might try something...The show might not want to take the time to put Stannis through a series of battles/obstacles, and consolidate it all into one confrontation, in which he'll lose. It's too bad if that's the case, because I'd like for him to at least get a few wins before he dies.



Then there's the funeral pyre lit by Mel in the previews. That could be Stannis. Random spitball that I doubt will come true: What if Mel glamours him and fakes his death to gain some sort of strategic advantage over the Boltons? Would be interesting considering he may be faking his death by other means in the books to defeat the Boltons, but show-only viewers might see it as a cheap trick if this magic is just thrust onto them. Only in spoilers because I don't know the policy on previews.


Edited by gregorio

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From reading the comments, it seems like this is one of those divisive episodes. Some people really hated it while others loved it.

I'm on the side that loved it. I think it was the best of the season so far and one of the best in the series. Very well written in my opinion, almost every scene made me feel something, and even though there are a lot of book deviations, it felt thematically true to ASOIAF. I don't mind the "slow-burn." I think it's the character moments, and not the action, that make this story great.

I thought Tyrion and Jorah bonding in Valyria and reciting that poem was particularly good, as well as Stannis recognizing Sam's role to play in the series, and encouraging him in his own way. Also continue to love that the show makes us question Dany and Jon's leadership decisions, much as the last two books do. Stannis is the only grown up in this world right now, and unfortunately it looks like his clock is ticking.

I think the writers are definitely setting Stannis up to fail. I believe Stannis will win the battle in the village in WoW, but might stumble while trying to take Winterfell or after if the Northern lords turn on him. Even Asha might try something...The show might not want to take the time to put Stannis through a series of battles/obstacles, and consolidate it all into one confrontation, in which he'll lose. It's too bad if that's the case, because I'd like for him to at least get a few wins before he dies.

Then there's the funeral pyre lit by Mel in the previews. That could be Stannis. Random spitball that I doubt will come true: What if Mel glamours him and fakes his death to gain some sort of strategic advantage over the Boltons? Would be interesting considering he may be faking his death by other means in the books to defeat the Boltons, but show-only viewers might see it as a cheap trick if this magic is just thrust onto them.

Agree with much of this, though with how often they've mentioned the winter snows coming I can't see Stannis marching down to winterfell without those snows devastating his host, and putting him into more of an underdog role by the time any confrontations occur, so that if he does succeed it would have to come either through collaborators on the inside (Sansa, LF, Pod and if she can do it unwittingly Brienne) or through guile.

But this may just be me really wanting Stannis to live so that Shireen can teach everyone to read.

Edited by cgf

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Well....the dragon has three heads, although the TV serIes really hasn't stressed this. Dany and Jon make mistakes and are still struggling to be effective leaders. I believe Tyrion is the 3rd head and really don't expect much of them until they are all together.......hopefully fighting the OTHERS.

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Other than not caring at all about Grey Worm and Missandei, and really missing Arya (but I miss Arya in any episode without her), I loved this episode. I thought it was fabulous, probably the best of the season so far and I've enjoyed every episode thus far.



- I agree they're hitting the Jon = Targareyan anvils pretty hard, but I don't mind.



- Stannis is becoming oddly adorable.



- Ramsey is still psychotically cray-cray and his daddy dearest is showing that Ramsey is very much his son.



- We do get it, the North Remembers.



- Selyse is quickly becoming one of my least favorite characters (why is she such a bitch?).



-Tyrion and Jorah's ride into Valyria was cool. Tyrion's reaction to Drogon was awesome.



- The Stone Men fight sequence was fabulous. I knew that Jorah was so lying. Good on the posters who called that Jorah was getting the disease in place of JonCon.



- As for Dany's "proposal," I don't think we were supposed to think of it as anything other than political and Dany laying down the law. That smile on her face was not a nice one. And Hizdahr looked scared out of his ever-loving mind. She's done playing games. She tried diplomacy. She tried being fair-minded. She tried doing the whole trial by jury. And she was betrayed by those close and trusted to her, and turned on by the people she was trying to help, and then one of her most trusted advisors and friends was killed and another nearly died. She's basically done with this bullshit and she's done with their games. They are going to play by her rules now. She is the mother of dragons. They best be aware of the power she has because she is going to wield it.



Great episode.


Edited by arabian

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melisandre Left the wall, damn who would save Jon now?

That's what I'm thinking

Who will save Jon if not Mel?

Himself, maybe? Or the old gods?

It's not as if we know whether or not Melisandre saves him in the books, though.

This! I suspect it will be the Old Gods since Jon is of the North.

it does not make sence. If shireen is going to be melysandred is going to bring back Jon...

If Mel uses her to bring stannis back (killed by Brianne?) And stannis goes raged and kills Mel with LB...nisa nisa...

-I also have no idea who saves Jon once the NW goes all Stabby Stabby on him.

So with Mel leaving the wall, who is there to save Jon?

Then there's the funeral pyre lit by Mel in the previews. That could be Stannis. Random spitball that I doubt will come true: What if Mel glamours him and fakes his death to gain some sort of strategic advantage over the Boltons? Would be interesting considering he may be faking his death by other means in the books to defeat the Boltons, but show-only viewers might see it as a cheap trick if this magic is just thrust onto them. Only in spoilers because I don't know the policy on previews.

See here. It looks like Melisandre comes back later. My guess is as a result of something she sees in her fires.

Edited by Faint

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Great episode.

Stannis is bringing the Red Priestess. He's not losing in Winterfell.

I would love to see her put some sorceress nightmare shit on Ramsay.

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This seems to be giving dany credit for much more savvy than she's shown; especially when enraged after losing her best advisor.

Idk she was rather savvy when it came to getting the unsullied. Shes better when she acts instead of sitting around hoping for good stuff to happen. I wouldn't call him her best adviser. At least in the show he hasn't gotten anything really right. Jorah has been more right than him and she sent him packing.

Edited by moviefan050608

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When Ramsay ordered Theon to kneel in front of him, was anyone else wondering for a second if Ramsay was going to demand a blowjob?


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When Ramsay ordered Theon to kneel in front of him, was anyone else wondering for a second if Ramsay was going to demand a blowjob?

Yes. I was actually relieved when he asked him for his hand, sadly enough.

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I loved the way Sansa moved and spoke with conviction tonight, though we can surmise she's scared to death and hiding it well. She'll have Ramsay eating out of her palm in no time.



Show_Ramsay clearly wants respect; that surprised me. He's twisted, but he minced no words in telling Myranda the simple truth (he's a Bolton now, off with you, I'm with Sansa). His psycho tendencies are still there, but Sansa could mold that. (She dealt with Joff and lived... that's saying something).



Why Walda's announcement? To show that Sansa saw the "ah hell no!" look on Ramsay's face. Sansa's no Roose fan, and I think she can get through a wedding night and talk Ramsay into working against Roose and Roose's knights. Ramsay could grow to feel he needs Sansa for more than her name. She should remain scared of him, but I doubt she'll let him see it; she'd (ugh) "Littlefinger" him — use Ramsay to slaughter all her House's enemies, including, eventually, the Lannisters.



Dany's being worked over by Missandei. No idea why unless Missandei is the Harpy on the show, but tonight Dany wondered how things had turned so bad, and Missandei said it was because Dany didn't listen to her advisors and that's why Dany's successful? And Dany bought that? Newsflash: Dany's a disaster, and Missandei is encouraging it. This is not book_Missandei. And that's why D&D showed too much Missandei and Grey Worm: not the romance, but Missandei's character. (Maybe she's not the Harpy, but something's going on with her.)



I didn't love or hate the episode. I really liked parts, and I was really bored through other parts; the Wall was good (loved the short Stannis/Sam scene); Stannis was Stannis ("fewer"); the trip through Valyria was "interesting" (smoking sea? or foggy river!). Tyrion/Jorah walking to Meereen=lmao moment. 8/10, maybe 7/10 for the "too much WF" though I understand now what it was all building up to (the dinner party). If it had been paced better, a solid 8/10.


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I read a review online and with Tyrion's encounter with the Stone men happening, I can now safely say that Aegon/Young Griff will NOT appear. Two thumbs down. After watching episode 2 of this season, I concluded Lady Stoneheart will not appear either. It did however have Jon Snow elected Lord commander so I watched the episode.



We are half way through now and I've refrained from watching some of the episodes. I'll continue to do so until one event happens that I've not lost hope from happening takes place this season: Balon Greyjoy falling off the bridge.


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When Ramsay ordered Theon to kneel in front of him, was anyone else wondering for a second if Ramsay was going to demand a blowjob?

I think most people did. It was purposefully suggested in the way the scene was blocked.

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I loved the way Sansa moved and spoke with conviction tonight, though we can surmise she's scared to death and hiding it well. She'll have Ramsay eating out of her palm in no time.

Show_Ramsay clearly wants respect; that surprised me. He's twisted, but he minced no words in telling Myranda the simple truth (he's a Bolton now, off with you, I'm with Sansa). His psycho tendencies are still there, but Sansa could mold that. (She dealt with Joff and lived... that's saying something).

Why Walda's announcement? To show that Sansa saw the "ah hell no!" look on Ramsay's face. Sansa's no Roose fan, and I think she can get through a wedding night and talk Ramsay into working against Roose and Roose's knights. Ramsay could grow to feel he needs Sansa for more than her name. She should remain scared of him, but I doubt she'll let him see it; she'd (ugh) "Littlefinger" him — use Ramsay to slaughter all her House's enemies, including, eventually, the Lannisters.

Dany's being worked over by Missandei. No idea why unless Missandei is the Harpy on the show, but tonight Dany wondered how things had turned so bad, and Missandei said it was because Dany didn't listen to her advisors and that's why Dany's successful? And Dany bought that? Newsflash: Dany's a disaster, and Missandei is encouraging it. This is not book_Missandei. And that's why D&D showed too much Missandei and Grey Worm: not the romance, but Missandei's character. (Maybe she's not the Harpy, but something's going on with her.)

I didn't love or hate the episode. I really liked parts, and I was really bored through other parts; the Wall was good (loved the short Stannis/Sam scene); Stannis was Stannis ("fewer"); the trip through Valyria was "interesting" (smoking sea? or foggy river!). Tyrion/Jorah walking to Meereen=lmao moment. 8/10, maybe 7/10 for the "too much WF" though I understand now what it was all building up to (the dinner party). If it had been paced better, a solid 8/10.

Could work for one of three betrayals.

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Poor Jorah....I really liked him... he is top 10 on my signature :(

Guess I'll have to start crossing names off :(

100% lost BSel, and who knows how long Jorah will last.

If he knows the story of Stannis and his daughter perhaps he can get the same guys to look at him as look at Princess Shireen.

Jorah soo good. He learned from his grievous mistakes (slave dealings/spying), if anyone should catch a break its him.

Edited by SayGen

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