The show isn’t diverting from the books that much after all.

[robasp2]

Good ol' fucking Game of Thrones, which is what the TV show was supposed to be about. Sorry, but at this point, all the prospect of conflict has been reduced to Dany landing her dragons on Westeros whenever the hell she wants (not whenever the hell the conflicts in the East let her, as per the books) and fighting the Others with the help of a few Starks. That, coupled with the petty catfight that KL and Dorne have become, makes GoT look like a damn soap opera sprinkled with a few fantasy elements, not a proper epic drama. What in the current course of the show evokes the word epic? All it spells is

B.O.R.I.N.G.

Haha. Nailed it dude.

Soap opera.Only with Very good cinematography and the most fucked up story.

[Good Guy Garlan]

I'm a bit confused by this talk about made up storylines. I'm by no means a fan of stuff like MissWorm, but they've had what, 3 short scenes this season. Sam/Gilly/Shireen got one scene of pure fluff and some last minute foreshadowing of the Stone Men.

I mean, all in all the filler of the show is very, very little compared to the books', where we got chapter upon chapter of Brienne doing jackshit, Jaime having dinner with randos, Alys Karstark, the Cinnamon Wind, etc.

And sure, sometimes the show does have longer sequences of filler, probably like the upcoming detour to Hardhome, though who knows. And granted, some of that is godawful (Yara's Dog Day Afternoon, for example), but most of this filler/merging is the natural result of GRRM writing 2 humongous tomes without an ending and only the vaguest semblance of plot.

So, of course, the execution of D&D is terrible, but it's not like they had a whole lot of options. They just couldn't have Jaime having dinner with randos for an entire season before he meets Brienne and buggers off at the season finale. They couldn't have Sansa describing the Lords Declarant for an entire season before Littlefinger reveals her plan and we cut to credits. That was just a no go. They couldn't have Jon talking to fucking Alys Karstark before the Ideas of Olly. That was a no go.

They had to come up with something for the characters to do, so it was either dipping into WoW material (like with Arya), benching a character for the whole season (like with Bran), or merging and making stuff up (like with Sansa).

And I'm sure as hell glad they went with the third option because that way it doesn't spoil WoW more than it should.

[ummester]

I hadn't thought of it like that Floppy Fish - perhaps D&D are stalling, to try and give GRRM time to finish TWoW?

We don't know what deals are going on behind closed doors, what the HBO execs are demanding of either D&D or GRRM and we don't know what terms any of them have with each other. Without this knowledge, is unfair to blame anyone for any changes we may not like because they may not be fully responsible for them.

And, as sour a taste as the Sansa plot changes seem to be leaving in a lot of mouths, it's something. It may just be Joffrey enhanced - but it's controversial and has people emotionally effected, even if those emotions are annoyance, hatred, etc. Sansa may still be somewhat passive, but her story is no longer as passive as her book journey.

[God-Emperor of Yi Ti]

This is a work of fiction, a still not completed ( and most likely never will be) work of fiction. And it is being dramatized over a minimum of 70 hours with top production values. A completely unparalleled level of detail and fidelity for a work in this genre, (and damn near any genre, come to think of it)

And yet we have the rancorous bitching we see here. A tiny number of individuals, and a minority even here, but still a substantial proportion....

My question is- what film/tv adaptation has there been, in this genre, that has been more faithful ?

[Fjordgazer]

even if those emotions are annoyance, hatred, etc.

Toe-to-toe with boredom, and lechery for Sophie Turner's potential nude debut, as per Recapped and similar sites.

My question is- what film/tv adaptation has there been, in this genre, that has been more faithful ?

Since i only watched them once shortly after they came out, and i actually haven't read one Tolkein book other than a few excerpts, i'm not one to talk, but plenty of individuals have pointed out the LOTR movies as an example.

Not only that but your lot continues to disregard that book-snobbery for the first (+/-) 3 and 1/2 seasons was very, very mild. It used to be faithful for the most part, and your excuses of "streamlining" and "keeping the broad strokes of the books" held water back then.

[Fjordgazer]

I'm a bit confused by this talk about made up storylines. I'm by no means a fan of stuff like MissWorm, but they've had what, 3 short scenes this season. Sam/Gilly/Shireen got one scene of pure fluff and some last minute foreshadowing of the Stone Men.

Every wasted minute from the 50x10 that comprise a season is golden. It could've averted the Sparrow movement from coming out the blue, Dany's marriage proposal to Hizdahr from coming out of the blue, and a large et cetera.

[ADanceWithCats]

I honestly feel that the perception of whether the show is different or the same depends squarely on one's own individual ability/preference to accept dissonance and change. Some people are more open, others need the straight-and-narrow. At this point, I just don't understand why the people who think that the show is different are complaining about it. Like "I think this is different!". Well, OK? If it is to you, and you can't stand it, stop watching.

Every wasted minute from the 50x10 that comprise a season is golden. It could've averted the Sparrow movement from coming out the blue, Dany's marriage proposal to Hizdahr from coming out of the blue, and a large et cetera.

Oh gods, Dany's shotgun marriage proposal was absolutely fantastic! She totally made Hizdahr her bitch, and it was glorious. :lol:

[Valetudo]

I honestly feel that the perception of whether the show is different or the same depends squarely on one's own individual ability/preference to accept dissonance and change. Some people are more open, others need the straight-and-narrow. At this point, I just don't understand why the people who think that the show is different are complaining about it. Like "I think this is different!". Well, OK? If it is to you, and you can't stand it, stop watching.

Oh gods, Dany's shotgun marriage proposal was absolutely fantastic! She totally made Hizdahr her bitch, and it was glorious. :lol:

It's not that it's different, it's that it doesn't make sense, is full of plot holes and created filler.

See the difference?

If it was different but still coherent, you'd see a lot less complaints.

[robasp2]

I honestly feel that the perception of whether the show is different or the same depends squarely on one's own individual ability/preference to accept dissonance and change. Some people are more open, others need the straight-and-narrow. At this point, I just don't understand why the people who think that the show is different are complaining about it. Like "I think this is different!". Well, OK? If it is to you, and you can't stand it, stop watching.

Oh gods, Dany's shotgun marriage proposal was absolutely fantastic! She totally made Hizdahr her bitch, and it was glorious. :lol:

Yup, If that made any sense I would be ok with this type of bullshit.

Atleast a single line where Dany carefully calculates her options with Daario or GW.

Instead " Aha, Im gonna open them damn pits. You know just for fun. Even though I swore to never open them"

What led to it? A few seconds of dialogue?

That type of illogical, incoherent storytelling is what angers everyone more than the "change"

[Gasp of Many Reeds]

I'm not too irked by many of the changes this season, but I'm annoyed with Lady Stoneheart and the Iron Isles being cut because whilst they may be viewed as peripheral (a they are some of my favourite parts of the books (the Kingsmoot and Brienne's 'trial' in AFFC especially); (b both the Greyjoys and Brotherhood Without Banners have already been introduced in the series, so it will leave them as very dissatisfactory loose ends if there is no proper resolution of their storylines. So frankly cutting them from the show is a significant detriment IMO.

[Gasp of Many Reeds]

EDIT: Double Post, Ignore.

[ADanceWithCats]

Atleast a single line where Dany carefully calculates her options with Daario or GW.

Instead " Aha, Im gonna open them damn pits. You know just for fun. Even though I swore to never open them"

What led to it? A few seconds of dialogue?

That type of illogical, incoherent storytelling is what angers everyone more than the "change"

The fuck? How is this illogical and incoherent? This episode is literally about how the leader is supposed to make the choices themselves. This is what Aemon and Missandei are both about. Whatever the leader does, somebody is going to be angry.

Why aren't you angry that Jon didn't get a scene with Sam and Alliser Thorne of carefully calculating his options whether to help the wildings ? Because there is no such scene in the book?

e: and, obviously, sometimes you have to accept that your choice will result in murder. But people die anyway. Whatever you do. Whether you try to be merciful or not.

[Mithras]

... the rancorous bitching ...

You know, I am half of a mind to do such rancorous bitching about Jon's arc. D&D did many significants changes like cannibal Thenns, monstrous wildlings, Thorne the Hero, winning the election by +1, dividing the NW into two, even Edd standing against Jon etc. etc.

These are all great betrayals to the text. The wildlings are not so different than the average Northern peasants and the Thenns are cool. Everyone hates Thorne to their guts. He would never pretend to be a candidate in the election. Jon won the election by a landslide. Edd was one of the most trusted men of Jon and he never stood against him in regards to the wildling policies. In fact, the opposition to Jon was always minor. Otherwise, they would not backstab him like the way they did. Worse, the show completely omitted the Lannister intervention to the election. Slynt was the candidate of Tywin. Opposition to Jon was rooting for the Lannisters. They didnot have the more justifiable old school wildling hatred. Or they had it but that was not the important parameter. And the show omitted the parts where Bowen Marsh was constantly doing this rancorous bitching about every decision of Jon, meanwhile offering no alternative ideas.

All of these text butchery is to make the eventual stabbing more dramatical.

But overall, I do not mind it as much as other people get mad about the changes in their favourite characters.

[God-Emperor of Yi Ti]

Since i only watched them once shortly after they came out, and i actually haven't read one Tolkein book other than a few excerpts, i'm not one to talk, but plenty of individuals have pointed out the LOTR movies as an example.

Not only that but your lot continues to disregard that book-snobbery for the first (+/-) 3 and 1/2 seasons was very, very mild. It used to be faithful for the most part, and your excuses of "streamlining" and "keeping the broad strokes of the books" held water back then.

Amazing to say it, but LOTR is a far simpler story than ASOIAF, a far more linear storyline- a single linear story line in book 1, max 3 in Book 2, and 2 in Book 3. Plus Tolkien was willing to bury much of the peripheral happenings (Mirkwood, Erebor) to the famous appendices (not to mention the deep history all being left below that again in the Silmarrillion).

GRRM's predicament is that round about the time that a 7 book series would be turning for home [ book 4 of a 7 book series], 2 new great houses become a focus.. It was already immediately obvious that a supposed 7 book series was far more likely to be 8, or even 9....

[Valetudo]

You know, I am half of a mind to do such rancorous bitching about Jon's arc. D&D did many significants changes like cannibal Thenns, monstrous wildlings, Thorne the Hero, winning the election by +1, dividing the NW into two, even Edd standing against Jon etc. etc.

These are all great betrayals to the text. The wildlings are not so different than the average Northern peasants and the Thenns are cool. Everyone hates Thorne to their guts. He would never pretend to be a candidate in the election. Jon won the election by a landslide. Edd was one of the most trusted men of Jon and he never stood against him in regards to the wildling policies. In fact, the opposition to Jon was always minor. Otherwise, they would not backstab him like the way they did. Worse, the show completely omitted the Lannister intervention to the election. Slynt was the candidate of Tywin. Opposition to Jon was rooting for the Lannisters. They didnot have the more justifiable old school wildling hatred. Or they had it but that was not the important parameter. And the show omitted the parts where Bowen Marsh was constantly doing this rancorous bitching about every decision of Jon, meanwhile offering no alternative ideas.

All of these text butchery was to make the eventual stabbing more dramatical.

But overall, I do not mind it as much as other people get mad about the changes in their favourite characters.

Despite all these changes, Jon's story is still one of the more believable in this season.

At least he's being true to his character and not doing anything without logic.

If they could have done that to the other characters, it would have been great.

[Mithras]

Despite all these changes, Jon's story is still one of the more believable in this season.

At least he's being true to his character and not doing anything without logic.

If they could have done that to the other characters, it would have been great.

He forgot Bran.

[Valetudo]

He forgot Bran.

You got me here! :drunk:

[robasp2]

The fuck? How is this illogical and incoherent? This episode is literally about how the leader is supposed to make the choices themselves. This is what Aemon and Missandei are both about. Whatever the leader does, somebody is going to be angry.

Why aren't you angry that Jon didn't get a scene with Sam and Alliser Thorne of carefully calculating his options whether to help the wildings ? Because there is no such scene in the book?

e: and, obviously, sometimes you have to accept that your choice will result in murder. But people die anyway. Whatever you do. Whether you try to be merciful or not.

Jon explained his reasons many times over. Also Allister advised against it when he shared it with the brothers. There was a discussion.

If Jon walked up one

day and says "Bitches, You all fight with the wildlings from tommorow" (without any mention of the reason behind it), I will definetly go WTF!

Couldnt D&D add one frikkin dialogue for Dany? Was it so hard? Why is that so bad?

Obara gets a useless dialogue explaining her life to her sisters, and yet the queen has none?.

[God-Emperor of Yi Ti]

I honestly feel that the perception of whether the show is different or the same depends squarely on one's own individual ability/preference to accept dissonance and change. Some people are more open, others need the straight-and-narrow. At this point, I just don't understand why the people who think that the show is different are complaining about it. Like "I think this is different!". Well, OK? If it is to you, and you can't stand it, stop watching.

Exactly, there is an inability to accept that the TV show is an adaptation of, not a line by line rereading of the book - implicit in these comments is a presumption of ownership - "how dare this be done to our books"

What would such people make of the TV/ Filmic adaptations of classical literature- like War & Peace?

Oh sure people talk about the changes causing flaws in the tv show on its own merits that non book readers can pick up on, but that simply doesn't hold water. Again, find me an tv series with more coherence over a similar timescale...

[God-Emperor of Yi Ti]

Jon explained his reasons many times over.

Couldnt D&D add one frikkin dialogue for Dany? Was it so hard? Why is that so bad?

Obara gets a useless dialogue explaining her life to her sisters, and yet the queen has none?.

How do you know there won't be a line? I'd expect she will need to explain to Daario why she did it for example....