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The show isn’t diverting from the books that much after all.


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Whats witnessed on the road with Yoren



The torture of prisoners in Harrenhal.



The panorama of the burning riverlands after Arya and the hound kill Freys?



Fight with Polliver- Polliver's description of working for the Mountain



stealing from the Farmer and his daughter and the discussion thereafter



The "old man" scene- says a lot that an existential discussion goes whistling over your head.



Waht would you like- a massacre scene a week??




Well you actually confirmed my post because all that you count sums up to Harrenhal horrors and few lines of dialogue and one panorama. It doesn't have to be a massacre scene a week but the show almost skipped Riverlands and that is bad. And it also doesn't have to be massacres but starving people, refugees, wounded people, burnt fields, scared people...



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When I first heard about the direction they were taking this season I had a lot of misgivings but now I am happy with it, more or less. I quite like that there are stories where we don't know exactly where they are going, we can make educated guesses based on where the book characters end up but no more than guesses at this point.

It has the added bonus that we won't be spoilt on Vale, Riverlands or Iron Born plots from WoW.

So just because we don't know where it's going, it become a better story?

Even if it's full of plot holes and shifting characters along the way?

Right!

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Who's saying that GoT is just as bad as that?

You can criticize something without hating it.

GoT is still a great show, that doesn't mean that it's above all critics for it.

Stop generalizing and start reading the actual comments.

PS: If you wan't to use some foreign expression, at least spell it right.

The 50 or so rating each episode 1/10 or 2/10, that's who...

Of course there are genuine criticisms, but lets not lose perspective. You appear to have things in balance, plenty of the most active contributors most certainly don't....

PS- i'm not even spell checking the English i write here, you think i'm going to worry about the french !?

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Well you actually confirmed my post because all that you count sums up to Harrenhal horrors and few lines of dialogue and one panorama. It doesn't have to be a massacre scene a week but the show almost skipped Riverlands and that is bad. And it also doesn't have to be massacres but starving people, refugees, wounded people, burnt fields, scared people...

That's without saying that half his examples are about war itself, and not about the consequences of it.

Just looking at Kings landing, we go from joyous mob at Tommen's wedding to angry mob shouting in the same episode. lol

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The 50 or so rating each episode 1/10 or 2/10, that's who...

Of course there are genuine criticisms, but lets not lose perspective. You appear to have things in balance, plenty of the most active contributors most certainly don't....

PS- i'm not even spell checking the English i write here, you think i'm going to worry about the french !?

And that's where you're wrong. People rating each episode 1/10 are a minority even among "book snobs".

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Well you actually confirmed my post because all that you count sums up to Harrenhal horrors and few lines of dialogue and one panorama. It doesn't have to be a massacre scene a week but the show almost skipped Riverlands and that is bad. And it also doesn't have to be massacres but starving people, refugees, wounded people, burnt fields, scared people...

they have seen plenty in a visual context.... i don't think they need anymore of a character wandering round a war torn landscape. Once LSH got the chop, it would have been a no-brainer to lose the "Riverlands trail of misery"

They are making an entertainment, not "the world at war"

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And that's where you're wrong. People rating each episode 1/10 are a minority even among "book snobs".

But how is rating 1/10 bad? If The Wire is 10/10 then this ridiculous show really doesn't deserve more then 1/10 or 2/10, at best 3/10. I can name at least 20 shows with far superior writing than GOT.

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they have seen plenty in a visual context.... i don't think they need anymore of a character wandering round a war torn landscape. Once LSH got the chop, it would have been a no-brainer to lose the "Riverlands trail of misery"

But they've seen nothing. Especially in a visual context. War in Riverlands is not depicted at all, besides Harrenhal horrors that were toned down. Even your list shows that there was no visual context. And yes wars leave trails of misery after them and if you don't show them you're just warmonger of storytelling.

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When I first heard about the direction they were taking this season I had a lot of misgivings but now I am happy with it, more or less. I quite like that there are stories where we don't know exactly where they are going, we can make educated guesses based on where the book characters end up but no more than guesses at this point.

It has the added bonus that we won't be spoilt on Vale, Riverlands or Iron Born plots from WoW.

The more I read here concerns about the Sansa storyline the more I think D&D's decision was genius.

Without the comfort blanket of book knowledge people are really fearing for Sansa. Much more so than they would for some random Red Skirt fArya.

This will also make Theon's rescue much more meaningful and redeeming. I am thinking this will happen between Wedding and Bedding - I don't see the show putting Sansa through too much there. I think Brienne will take the role of the Spearwife who helped Theon rescue fAyra. Will Brienne dress up like a washer woman to get into Winterfell? that could be funny.

Brienne's wanderings in AFFC work fine in books and we find out a lot about history and geography etc. But this would make terrible tv.

Often tv / movie adaptions don't adapt enough to the screen and end up being little more than key book scenes acted out with less flow and more gaps in the story. I like that they've taken book material which would make terrible tv if transferred directly and made it into a reasonably good show. It's not perfect but it doesn't deserve the hate it gets on these forums. The Rant and Rave thread is an echo chamber of bile and vitriol which I can no longer enter due to its foul atmosphere. I think if people stayed out of there their appreciation of the show would increase markedly.

+1

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They are making an entertainment, not "the world at war"

And you wonder why people are rating this show 1/10 or 2/10? Of course that the show is going to be seen as rubbish because if you take ASOIAF and adapt it into entertainment that is what you get: rubbish with giant plot holes and logical fallacies all around.

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But how is rating 1/10 bad? If The Wire is 10/10 then this ridiculous show really doesn't deserve more then 1/10 or 2/10, at best 3/10. I can name at least 20 shows with far superior writing than GOT.

You're giving them a bone here. Yes, GoT isn't perfect, but it's not "worst TV Show ever" material neither (that's what 1 or 2 means.)

PS: while most of your arguments make some sense, you've totally fallen into "fanboy hater" territory. Not really a good point if you want to discuss, because everything you say is then discarded because of your attitude.

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[..]

The more I read here concerns about the Sansa storyline the more I think D&D's decision was genius.

Without the comfort blanket of book knowledge people are really fearing for Sansa. Much more so than they would for some random Red Skirt fArya.

This will also make Theon's rescue much more meaningful and redeeming.[..]

For someone who was full of himself like old Theon, I'd think it's a deeper change for him to feel for an abused nobody rather than a hot heiress.

And fearing for Sansa? Why? She's totally empowered now and has a candle!

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You're giving them a bone here. Yes, GoT isn't perfect, but it's not "worst TV Show ever" material neither (that's what 1 or 2 means.)

PS: while most of your arguments make some sense, you've totally fallen into "fanboy hater" territory. Not really a good point if you want to discuss, because everything you say is then discarded because of your attitude.

Well I'm sorry but how does that make any sense? Why would something I say be discarded because of my "attitude"? I don't care about anyone's attitude, I'm just replying to things they say and not to what their attitude toward the show is. And for the record I do think that writing for GOT is some of the worst I have ever seen in television. It is not only bad but it also purports to be something very meaningful and it isn't. That "nothing is nothing" scene is perfect example of the show's stupidity that was meant to pass as some highly philosophical shit. When weak shows like Vikings have better writing and less... sorry fewer plot holes then it really says something. And by the way I don't know any other show that has anything as stupid as Sansa being married to Ramsay. And just watch last episode: how did Jorah saved himself and Tyrion from Stone Men? I couldn't believe what I'm watching for real. At one moment Tyrion is drowning and Jorah is fighting with several Stone Men in boat, and in next moment they're somewhere on some beach and there is no boat and no Stone Men also and they are fine (except Jorah is infected, so at least we know he was touched by Stone Men). How more stupid things can be really? So yes in many ways GOT does belong among worst shows ever. Great cinematography can't make up for that.

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@StepStark: You've clearly never seen any soaps like The Young and the Restless or The Bold & the Beautiful, or even movies like Fast and Furious or Transformers!

Well yes I avoid garbage of that kind but similar garbage that I've seen is really not worse than GOT at its worst. And in every episode of GOT there is something that belongs to their lowest points. And honestly if you take out books stuff from the show and leave only D&D's original material then you'd get something that is more than comparable to FaF and Transformers (yes I did watch a little of those).

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they have seen plenty in a visual context.... i don't think they need anymore of a character wandering round a war torn landscape. Once LSH got the chop, it would have been a no-brainer to lose the "Riverlands trail of misery"

They are making an entertainment, not "the world at war"

The impact that is made from those scenes of war, the devastation that had been wrought by war, leaving in wake the concepts providing how such poverty stricken people might rebel fanatically turning upon their government, the thought process behind their anarchy. Not the given plagiarism conceding to homophobia turning certain characters into stereotypes, forgetting largely the concepts and mechanics of how any standing armies and soldiers would operate towards revolt.

Lets us not forget how medieval travel works either or the scale of a continent. When upon showing certain planning, further considering the backgrounds provided, concepts offered, some of this planning is mostly shown to be inconsistent to any former thought processes.

I agree it is often far easier to pay a stripper, demolish, then to build and devise

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Well yes I avoid garbage of that kind but similar garbage that I've seen is really not worse than GOT at its worst. And in every episode of GOT there is something that belongs to their lowest points. And honestly if you take out books stuff from the show and leave only D&D's original material then you'd get something that is more than comparable to FaF and Transformers (yes I did watch a little of those).

Perhaps you should fast forward through any D&D scenes and just watch the rest, so that you at least enjoy it without stressing so much :D

Do you have literal D&D nightmares. like they are the Antichrist destined to burn all 'good' books and bring bad writing to the whole world?

The whole soap angle in AGoTs started with the novels. Robert, Rhaegar and Lyanna is classic soap. 2 boys and 1 girl, what will she do? It is exactly what happens on Bold and Beautiful all the time, the only difference is it doesn't generally start a war on Bold and Beautiful. One of the reasons AGoT/ASoIaF is popular, is that, exactly like a soap, fans can bitch for days over he they prefer and how character x is right and character y is wrong. It's pulp swords and sorcery soap opera at its finest - which there is absolutely nothing wrong with, though it is what it is.

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Alright then, this are all legitimate concerns but I'm sure you'll see that it's not the same as "nothing happens in AFFC" which is what I replied to. Yes some readers obviously didn't like changed focus on some secondary characters like Brienne and Ironborn for example, but also many readers liked it. And I think that it was great set-up for last two books in the same way as ACOK was great set-up for ASOS. What I disagree is that there is too many new names to be introduced because if you mean Freys they are only important as Freys. They don't have to be introduced in details. That is something the show already done with Dany's siege of Yunkai and all those persons that negotiate with her - we don't need to remember their names for example, they are important only as Dany's enemies. And Freys are important only as someone who frustrates Jaime and complicates his mission. And I think that delaying that for season 6 is one more mistake in the show, especially considering how stupid this Dorne arc looks to be.

I completely disagree with nothing happened in AFFC and ADWD. I actually enjoyed the books but I can definitely understand the criticisms. I am guessing here but I think they've been hesitating with the Freys because they go out in a lack luster manner, one by one (I know everyone will saying hanging by zombie is not lack luster but yeah, it is. The shock really only occurs the first time.) I think the show plans a grand gesture of retribution in season 6. It's a ploy for shock value, something the show really wants to foster.

The one thing that has me wondering is their plan for Jaime. Unless his arc is very thin in book 6, it might be too many things for him to do if he needs to redeem himself as in book 5 and then do whatever he's slated to do in book 6. That could be too much for one season. Or perhaps they feel they can show him making a turn around with one big event rather than a few small ones. Hard to say at this time.

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I like hanging out with people that can talk theories, but it is just so depressing to spend time in any of these threads.



Every second of GoT has always been combed through by avid fans, which can be fun and cool. But too many people just take such joy in shitting all over the show in every single thread and obsessing over ridiculous nitpicks, pretending that they know the thematic importance of minor aspects of half-told stories, and pretending that no change can be positive. I think I'm just going to have to find a different forum. I love the books. I love the show. I think I'm just going to have to find a different forum because it is too frustrating to engage the fandom here.


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