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[BOOK and SHOW SPOILERS] So what is Littlefinger's game now?

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In this episode we learn that LF wants the North for himself, he wants to attack whoever


wins over WF - Stannis or the Boltons. Surely he will have some plan besides a straight


military attack?



And - we know now from this interview



http://www.ew.com/article/2015/05/17/game-thrones-sansa-wedding



that LF did not know about Ramsay. That should make things interesting


when he comes back?



Maybe Stannis - Boltons - LF will destroy each other, thus Sansa standing at the top


in the end (seriously, after her line and what she did I don't think anyone will get her


out of WF again).


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I think LF is climbing "the laddah" step by step. What he told Cersei might actually be his plan, it would not be the first time he is using his relationship to the Lannisters to get ahead.
Once he is Warden of the North though, it's pretty obvious that he does not plan to stop there.

I don't think he cares all that much for Sansa, but who knows...

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I guess the plan sort of works if you squint and tilt your head a bit, but I still have lots of questions. As guardian to Robin Arryn and Lord of Harrenhal, LF already has potentially two Kingdoms under his thumb. I don't care how mad Cersei is or how agreeable LF might seem, nobody will sign off on a plan which gives someone control of the North as well.



Also, why does LF need to tell Cersei he is doing this at all, least of all in person? His troops will be from the Vale, not the crownlands. His reasons for trying to take the North are sound and can be given in his absence, which would have saved LF in the event that Cersei said no here. But with that gone he wouldn't have needed to send Sansa at all, so I'm still not sure. Sending her to break the Bolton's from the lannisters was probably the cleverest thing he's done in seasons but the plan still relies on Stannis and Bolton bleeding each other just enough to be overcome, which seems to ascribe him incredible foresight. Foresight that was totally lacking when he didn't investigate the character of Ramsay at all.


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There is no plan. Aidan Gillen is just reading the script.



Even in the show this might just a diversion - after all, Cersei is not allowed to know that Littlefinger arranged the Sansa-Ramsay match, no? And we know from the books that he promised Sansa to make her Lady of Winterfell with his Vale troops. But whether this is going to happen in the show at all remains to be seen. I imagine TV Brienne will kill TV Stannis, and if Roose and Ramsay die, too, Sansa could end up sort of on top. But then she wouldn't need Littlefinger for that.


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I think Littlefinger's overall game has always been to sit on the Throne or die trying. The story begins for us at the point where he has knocked over the first domino in the chain he spent decades setting up, with the murder of Arryn and the frame job that started the war.



Right now he is perfectly positioned to take advantage of whatever happens at this next pivotal moment, at least as far as the military/alliance/treachery angle goes. He's keeping his lies going and his diplomatic options open as long as possible. He's poised on the verge of controlling a massive chunk of Westeros.



Thing is, I don't think all his master chessplaying is going to stand up to stuff like dragons and all the things Winter brings...


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I think he wants to take all of the highborn characters down - Cersie, Stannis, Boltons - he don't care. It's a classic chip on shoulder thing still playing out.



There is a possibility Sansa will get Ramsay to dispatch LF gruesomely, possibly next Season or later.


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I have a bigger slightly crackpot theory on LF in the show atleast. He has been using the line " I live to serve" too often and we see Jaqen H'gar saying the same about Faceless men,even in this episode. I can't help but connect these two things together.


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I think he'll align with the Bolton's and the Winterfell Battle will turn out to be a North/Stannis alliance vs a Bolton/Vale alliance. He wont align with Stannis, as there's no way he'd put up with him and his new titles as warden of the North, protecter of the Vale etc. He'd likely give Sansa the North and execute Baelish.



Theon is going to destroy LF's plan. I think he's done this in the books already.


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In this episode we learn that LF wants the North for himself, he wants to attack whoever

wins over WF - Stannis or the Boltons. Surely he will have some plan besides a straight

military attack?

(...)

I still am trying to guess how he'll pass Moat Cailin with the troops from the Vale...

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I still am trying to guess how he'll pass Moat Cailin with the troops from the Vale...

The Boltons do not know that LF and Vale troops have turned against them yet. I think they will assume Vale troops are here to assist against Stannis attack and let them pass( possibly allowing the vale troops to takeover Moat Cailin as well)

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Petyr's plan is to make ties with as many powerful houses as possible so he will end up on the Iron Throne himself; make no mistake, that is his ulterior motive.

He wants Roose to like him, that is why he is giving him Sansa. Meanwhile he wants Cersei to give him the North so he can marry Sansa (unknowing of the true character of Ramsay). As soon as he has that in writing he will team up with the Tyrells to betray Cersei. Remember, he did help Olenna kill Joffrey. He is probably also betting on Stannis defeating the Boltons so he can take Sansa as his wife. After that I reckon he will find someone to put House Tyrell down (Baratheon or Martell maybe?) but we will see if that happens.

Personally I think he will eventually meet the Curse of Harrenhall, probably by hand of Sansa (a fate that will fall on Roose as well).

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I still am trying to guess how he'll pass Moat Cailin with the troops from the Vale...

by feigning alliance to the Boltons.

He will also tell the High Sparrow about the incest, hoping the Lannisters, Stark, Stannis, Boltons and Tyrells are done by the end of the season

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I think today's episode was our first real TWOW spoiler - Littlefinger's next book move will be to take the North.



Now of course, LF is not going to marry off Sansa to Ramsay in the books. This is a TV-invention that helped crowd many characters into one setting, a necessary element of the medium. While I've found the Sansa-in-Winterfell plot completely illogical from the POV of Roose, LF, and Sansa herself, I can understand the motivation for bringing these folks together from the directors' point-of-view. That's all water under the bridge, though. What matters is what happens next.



I think it is pretty clear now that book-LF is going to play a very similar game in TWOW. Stannis will probably win, and a very desperate Cersei, whose kingdom is coming apart (Aegon, Dornish Fire and Blood, Ironborn Reavers, dissension with the Tyrells, and then Stannis taking the north) would be open to a deal similar to the one LF offered in E6. He then reveals Sansa as Sansa only after he holds much of the Riverlands and is in the north, and actually needs her in order to bring northerners to his side. At this point, she'd also be safe from Cersei. LF is assuming that the Vale can defeat whatever is left of Stannis's army and that Sansa will help secure northern support. These are actually pretty good assumptions, or at least wouldn't be if an army of the dead wasn't heading that way and if Stannis wasn't the Mannis. While I don't pretend to know how this will all exactly play out, I do think we have caught our first big glimpse of the books' future. I wouldn't say LF looking North is surprising (many people have predicted such) but it does seem a lot more likely as of today.

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LF is planning to ride into Winterfell like Sansa's knight in shining armour so she is eternally grateful to him and he can set her up as his ally in the north (and future wife) while he takes over the rest of Westeros. He will tell the vale lords that his real reason for marching is to save Sansa. Also LF is gambling on Cercei losing power soon.


However, Sansa will escape before the battle of ice and probably end up with Stannis. Roose will appear to win the battle only to be backstabbed by LF. Then Stannis will attack, having faked his defeat, and Sansa will be installed in Winterfell properly. I think LF will probably leaves for the south before Stannis attacks as I don't see him getting his head chopped off until the last season. Maybe Theon advises Stannis to attack Winterfell once the main force has left, like he did.

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There is no plan. Aidan Gillen is just reading the script.

This. The parts of LF's "masterplan" that we have seen so far make no sense at all, so what would make us believe that the ones yet to be revealed will have any kind of internal consistency?

I think it is pretty clear now that book-LF is going to play a very similar game in TWOW. Stannis will probably win, and a very desperate Cersei, whose kingdom is coming apart (Aegon, Dornish Fire and Blood, Ironborn Reavers, dissension with the Tyrells, and then Stannis taking the north) would be open to a deal similar to the one LF offered in E6.

I guess it's not impossible, but I find it a very unlikely development. By the end of ADWD, the Golden Company is massively disembarking all across the Stormlands. The Tyrells have abandoned the siege of Storm's End and the road to King's Landing is open. Many in Westeros are likely to join a new Targaryen pretender. I doubt that Cersei will care much about what happens in the far North in the middle of the winter. If she has any say in what the knights of the Vale can do, she'll want them at King's Landing to defend her and Tommen.

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I think Littlefinger's overall game has always been to sit on the Throne or die trying. The story begins for us at the point where he has knocked over the first domino in the chain he spent decades setting up, with the murder of Arryn and the frame job that started the war.

Right now he is perfectly positioned to take advantage of whatever happens at this next pivotal moment, at least as far as the military/alliance/treachery angle goes. He's keeping his lies going and his diplomatic options open as long as possible. He's poised on the verge of controlling a massive chunk of Westeros.

Thing is, I don't think all his master chessplaying is going to stand up to stuff like dragons and all the things Winter brings...

+1.

He is Harren the Black Mark 2

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Don't forget Vary's words about Littlefinger, "He'd burn the whole kingdom to be king of the ashes."



His strategy to Cersei is correct. Let Stannis and the Boltons fight. Sit tight in the Vale through the winter. Make alliance with whoever is left in Winterfell. His primary motivation is the accumulation of power. You don't spend your strength doing work others will do for you.



Cersei has not patienence and his her father said, "You're not as smart as you think you are." She'll make bad decisions simply out of spite and is slave to her own whims and feelings.

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