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nationalanthem91

What will Stannis do? (Show spoilers)

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I guess the title is pretty self-explanatory. As of episode 7, Stannis has the option of either sacrificing Shireen to R'hllor or not sacrificingShireen and risk losing the battle at Winterfell.Mel sure gave him a pretty awful ultimatum, basically saying "willingly kill your daughter or kiss your dreams if being king goodbye."

The majority part of me is pretty confident Stannis would never kill his own daughter, no matter how much he'd want the Iron Throne. This season has shown how much he cares for and loves Shireen. You can psychically see his paternal instincts kicking in when Mel even suggests doing such a thing to his daughter, hence why after she says there's "no other way", he just kicks her out of the tent. He looks as if he could have gotten sick from such an idea. It was actually a pretty good acting moment from Stephen!

I don't know, maybe it's just the wishful thinking in me, but I just really don't see Stannis ever agreeing to killing his child. What do y'all think?

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No way Stannis would allow it. If Shireen is burned, it will be behind his back. Or maybe after he dies (if he does). I hope that doesn't happen, though. She is the single sweetest person on Westeros.


If Shireen dies, WE RIOT


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Stannis will do what Stannis always does. He will carry on against whatever odds are put in front of him, secure in the knowledge that he is the One True King and that by sheer force of will alone, he will triumph.



He'll refuse to burn Shireen and blunder off into the snow. "Whatever the cost".


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I am currently having a laugh with a crackpot that came into my head that Mel and Selyse will try to burn Shireen, without Stannis's permission, but before they can Ramsay rides in and takes them all hostage. We have a pic which seems to show Ramsay at Stannis's camp and it wouldn't surprise me if we are meant to believe that Selyse crying in the snow is because Shireen is being burned when actually it is because she is being saved, and by the shows nastiest villain at that. It would also be interesting if Mel has misread her fires and she is going to be at Winterfell as a prisoner and will be walking along the walls to her execution.

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Mel will go behind Stannis' back and go to Selyse, while Stannis is busy fighting off the initial Bolton raid that we've seen in the trailers. Stannis gets back, is mightily pissed, and kills Mel, which is where the shot of Selyse falling to the ground in the trailers comes from


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Book Stannis would never harm Shireen (besides the fact that Mel and Shireen are at the wall.) But I'm not so sure with TV Stannis. I don't recall Stannis lusting after Melisandre in the books, yet last night he attempts to cop a feel in his tent. Show Stannis also lectured Jon on how Ned's honor is what got him killed. In a moment of true desperation (the Boltons are closing in on Stannis) I could see TV Stannis making the decision to harm Shireen out of the guise of duty (he doesn't want to be King, but it's his duty to be King).



His wife is batshit crazy and I found it rather bold that Mel would even suggest it to Stannis. But seeing as how the show created the Sansa rape scene for no other purpose than shock value ( they could have shown Ramsay seducing her on their wedding night, then afterward gone full Ramsay showing Sansa she was doomed once again), I don't know what to expect with Stannis and Shireen.



What worries me is what will happen to Jon with Mel away with Stannis.



It's assumed by most that Jon has warged into Ghost, only to be resurrected by Mel. He won't suffer the same side effects as others who were brought back because his "soul" will be safe within Ghost. The show is making it obvious that Olly is going to be the one to stab Jon, so who will be there to save him if Mel is hanging outside Winterfell?


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Crackpot theory:



Ramsay goes out to attack Stannis' camp, and Stannis drives them off (but suffering casualties). However, Ramsay manages to kidnap Shireen and take her back to Winterfell. The Boltons give stannis an ultimatum: Withdraw his forces or they will execute Shireen. Stannis is now left with the same choice; sacrifice his daughter and continue to try to take Winterfell, or withdraw and save his daughter. Stannis chooses to continue on because he will not have any damn ultimatums put to him. The Boltons kill Shireen, but Stannis wins the battle (but the Boltons possible withdraw back to the Dreadfort). Mel rubs it in Stannis' face "see I told you that you would have to sacrifice your daughter in order win."


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No way Stannis would allow it. If Shireen is burned, it will be behind his back. Or maybe after he dies (if he does). I hope that doesn't happen, though. She is the single sweetest person on Westeros.

If Shireen dies, WE RIOT

Unfortunately, I could see that happening. Selyse has been drinking Mel's kool-aid way more than Stannis has. She also doesn't treat Shireen the same way Stannis does. If Mel can influence her enough, I think she'd allow their daughter to be sacrificed.

I like the whole Ramsay crackpot idea. I just wonder if it'll actually happen. Unless he leaves in episode 8, I don't think it will.

The only people who I think aren't capable of hurting Shireen are, of course, Stannis, and Davos. I've read on other threads about the idea of Davos saving Shireen and killing Mel, which would be freaking AWESOME. It would certainly explain the whole "Selyse crying on the ground" shot from the trailer.

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I don't think stannis will have his daughter killed. no way. I don't the ramsay crackpot idea will happen. not enough time.


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I am currently having a laugh with a crackpot that came into my head that Mel and Selyse will try to burn Shireen, without Stannis's permission, but before they can Ramsay rides in and takes them all hostage. We have a pic which seems to show Ramsay at Stannis's camp and it wouldn't surprise me if we are meant to believe that Selyse crying in the snow is because Shireen is being burned when actually it is because she is being saved, and by the shows nastiest villain at that. It would also be interesting if Mel has misread her fires and she is going to be at Winterfell as a prisoner and will be walking along the walls to her execution.

Love it! Given how often book Mel misreads her fires, that would be pretty amazing.

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Another crackpot theory (I have already mentioned it in another thread): Stannis offers himself to Melisandre in place of Shireen. Before his death Stannis has told Davos to continue the war to put Shireen on the throne.


Melisandre now returns to the Wall with King's blood to resurrect Jon/Azor Ahai.


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Another crackpot theory (I have already mentioned it in another thread): Stannis offers himself to Melisandre in place of Shireen. Before his death Stannis has told Davos to continue the war to put Shireen on the throne.

Melisandre now returns to the Wall with King's blood to resurrect Jon/Azor Ahai.

Wow! That's pretty out there. At the same time, it would definitely make Stannis the "Ned Stark" of the season. To die a tragic death for his daughter. It would be the ultimate move to show his love for his child. If that were to happen, (which, I don't think will, but show wise, you never know) Stannis would definitely become a favorite of mine.

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I doubt this happens in TWOW, but there is a slight chance that, as his army is trapped between a Ramsey ambush and the walls of Winterfell, Stannis sacrifices his own kings blood so that Princess Shireen can rule with her Hand, Davos. Sometimes characters struggle for a "false goal" (like the throne) only to realize, at the last moment, there is something else they are meant to do.



Given that book-Varamyr feels an intense cold at his death, which could either be the transition to "second life" or the cold of the white walkers, I think the cold Jon feels as he slips into Ghost's skin at the end of ADWD could be either the death of his human body or the arrival of Cotter Pyke's "dead things in the sea."



Since we have seen wights wading into the ocean in the trailer, we might see them walking under water in E09, get a raven-letter about dead things coming out of the water at Eastwatch (to the incredulity of most of the NW, which remains in denial about the Long Night), and witness the arrival of the White Walkers at Castle Black in E10.



For this reason, I don't think we should necessarily expect Melisandra to bring Jon back.



The last scenes of this season might be: Sansa and a bereaved Shireen finding proof that R+L=J in the crypts of Winterfell (crypts which the Princess expressed curiosity about in the latest episode), and then the Ides of Marsh and/or Olly, Jon's eyes going warg-white as puddles of blood freeze around him, Ghost's eyes turning warg-white as he growls in Jon's quarters and the door handle turns, and then the Night King putting Jon's human body on the back of an ice spider and turning his human eyes white-walker blue.



ETA: Whoops! kind of got ninja'd by Bloodsteel Bitterran.


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She will do it without Stannis' knowledge or approval. In the books, Mel is left behind at Winterfell, any chance Stannis is so pissed at her now that he does leave her, Selyse, and Shireen? And while Jon is gone, Mel burns Shireen alive?

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I doubt this happens in TWOW, but there is a slight chance that, as his army is trapped between a Ramsey ambush and the walls of Winterfell, Stannis sacrifices his own kings blood so that Princess Shireen can rule with her Hand, Davos. Sometimes characters struggle for a "false goal" (like the throne) only to realize, at the last moment, there is something else they are meant to do.

Given that book-Varamyr feels an intense cold at his death, which could either be the transition to "second life" or the cold of the white walkers, I think the cold Jon feels as he slips into Ghost's skin at the end of ADWD could be either the death of his human body or the arrival of Cotter Pyke's "dead things in the sea."

Since we have seen wights wading into the ocean in the trailer, we might see them walking under water in E09, get a raven-letter about dead things coming out of the water at Eastwatch (to the incredulity of most of the NW, which remains in denial about the Long Night), and witness the arrival of the White Walkers at Castle Black in E10.

For this reason, I don't think we should necessarily expect Melisandra to bring Jon back.

The last scenes of this season might be: Sansa and a bereaved Shireen finding proof that R+L=J in the crypts of Winterfell (crypts which the Princess expressed curiosity about in the latest episode), and then the Ides of Marsh and/or Olly, Jon's eyes going warg-white as puddles of blood freeze around him, Ghost's eyes turning warg-white as he growls in Jon's quarters and the door handle turns, and then the Night King putting Jon's human body on the back of an ice spider and turning his human eyes white-walker blue.

ETA: Whoops! kind of got ninja'd by Bloodsteel Bitterran.

Not really, your post went into far more detail than mine. But I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought that.

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She will do it without Stannis' knowledge or approval. In the books, Mel is left behind at Winterfell, any chance Stannis is so pissed at her now that he does leave her, Selyse, and Shireen? And while Jon is gone, Mel burns Shireen alive?

Davos is the wild card though. If Selyse, Mel, and Shireen are sent back to the wall I think Davos might volunteer to go back, or Stannis might send him back as protection. Then again, he might convince Davos that he is needed at the camp. But I agree that Stannis most likely will not give an ok to burning Shireen.

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I could see Davos saving Shireen from an attempt by Selyse and Melisandre to burn her. Davos seems rather fond and protective of her.


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from episode 9 synopsis :



stannis faces a difficult decision



this may very well be the decision" what is life of his daughter against a kingdom "



and we also have the line from Mel in season 2



"You will betray the men who serve you; you will betray your family; you will betray all you once held dear. And, it will all be worth it."



so i think its very likely he will choose to do it ...though i still think it will be Selyse the one burns shireen when stannis is injured or dead ..

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