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[Book Spoilers] EP508 Discussion

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I start to wonder when did a set of books become a sort of religious obsession to some people to an extent that it's adaption incites such a level of hatred towards everything in it that some people find time to list every single aspect of said adaption with remarks of just what and how much they happen to hate it. Be it writing, be it directing, be it costumes, be it music, be it lead or secondary character acting, be it differences to the gospels OR similarities to the gospels. EVERYTHING annoys them. It's as the very existence of said adaption is a personal insult to those people.

:bowdown:

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In an attempt to lighten things up.



The secret on set is that Mance was meant to be revealed as the Lord of Bones but when filming started the Tormund actor forgot his lines and decided to improvise. Har!



What they won't tell you on the making of videos is that much of the battle scene in Hardhome was lifted straight from the rough cut of Pompeii and altered with CGI.


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I start to wonder when did a set of books become a sort of religious obsession to some people to an extent that it's adaption incites such a level of hatred towards everything in it that some people find time to list every single aspect of said adaption with remarks of just what and how much they happen to hate it. Be it writing, be it directing, be it costumes, be it music, be it lead or secondary character acting, be it differences to the gospels OR similarities to the gospels. EVERYTHING annoys them. It's as the very existence of said adaption is a personal insult to those people.

LOL, first, given that I am huge fan of Ramin Djawadi and his work, I would suggest you take that back :)

Honestly, is it that difficult to believe that some people won't like certain aspects of the show? You know, even the most popular and the shows of greatest qualities have been bashed. It is basically how Internet works. I am not going to say that cumulative effect of the objections is not overwhelming but rare are the people who hate it all. Basically, different people hate different things. Just as different people love different things.

As for being book purist, I would suggest you go through the subforums of the last couple of seasons, then of course, look at my posts and see that I am not one of those who believe that ASOIAF is word of God. I do believe that some things have been done better in the series. Just because I have few objections on the show, doesn't make me book purist.

Furthermore, is it that difficult to understand that some people watch the show and find some things problematic? Is it that difficult to imagine that some people will watch the show from the perspective of criticism? I have seen TV fans who have never heard of Martin or the book series raising some questions that even I, as a book fan, was unaware. So, let we stop pretending that Game of Thrones is universally liked show and that people are drooling whenever they see it. They are not.

I agree ... This forum is mostly used to endlessly bash the show. People are incredibly protective of his holiness GRRM and stop at nothing to bring down D&D. They add no meaningful discussion, just constant bitching. From the perspective of someone who only posts occasionally, all the energy spent on hating is pathetic.

Bring down D&D? LOL, are you seriously thinking that there are people here who believe that their posts can bring down producers of successful TV show? Like, seriously? Also, how would you characterize the energy spent on complaining about other people's criticism?

Edited by Risto

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LOL, first, given that I am huge fan of Ramin Djawadi and his work, I would suggest you take that back :)

Honestly, is it that difficult to believe that some people won't like certain aspects of the show? You know, even the most popular and the shows of greatest qualities have been bashed. It is basically how Internet works. I am not going to say that cumulative effect of the objections is not overwhelming but rare are the people who hate it all. Basically, different people hate different things. Just as different people love different things.

As for being book purist, I would suggest you go through the subforums of the last couple of seasons, then of course, look at my posts and see that I am not one of those who believe that ASOIAF is word of God. I do believe that some things have been done better in the series. Just because I have few objections on the show, doesn't make me book purist.

Furthermore, is it that difficult to understand that some people watch the show and find some things problematic? Is it that difficult to imagine that some people will watch the show from the perspective of criticism? I have seen TV fans who have never heard of Martin or the book series raising some questions that even I, as a book fan, was unaware. So, let we stop pretending that Game of Thrones is universally liked show and that people are drooling whenever they see it. They are not.

Bring down D&D? LOL, are you seriously thinking that there are people here who believe that their posts can bring down producers of successful TV show? Like, seriously? Also, how would you characterize the energy spent on complaining about other people's criticism?

Being VASTLY less energy consuming. The ones that hate the show are also the ones that watch and rewatch every episode the most times and finding things to hate in every subsequent rewatching. They also tend to compose the longest posts filled with bile.

Several people watch the show to critique it. Some of them actually have some interesting things to say like the moronic ways GRRM tends to name his characters at times. I too never noticed it before, not from the books nor the show because English happens not to be my first language but not in a million years can I now take the name Drogon the Dragon seriously.

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Being VASTLY less energy consuming. The ones that hate the show are also the ones that watch and rewatch every episode the most times and finding things to hate in every subsequent rewatching. They also tend to compose the longest posts filled with bile.

Several people watch the show to critique it. Some of them actually have some interesting things to say like the moronic ways GRRM tends to name his characters at times. I too never noticed it before, not from the books nor the show because English happens not to be my first language but not in a million years can I now take the name Drogon the Dragon seriously.

Well, I gave up of trying to memorize all of the Essosi character quite early in my reading process. As I have stated, GRRM is not infallible. But that doesn't make the producers of TV show above any sort of criticism. And as I have said. there is no TV show or movie that hasn't been criticized for this or that. Nothing is universally liked :)

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Except it is all but confirmed that Rickon will be the first Stark to return to Winterfell (at least physically :)).

He will be Stannis' public figure to bind the North to his cause. George promised us that Stannis is one of the lies Dany is supposed to slay; so, he should empower Stannis enough so that he could be a challenge to Dany when she comes. The only way to do that is to give him the North and that Manderly Fleet in the making.

Do you have a link or SSM? I can't remember reading this

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Well, I gave up of trying to memorize all of the Essosi character quite early in my reading process. As I have stated, GRRM is not infallible. But that doesn't make the producers of TV show above any sort of criticism. And as I have said. there is no TV show or movie that hasn't been criticized for this or that. Nothing is universally liked :)

Well I think purely as a writing technical abilities, abilities in getting the point across with the least effort and most economy, a skill that is needed in TV writing, also every day mundane dialogue, comedy ("fewer" was pure comedy gold, just ONE word), D&D are probably slightly superior to GRRM. This is purely my personal opinion, I'd also healthily recommend Benioff's 25th Hour, with Spike Lee at helm and Edward Norton in the lead. The guy can write. Where GRRM surpasses almost anyone in my opinion is building a complex, well thought out world, with characters that each have their own logical agendas that usually come at the expense of someone else's agendas that must be crushed to achieve a particular goal. All the while presenting the other perspective logically aswell. Plus the surprise element, I don't think I remember any time anywhere a major story simply killing off it's apparent main protagonist somewhat early in the proceedings and then just like that killing off the logical heir-at-revenge aswell. The world simply makes sense. They both have their strong suits. Mostly where the show has gone wrong was with a weak source material and NOT the invented material.

Edited by jacksonbrowne

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I mean really. The last few pages of "I hate the show" thread are "I hate the composer" now.

It's simple, don't read that thread. It's a self-proclaimed corner for whining so best avoid it if you don't like to read pages of people whining. My experience here is much better because I avoid that thread.

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It's simple, don't read that thread. It's a self-proclaimed corner for whining so best avoid it if you don't like to read pages of people whining. My experience here is much better because I avoid that thread.

No, I don't. I just went there to see if my favourite ignore-listers would change their song when the rest of the board, that is KNOWN for not liking the show at all is singing prases to it. I was content to find out the wouldn't, they are on the same "someone says crap about anything" and anotherone comes along high fiving and "metoo"-ing scenario. It just somewhat surprised me that apparently telling D&D are shit, Dany, Jon and Tyrion cannot act yadayadayadayada isn't enough for them, now the composer got HIS share of crap. And MeToo and HighFives on it.

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Well I think purely as a writing technical abilities, abilities in getting the point across with the least effort and most economy, a skill that is needed in TV writing, also every day mundane dialogue, comedy ("fewer" was pure comedy gold, just ONE word), D&D are probably slightly superior to GRRM. This is purely my personal opinion, I'd also healthily recommend Beinoff's 25th Hour, with Spike Lee at helm and Edward Norton in the lead. They guy can write. Where GRRM surpasses almost anyone in my opinion is building a complex, well thought out world, with characters that each have their own logical agendas that usually come at the expense of someone else's agendas that must be crushed to achieve a particular goal. All the while presenting the other perspective logically aswell. Plus the surprise element, I don't think I remember any time anywhere a major story simply killing off it's apparent main protagonist somewhat early in the proceedings and then just like that killing off the logical heir-at-revenge aswell. The world simply makes sense. They both have their strong suits. Mostly where the show has gone wrong was with a weak source material and NOT the invented material.

I actually disagree and Winterfell plot this season is quite the proof what happens when they have no material to lean into. Benioff made such hilarious lapse this week with that infamous line "creatively it made sense to us, because we wanted it to happen." They both lack the subtlety, the nuance in their writing. Their female characters are cliched version of their book counterparts and they have all been transformed into something seen countless time. Dany into Warrior Princess, Cersei into Evil Queen for modern ages, Sansa into victim, Arya in regular tomboy, Catelyn in just a mother. This season they have 6 storylines and two are catastrophic (Winterfell and Dorne), two are lowering IQ (Meereen and KL) and only two are working so far (Braavos and Wall). Furthermore, it seems they are lost in what they actually try to do, what message their work has. That doesn't mean they are the worst people out there, there are far worse shows than GoT, but simply, Martin's work thematically, artistically and lastly character-wise is superior than theirs. Because when left alone, we have idiocies like Winterfell this season.

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I actually disagree and Winterfell plot this season is quite the proof what happens when they have no material to lean into. Benioff made such hilarious lapse this week with that infamous line "creatively it made sense to us, because we wanted it to happen." They both lack the subtlety, the nuance in their writing. Their female characters are cliched version of their book counterparts and they have all been transformed into something seen countless time. Dany into Warrior Princess, Cersei into Evil Queen for modern ages, Sansa into victim, Arya in regular tomboy, Catelyn in just a mother. This season they have 6 storylines and two are catastrophic (Winterfell and Dorne), two are lowering IQ (Meereen and KL) and only two are working so far (Braavos and Wall). Furthermore, it seems they are lost in what they actually try to do, what message their work has. That doesn't mean they are the worst people out there, there are far worse shows than GoT, but simply, Martin's work thematically, artistically and lastly character-wise is superior than theirs. Because when left alone, we have idiocies like Winterfell this season.

Yeah, whatever. You have said that over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

All that.

Yawn

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I actually disagree and Winterfell plot this season is quite the proof what happens when they have no material to lean into. Benioff made such hilarious lapse this week with that infamous line "creatively it made sense to us, because we wanted it to happen." They both lack the subtlety, the nuance in their writing. Their female characters are cliched version of their book counterparts and they have all been transformed into something seen countless time. Dany into Warrior Princess, Cersei into Evil Queen for modern ages, Sansa into victim, Arya in regular tomboy, Catelyn in just a mother. This season they have 6 storylines and two are catastrophic (Winterfell and Dorne), two are lowering IQ (Meereen and KL) and only two are working so far (Braavos and Wall). Furthermore, it seems they are lost in what they actually try to do, what message their work has. That doesn't mean they are the worst people out there, there are far worse shows than GoT, but simply, Martin's work thematically, artistically and lastly character-wise is superior than theirs. Because when left alone, we have idiocies like Winterfell this season.

:agree:

Over and over and over :P

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Yeah, argumentation is boring. Can we go back to insulting the people in another thread?

So simply listing everything you hate for the 947th time and call them idiocy is argumentation according to you? There's something new to learn every day. Here's a suggestion, perhaps you'd like to offer your superior writing and argumentation services to those hacks running that piece of shit TV show and fix it? As they are quite stupid and only cabable of writing idiocy and cliche's I think the would welcome someone with a little bit of actual talent with open arms.

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I'm pretty sure idiocy and cliches is exactly what they need to be writing.

And it's not like they didn't have a talented writer to turn to is it.

Edited by Facebookless Man

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Several people watch the show to critique it. Some of them actually have some interesting things to say like the moronic ways GRRM tends to name his characters at times. I too never noticed it before, not from the books nor the show because English happens not to be my first language but not in a million years can I now take the name Drogon the Dragon seriously.

What are you talking about?!? Dickon Manwoody is the BEST. NAME. EVER.

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