TheSleeze Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Which is exactly the reason they were coming south in the first place, not something the NW were trying to prevent. Yes, but only after they helped them fight would they be given the land. The NW has no clue what went down at Hardhome, so why would they trust the wildlings to stay true to their word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lord of Cinder Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Yes, but only after they helped them fight would they be given the land. The NW has no clue what went down at Hardhome, so why would they trust the wildlings to stay true to their word. You can always find arguments for why they came from the north side, and some of them are pretty good, but I think it's still a choice between: either we do this, and something could go horribly wrong, or we do this, and everyone could possibly die and increase the numbers of the ever-growing wight army". And your sword is double-edged. Yes, the NW doesn't trust the wildlings (but I think it's safe to say that Jon does, and he's the one leading them from Hardhome). And Jon knows the NW doesn't trust the wild things, so why give them a chance to not let them through the gate? "Oh, we'll just come from the north side. Don't worry, the wight army won't ever find us, and ser Alliser, my good buddy, will surely let us through the gate! It's much safer to come from the north side! Just trust me ... Eh, Tormund, why are you sharpening your blade?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSleeze Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 You can always find arguments for why they came from the north side, and some of them are pretty good, but I think it's still a choice between: either we do this, and something could go horribly wrong, or we do this, and everyone could possibly die and increase the numbers of the ever-growing wight army". And your sword is double-edged. Yes, the NW doesn't trust the wildlings (but I think it's safe to say that Jon does, and he's the one leading them from Hardhome). And Jon knows the NW doesn't trust the wild things, so why give them a chance to not let them through the gate? "Oh, we'll just come from the north side. Don't worry, the wight army won't ever find us, and ser Alliser, my good buddy, will surely let us through the gate! It's much safer to come from the north side! Just trust me ... Eh, Tormund, why are you sharpening your blade?" I think Jon trusts Tormund, but I'm not sure if he trusts the rest of the wildlings. Plus if I was a wildling and survived the battle with the undead at Hardhome, I'd be getting as far south as possible as quick as I could. In all honesty though the WW & wights should probably already be at the wall. We know they can run now, so why wouldn't they just run all night and day until they get to the wall, its not like they need to rest or stop to eat. But that wouldn't give Jon and the boys time to get there and further the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dragon Demands Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 There's no way to reconcile it, it's just a plot hole. I'll only forgive this if they say that it was an earlier filmed scene before major rewrites (we know the Hardhome scene was drastically rewritten and expanded; fair enough) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lord of Cinder Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I think Jon trusts Tormund, but I'm not sure if he trusts the rest of the wildlings. Plus if I was a wildling and survived the battle with the undead at Hardhome, I'd be getting as far south as possible as quick as I could. In all honesty though the WW & wights should probably already be at the wall. We know they can run now, so why wouldn't they just run all night and day until they get to the wall, its not like they need to rest or stop to eat. But that wouldn't give Jon and the boys time to get there and further the story. Seems like another sorta kinda plothole. While it's cool to have White Walkers and giant wight armies in the show, I think it was clever of GRRM to keep them in the shadows, to maintain their mysteriosity so we don't really know what they're up to and exactly how powerful the Others and their army is. The only reason I can see for them not attacking The Wall or coming too close to it yet is that they're still increasing their numbers by hunting down the rest of the wildlings. Or maybe they don't have a way to get past The Wall. The wights also seem to dislike water something fierce. And are none of them able to use bows? "Hardhome" made it seem like water is the WWs and wights greatest weakness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borodin Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 The wights also seem to dislike water something fierce. And are none of them able to use bows? "Hardhome" made it seem like water is the WWs and wights greatest weakness. Another plot hole. Maybe they should have dug a moat instead of building a wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lord of Cinder Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Another plot hole. Maybe they should have dug a moat instead of building a wall. But, you see, The Wall is made of ... frozen water! It is the ultimate wight repellent! Gasp! It all makes sense now! :eek: In episode 10 last season, didn't the skeleton wights come out of a frozen lake to attack Bran and company? So they've already established that the wights are totally cool with water! I don't even ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Federico Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Because Jon didn't want to let thousands of Wildlings land at the same time behind the Wall when he can easily control them as a slow, significantly safer and easier to manage line of people trickling into his backyard. But I can understand how that completely reasonable explanation didn't come to you. It took 2-3 whole seconds of idle thought, after all.2 - 3 seconds after the Wildlings are south of the wall after this 'controlled' entry, the Wildlings outnumber the NW by 10:1, 30:1, 50:1, or maybe more. Control? On White Walkers elsewhere from Hardhome, we have no idea how many there are, or where they are? I'd be disappointed if there were fewer than a 100 WW's. From So Spake Martin, I seem to recall his saying they're a whole race. We must assume they're anywhere north of the wall, and some even south of it perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivashanko Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 what will annoy me is Alliser and Jon having a conversation from the top to the bottom of the 700 foot high wall The existence and, well, everything about the 700 foot Wall is unrealistic, in both the books and the TV show. Apparently even GRRM said 'What have I done?' when he found out how tall 700 feet were. The real answer is that D&D think most watchers are morons who won't notice and sadly are probably right about that. No need to feel superior. A lot of people aren't 'morons', many just don't particularly care about the logic in a show that's exists primarily as a form of entertainment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSleeze Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Another plot hole. Maybe they should have dug a moat instead of building a wall. +1 But, you see, The Wall is made of ... frozen water! It is the ultimate wight repellent! Gasp! It all makes sense now! :eek: In episode 10 last season, didn't the skeleton wights come out of a frozen lake to attack Bran and company? So they've already established that the wights are totally cool with water! I don't even ... Also at the end of the Hardhome sequence when the NK has his "arise chicken" moment, there are wildlings in the water that arise as undead and are still standing in the water. So obviously they can be in the water. Maybe they are just safe swimmers and don't go past the bouys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Federico Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 +1 Also at the end of the Hardhome sequence when the NK has his "arise chicken" moment, there are wildlings in the water that arise as undead and are still standing in the water. So obviously they can be in the water. Maybe they are just safe swimmers and don't go past the bouys.After resurrection by necromancy, one should wait half an hour before going swimming to avoid cramps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKitttenGuard Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 There's a gate at Castle Black, so they could have had a similar dramatic moment on the Southern side. Maybe not.Will Wun-Wun be as tall as the gate on the Southern Side?Kind of hard to say no when you are looking at a Giant in the eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eucratides_Megas Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 AHAHAHAHAHAHA...oh man was that dumb. Luckily it preceded the Shireen burning scene otherwise I would have missed it thanks to RageQuit. But really, that whole scene just completely reeks of pure amateur hour bullshit. D&D are colossal idiots, or they don't give a shit any more cause they only wanted to film the Red Wedding and that was two seasons ago, or both. I would be a little irked at Jon for obviously not returning ShowStannis's ships to Eastwatch, but ShowStannis is no longer of any concern to me. BookStannis is my king. ShowStannis can go unicorn hunting on cannibal island for all I care. At this point I want to replace ShowStannis with Commander Adama from BSG as NewShowStannis, with Tigh as NewShowDavos. But that would be too epic for mortal eyes, so it will never happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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