[Poll] How would you rate episode 509?

[Lady Ri]

9

I thought the episode was really solid. As heartbreaking as Shireen scene was it did not bother me from the storytelling perspective. I also don't perceive it as Stannis' character assassination.

I thought that Dornish scenes have improved. They could have explained what are Doran's agenda but perhaps that will be done in the final episode.

As to Daznak's scene..I always knew that it will never live up to the books. Having said that, I still really enjoyed it.

[Ser Harly of Southwell]

That ending was so lame I was actually laughing. Legit laughing. I'm not exaggerating.

And I am no longer a Stannis fan. Grrrrrrr... That made zero sense.

[Tol]

I get that they want to have the wildlings walk through the tunnel and Castle Black for effect. So it was a good scene from the books come to life. For that I can look past the flaw of docking at Eatwatch by the Sea and yet somehow being on the north side of the wall. (Plus)

Book Arya found clever ways to kill the merchant and the Lannister guy. So I'm disappointed with the Braavos arc this episode. The whole brothel scene was unnecessary. Aimlessly following Trant around with no real plan, made her look like a deer in headlights. She already used up her Mercy line from last season and now she's going to use the seduction lure this season. Full Mercy cannibalization going on. (Minus)

We could have had LSH and Jaime in the Riverlands, instead we get Dorne. We could have had book Dorne, instead we get the hand-slap game. I feel like we the viewers are Tyene Sand getting our hand slapped by D&D every time they hack out huge plots and arcs. So we repay them in kind with a slap to the face to vent our frustration. (Minus)

Ramsay's raid was a bit of a let down. The Shireen foreshadowing has been strong for a long time. Most everyone saw it coming a mile away. Not shocking. This is not the same Stannis that was holed up in Storm's End. The goal then was simple... survive and wait. Storm's End is NOTHING like his current situation. The more he waits, the more his men freeze, starve and die. Losing men and losing morale will lose him the battle before it even starts. Stannis has been drinking Mel's kool-aid for a while now. Melisandre has bent him to her will, but she's proved her power. Like he said, "Now is the time and I will risk everything." (Push)

Would have prefered to see Tyrion make a wager on the fights. Would have been a nice way to bond with Daario, but whatever. Jorah spent too much time on his back. I expected more from him. Sad to see he needed help. Somewhat redeemed by his excellent spear throw. Did not see the Hizdahr stabs coming. Overall the Drogon scenes were not as bad as I had feared, but not as good as I had hoped. (Plus)

7 feels about right.

[Ser Desmond Wine's Bane]

.I believe it is best to put the book and the show in two separate shelves and enjoy them for what they are. Stop the damn nitpicking.

It's TV - sit relax and enjoy....

I will nit pick about whatever I want to nitpick about.

The only reason I have spent any time on this show at all is precisely because I read the books. If it were not for that, I wouldn't watch the show at all.

Its TV - I will happily critique anything I choose and am under compulsion to find it enjoying. If it is not enjoyable I will say so.

[jacksonbrowne]

Hard for me to grade. Do they know that Martin will kill Shireen? The end was pretty terrific. I gave it a 6. But if Shireen ends up with the same fate in the books then it should get a 9.

That is the most hypocritical statement ever. "If Shireen burns to death it's bloody awful and D&D are horrible" whereas "If GRRM told that Shireen burns to death it's epic storytelling!"

I mean what the fuck? It's the SAME EXACT FATE! This just epitomises EVERYTHING happening here. EVERYTHING. It's just fine to burn sweet kids alive if it's our beloved GRRM doing it, if it's D&D it's the pinnacle of suck, right?

[Peter George Stewart]

10/10 Laughing at all the Stannis fans. Never could see what all the fuss was about. The climax of Stannis events was sickening. The ending was soaring. Emotional roller-coaster. Awesome episode.

[Alboin]

Stephen Dillane as Stannis and Drogon made this episode for me.

Made it so strong, that as much as I hated, through gritted teeth hated, Dorne and Indira Varma acting and idiotic sand snakes games and lines, it only brought my rating down by 2 points.

Arya scenes were good as well, although they didn't let her finish ser Meryn so not a fan (I know they will in the 10th episode)

Edited June 8, 2015 by Alboin

[Pomaxxx]

omg, i almost puked, this was more than i can stomach.

1)Arya Braavos

not even is she acting like the most obv and dumbest assassin in the world, but they swapped the NW bard with child-abusive Ser Merryn Trant? really? wow, who may guess what will happen next episode, eh. but wait, the Kindly Man will intervene, right, cuz he knows? uhm....yeah

2)Nights Watch

well, there was an Olly scene once again, so ruined. thank god emo-Jon is acting like a cry baby for everyone to see. not that Jon isnt having self-doubts (again, he is kinda convinced what he does is for the better), but there is no way he acts like a 15yo maiden in those scenarios.

Thorne on the other hand i feel it portrayed nicer than in the books. yeah, he seems to be a dick, but he is because he is

3)Meereen

the worst. Daario behaving like a complete moron in front of everyone. and instead of poison (which isnt as obvious in the books at the very first glance) the sons of the harpy ...just attack?

seriously? well thank god noone is there to protect but a like a dozen Unsullied...yeah.

ruined it.

but wait, eat ur retched meat again cuz u need more fuel for the next puke attack...

DROGON FOR THE RESCUE....whoop, whoop.

omg, really? instead of portraying him of a beast that needs taiming he defends his mother.

well, thank god after the departure of Dany and Drogon now everyone else is getting killed by the sons of the harpy.

4)Dorne

i have given up on that on, just crap.

the only good sequence to me was Stannis /Shireen, yeah. cruel and mad, but the scene was ok. loved Stannis face.

(ok, u got me. it was still trash because everything was cause by the 20 Bastard man killer commando)

ALSO THX FOR THE BOOK SPOILERS D&D

[Ennui Joi de vivre]

Solid 7.5

Wun Wun: I know he could go for a nice mammoth steak right about now.

Burning a little princess is such a Bastard thing to do . It really is.

I'm still trying to figure out who I should be mad at GRRM, Stannis, or DandD.

I'll just be mad at myself for falling into the emotional trap they collectively set.

Rat Bastards!

Did Dany blow a mental gasket? I swear I heard a cartoon Sproing.

ah, well..

All men must fry.

[Tijgy]

Starting with 5

Shireen and Davos: +2

Ramsay ninja's: -1

Stannis: -2

Shireen and Ellaria change of character in a blink of an eye: -1

The Fighting pit scene: -1

So I guess it is a 2

[JonCon's Red Beard]

A 3.

Terrible acting.

Terrible CGI.

Terrible characterization.

It's like the show resets itself after every episode.

[Ran]

417 votes, 5.87 average, 5.91 with top/bottom 5% removed, 7 median.

[ummester]

A 3.

Terrible acting.

Terrible CGI.

Terrible characterization.

It's like the show resets itself after every episode.

Fully agree on the bold black, half agree on the bold grey - but you are full of shit on the red :) The acting is pretty darn good. The girl who played Shireen was incredibly convincing, and ripped at my heartstrings.

Edited June 8, 2015 by ummester

[JonCon's Red Beard]

Fully agree on the bold black, half agree on the bold grey - but you are full of shit on the red :) The acting is pretty darn good. The girl who played Shireen was incredibly convincing, and ripped at my heartstrings.

She, Selyse and Stannis got the three points :dunno:

[Lord Freypie]

5/10

+ Touching Davos-Shireen scene.

+ A very funny moment imagining the boats putting the wildlings and Jon ashore north of the Wall then them walking over half the width of the continent to castle black gate.

+ Good resume of Dorne plotline by Doran ("you could just have sent a raven").

+ Featuring Drogon in Daznak pit and Dany riding him (a common point with the books !!!!).

+ Some relatively decent action, reminding the main source of inspiration of the show, Spartacus.

+ Jorah having touched both Daenerys and Tyrion now, let's hope greyscale will spread.

+ A sand snake scene showing they are 3 different characters and not clones.

+ Selig finally getting some dialog.

(incredible point : Dorne was the best part of an episode)

- Ramsay "Delta Force" Bolton raid succeeding without problem, making Stannis appear not only a criminal fanatic, but also some bad commander unable to defend his camp.

- Shireen burning.

- Selyse crying because mothers may only care.

- Ninja Harpy Turtles.

- Dinklage looking less convinced than ever.

- Shot of Olly looking unhappy again, poor boy.

- Most characters.

- Most plots.

Edited June 8, 2015 by Lord Freypie

[IHATETHESTARKS]

It seems like the avid book readers hate every episode lol.

The reality is that the show isn't trying to hit the book reader demographic, its trying to reach the casual fan and show watcher. While all of us are on the internet discussing the upcoming storylines, comparing it to the book, etc, the average fan(the majority and demographic) is simply watching the show and discussing it on social media or at work/school/whatever the following day.

For this reason, there are many things that are going to differentiate from the books. It is much easier to elaborate in a book, and there is more time for subtleties, development and mystery.

From this episode, for example:

- Showing Ollie snubbing Jon Snow seems cliche and corny, but that's because most of us already known what happens to Snow in the final episode of the season. The average viewer doesn't, which forces the producers of the show to add a scene of that nature that continues to make it evident that the kid has a problem with Jon.

- Making Meryn a pedophile. The extent of this is questionable, but it was evident that they were making him a bad man that the audience should hate. Most of us know who he is and why Arya despises him, but the average fan doesn't remember who he is until they may google it after the episode.

Anyways, I give it a 7.

Dorne has been terrible all season, it was actually pretty tolerable tonight, but still, it's mostly a waste of a scene every show.

Loved the scene with Shireen. They rushed it, but again, that's a TV thing and it may happen in the next book, too, apparently. I'm a big Melisandre fan, though, so I'm biased.

The first Arya scene was great, but the subsequent appearances seemed unorganized and a little illogical.

I liked the build up for the final scene, the Harpies initial appearance and attack was cool, as was Drogon's roars and everybody reacting to it. The Harpies only attacking 1 by 1 is an obvious complaint, but you can say that for virtually every action scene in the history of movies and television lol.

[ummester]

The whole reason Meryn is a pedophile, I think, is to make Arya's motivations seem more justifiable. Otherwise, he's just a guy following Cerseis' orders and Arya would be the bad guy by revenge killing him. It's a bit convoluted and white washy - but meh, it's nowhere near as bad as Tyrion.

Edited June 8, 2015 by ummester

[Mladen]

6/10

As someone who argued the possibility of Stannis pulling Agamemnon card to the Shireen's Iphigenia almost two years ago, this wasn't that surprising. But, this was tragically done. The sole idea of Stannis pulling Agamemnon card is in fact that sacrifice is not easy. It is not an errand that must be done ASAP, but a very tough decision because he is cornered to do in order to move on. "20 good men" most certainly was not the reason.

Daznak's pit was awful. Absolutely terrible. Like, seriously, the most underwhelming moments of the series.

Dorne as usual... Pointless to the moment where you just want all to lead to spontaneous combustion.

Arya was kinda OK...

[Esa1996]

That is the most hypocritical statement ever. "If Shireen burns to death it's bloody awful and D&D are horrible" whereas "If GRRM told that Shireen burns to death it's epic storytelling!"

I mean what the fuck? It's the SAME EXACT FATE! This just epitomises EVERYTHING happening here. EVERYTHING. It's just fine to burn sweet kids alive if it's our beloved GRRM doing it, if it's D&D it's the pinnacle of suck, right?

Well, that's what half the people here are doing IMO. Anything that's different from the book is said to be bad storytelling, whereas if GRRM would've done it, it would all be seen as brilliant storytelling. Besides, the show has improved some aspects from the books. While Dorne in the show might be a bit pointless, I find it to be FAR more entertaining than in the books. In the books the only character in Dorne I liked was Darkstar, and he was not seen all that much. Sansa's story line is also better in the show IMO.

[WhitewolfStark]

I agree, especially since he manipulated her emotionally at first. She didn't know what she's in for, it's like he lured her to her death.

Season Three, Mel and Stannis have a disagreement on how to sacrifice Gendry. Stannis says to just do it and be done with it (no need to torture the boy by dressing him up and lying to him). Mel says that if the "lamb" sees the knife and knows it's about to be killed, fear settles into its bones and it's a tainted sacrifice. And that she has done many sacrifices and the lamb has never seen the knife coming.

It shows that Stannis is taking Mel's way--and I thought Stephen Dillane did a great job at depicting how it was killing him--though I think with another episode or so they could have expanded just how desperate their situation was to better develop this. And I think they could have had a better father-daughter relationship before this season, doing it now just feels like catch up.