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[Book Spoilers] EP510 Discussion

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About Jon:



The resurrection poses a practical problem for the Night's Watch. He can't very well rise from the dead and be like "Sup Bruh's?" to the men who stabbed him to death. I think the Night's Watch isn't long for the world, and either the wildlings kill off the mutineers or else the Wall itself comes down with the magic that raises Jon from the dead, or a combination of both.



The Wall is the biggest Chekhov's gun in the series, and as

we know from GRRM's letter to his publishers

, it has to come down at some point.


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Ah the old budget excuse. How does a budget excuse generally poor writing?

And I might accept that argument easier if they hadn't spent so much on 600 face models that nobody could actually see.

Or Dorne? All those fancy european shots which were worthless, because everything surrounding it was poor.

Not to mention, they have a huge budget already.

Honestly, I'd feel much more inclined to listen to budget excuses if they apportioned in better, instead of blowing most of it on one battle sequence

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He's not necessarily less popular. It isn't clear from the show (and it's pretty unlikely in the books) that the watch is unified in support of the Mutiny. More likely it's a faction within the watch.

Whether he killed an other at HH or not, you still have these guys who think letting the wildlings through is a colossal mistake and that Jon is not that man to be leading them. That he's a traitor and the son of a traitor. That he loved a Wildling woman, that he's too friendly with the free folk, etc. These guys are blinded by their hatred of the Willings. The sight of seeing Wildlings and Giants coming through their gates would only reinforce that belief.

Remember that in ADWD, Jon makes the argument (to Bowen Marsh I think) that they need the Wildings on their side (literally and figuratively) because if they leave them to fend for themselves, they's just be more zombies to fight later. Marsh's reply is let them die and the watch can hide behind their wall. Again and again, he just can't see it any other way

My take is that the mutineers were not going to move against Jon as long as Stannis was alive. Jon and Stannis got along and Jon was given the authority by Stannis to deal with the Wildling problem as he saw fit and gave him the ships he needed. If Stannis had won at Winterfell and gained control of the North, the conspirators would have not moved against Jon. With Stannis likely dead and his army destroyed, Jon is a problem. We know the Boltons want him dead, they all ready tried sending an agent to kill him. So I think Westerosi politics played a role probably more important than the Wildling question.

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My take is that the mutineers were not going to move against Jon as long as Stannis was alive. Jon and Stannis got along and Jon was given the authority by Stannis to deal with the Wildling problem as he saw fit and gave him the ships he needed. If Stannis had won at Winterfell and gained control of the North, the conspirators would have not moved against Jon. With Stannis likely dead and his army destroyed, Jon is a problem. We know the Boltons want him dead, they all ready tried sending an agent to kill him. So I think Westerosi politics played a role probably more important than the Wildling question.

That's a good point. If Stannis had taken Winterfell, they wouldn't have felt comfortable offing Jon. Stannis would come and put the lot to the torch.

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Jon went to HH and killed a White Walker in single combat, discovering another of their weaknesses. Jon should be a bloody legend amongst even the men who hated the wildlings the most.

Robb Stark never lost a battle but his own side turned on him. Jeor Mormont got them out of the Fist alive but his own men killed him. Jealousy and grievance close to home have brought down many a great leader.

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My take is that the mutineers were not going to move against Jon as long as Stannis was alive. Jon and Stannis got along and Jon was given the authority by Stannis to deal with the Wildling problem as he saw fit and gave him the ships he needed. If Stannis had won at Winterfell and gained control of the North, the conspirators would have not moved against Jon. With Stannis likely dead and his army destroyed, Jon is a problem. We know the Boltons want him dead, they all ready tried sending an agent to kill him. So I think Westerosi politics played a role probably more important than the Wildling question.

That's basically exactly what I said here http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/131070-book-spoilers-ep510-discussion/?p=7109685 :cheers:

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For those who keep harping on this being the worst show in this season or the worst season, it really is not at all. It has some great points. Was this the best show of all season? No. But is it the worst? No. This season is one of the best for several reasons, one including dragon riding.

If you don't like the show let's see you do better with the limitations of the budget. I can tell you that they worked their butts off and they did a good job. Let's see you create something as good onscreen.

It's all a matter of opinion, I don't think it was the worst episode in the series but I do feel it was the worst season. It took like the first 7 episodes for it to go anywhere and then the last 3 felt extremely rushed. But that's just my opinion, I wouldn't knock anyone else for theirs.

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Why again does he need a teleporter to get to Mereen? He was traveling there with Tyrion from the start of the season.

To get him there quicker?

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Changing the subject to things apart from the north and the wall:



-The big reveal scene in the house of BW was incredible. It really highlights weirdness of the concept of "no one" and how alien the faith of the faceless men is.



-The walk of shame scene was also incredible well done. That was the first time that I truly felt sorry for Cersei, in either the show or the books. Lena headey was brilliant.


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I agree with Vikings. I enjoy that show much more then anything that GoT presents. Every finale has lived up to the hype and if people want to criticize the action sequences, let me remind you of the Barristan and Dorne fight scenes.

The only thing I was riveted about this season was Hardhome. I literally jumped out of my seat when Jon killed the WW.

Xena was awesome too. The costuming was top notch (same group that later did LOTR). The principles did many of their own stunts. Was it campy? Yes. But that was what made it awesome.

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