Who is Azor Ahai?

[TheNiggardlyBastard]

I have heard many theories on who Azor Ahai is: Jon Snow, Dany, Aegon, Victarion, Stannis, and even Jorah. The most likely to me is Jon Snow, mostly because he fits the qualifications almost perfectly (That is if R + L = J is accurate). But for all we know, all these prophecies could just be bullshit. GRRM is the type of guy who would lead us on with all these awesome prophecies, and then in the end reveal them all to be false. Anyway, assuming the Azor Ahai prophecy is real, who do you think is Azor Ahai?

[GtrGbln]

I have heard many theories on who Azor Ahai is: Jon Snow, Dany, Aegon, Victarion, Stannis, and even Jorah. The most likely to me is Jon Snow, mostly because he fits the qualifications almost perfectly (That is if R + L = J is accurate). But for all we know, all these prophecies could just be bullshit. GRRM is the type of guy who would lead us on with all these awesome prophecies, and then in the end reveal them all to be false. Anyway, assuming the Azor Ahai prophecy is real, who do you think is Azor Ahai?

I disagree 100%. All kinds of ifs and maybes are necessary to make Jon fit the prophecies. Born of smoke and salt? Explain how Jon Snow could have been born under those circumstances without making any assumptions or using the words if or maybe. You can't do it. Dany on the other hand was born on a volcanic island (smoke) in the middle of the Narrow Sea. (salt) To wake dragons from stone? Okay explain how and when he did or is going to do that under the same conditions as the first example. No assumptions, ifs or maybes. Once again Dany hatched (woke) dragons from fossilized eggs. (stone) Last but not least beneath a bleeding star. Dany's dragons were born at night in the light of the Red Comet while it was at its zenith. What was Jon doing while the comet was in the skies? Certainly nothing that could be easily construed as waking dragons from stone. If you can think of anything please share but bear in mind the same rules apply. I didn't use any mental gymnastics to illustrate Dany's qualifications so you can't to illustrate Jon's.

I'm always puzzled frankly when people are absolutely convinced Jon is AA. Almost everything we know about that prophecy indicates its Dany. Yeah yeah I know "because obvious" that is not now nor has it ever been a good argument for anything.

[Regular John Umber]

Azor Ahai is a legendary figure from before the age of heroes who may or may not have existed.

no one else is Azor Ahai. There is no evidence that anyone will ever be.

[Bran17]

I'm always puzzled frankly when people are absolutely convinced Jon is AA. Almost everything we know about that prophecy indicates its Dany. Yeah yeah I know "because obvious" that is not now nor has it ever been a good argument for anything.

They love Jon, they hate Dany. That's why they twist everything to make sure Jon is AAR and "the"(oh God...) central character. It caaaan't be her. :bs:

[LordImp]

Dany.

[Lord Varys]

If there is only one hero/savior it is most certainly Daenerys. Every single thing we know about the prophecy points towards her while Jon Snow has nothing to offer whatsoever prophecy-wise.

But my guess actually is that there will be a savior trinity - Daenerys, Jon Snow, and Tyrion, the three heads of the three-headed dragon - who will more or less equally do the heroic stuff.

[ShaggyCat]

I think, based on all the evidence of the books, SSMs and the overall structure of the series that seems to be setting up Dany and Jon as central figures at opposite ends of the Planetos, that Dany is AA reborn and Jon is the Last Hero reborn.

So who is the Prince that Was Promised? Both? None?

[TheAssassin]

If there is only one hero/savior it is most certainly Daenerys. Every single thing we know about the prophecy points towards her while Jon Snow has nothing to offer whatsoever prophecy-wise.

But my guess actually is that there will be a savior trinity - Daenerys, Jon Snow, and Tyrion, the three heads of the three-headed dragon - who will more or less equally do the heroic stuff.

I think, based on all the evidence of the books, SSMs and the overall structure of the series that seems to be setting up Dany and Jon as central figures at opposite ends of the Planetos, that Dany is AA reborn and Jon is the Last Hero reborn.

So who is the Prince that Was Promised? Both? None?

I've always been of the thought that there would indeed be three saviors, due to the three-headed dragon talk. However, I've always liked the idea of Jon (Ice and Fire) being the prince that was promised ("...his is the song of ice and fire" alluding to his Stark/Targaryen parentage), Daenerys (Fire) being Azor Ahai (due to her literally fulfilling the prophecy) and Bran (Ice) being the Last Hero.

The evidence for Bran being the Last Hero isn't as strong as the evidence for Dany being Azor Ahai is. However, of all the characters in the books, he is the only one that (knowingly or not) sook out the children of the forest.

Plus, over and over again, he tells himself that he will never be a knight like he had always wanted. It's possible, either by warging or by utilizing a special saddle, that he would fly as a dragon knight. What greater knights are there than those that ride dragons?

I will concede, though, that if the third head is not Bran, then Tyrion makes sense as well. He would throw off the Ice and Fire dynamic at I was going for.

[Hippo]

Azor Ahai is a legendary figure from before the age of heroes who may or may not have existed.

no one else is Azor Ahai. There is no evidence that anyone will ever be.

This, I think at the end of the series people will still be trying to identify AA.

There will be many 'heroes' but I can't see any of them wielding a fire sword.

[joluoto2]

Azor Ahai is a person from Essosi legends, that may or may not have been the same as the Westerosi Last Hero. He died long ago. A wacky religion from the East believes he will be reborn.

[Reposado]

This, I think at the end of the series people will still be trying to identify AA.

There will be many 'heroes' but I can't see any of them wielding a fire sword.

the dragons have been referred to as a sword against the darkness

[calo760]

“It is night in your Seven Kingdoms now,' the red woman went on, 'but soon the sun will rise again. The war continues, Davos Seaworth, and some will soon learn that even an ember in the ashes can still ignite a great blaze. The old maester looked at Stannis and saw only a man. You see a king. You are both wrong. He is the Lord's chosen, the warrior of fire. I have seen him leading the fight against the dark, I have seen it in the flames. The flames do not lie, else you would not be here. It is written in prophecy as well. When the red star bleeds and the darkness gathers, Azor Ahai shall be born again amidst smoke and salt to wake dragons out of stone.”

.
”In ancient books of Asshai it is written that there will come a day after a long summer when the stars bleed and the cold breath of darkness falls heavy on the world. In this dread hour a warrior shall draw from the fire a burning sword. And tha sword shall be Lightbringer, the Red Sword of Heroes, and he who clasps it shall be Azor Ahai come again, and the darkness shall flee before him.” She lifted her voice, so it carried out over the fathered hose. “Azor Ahai, beloved of R’hllor! The Warrior of Light, the Son of Fire! Come forth, your sword awaits you! Come forth and take it into your hand!”

.
"No one ever looked for a girl. It was a prince that was promised... Rhaegar, I thought... The error crept in from the translation. Dragons are neither male nor female... Daenerys is the one, born amidst salt and smoke... Lady Melisandre has misread the signs. Stannis has some of the dragon blood in him, yes... Rhaelle, Egg's little girl, she was how they came by it... They must send her a Maester. Daenerys must be counseled, taught, protected..."

.

I would say Dany is the obvious choice, and evidence hints to Jon Snow as well. I think either there will be multiple heroes that make up AA ("The dragon has three heads"), or Azor Ahai will be someone who we aren't expecting. It would be funny if Stannis was the Last hero the entire time.

[Lord Varys]

Azor Ahai may indeed never have existed. At least not as the Last Hero of Westeros people seem to think he was. But there is supposed to come a savior as there is the Targaryen promised prince prophecy (they don't think that this guy is the reborn version of the long-dead real deal). One imagines that the promised prince/savior trinity/three dragon heads will roughly fulfill a similar role as the Last Hero back in the War for the dawn.

TWoIaF makes it clear that various eastern legends attribute the ending of the Long Night to some savior guy who has different names in various cultures. My guess is that the various peoples attributed the ending of the Long Night to their local heroes and kings and gods simply because they had to make sense of the story. I mean, surely we as a people must have done something wrong if it is suddenly cold and dark all the time. We aren't scientists, we are stupid people and think everything bad must happen for a reason that has something to do with us, right? And thus something we do can also change everything to the better.

Over the centuries a sort of unified hero version may have been evolved from those various fairy-tales - the guy the red priests now call Azor Ahai. After all, everybody had experienced the Long Night, and if some hero had ended it it must have been the same guy for everybody, right?

The idea that whatever occurred in Westeros during the War for the Dawn eventually spread east and inspired cultures who look down on the savages in the west to tell each other tales about a hero who actually came from there makes no sense at all. Especially since no story about Azor Ahai ever mentioned the Others - which is very strange if the stories about Azor Ahai are supposed to contain a grain of truth.

Apparently there was a Last Hero during the War for the Dawn but he most likely wasn't Azor Ahai (although he may have done some stuff of the sort Azor Ahai may have done). The only historical thing about the War for the Dawn Yandel gives us seems to be the story about people banding together to fight the evil (the Rhoynar version of the tale). That sounds convincing.

Note that this doesn't mean that Azor Ahai, Hyrkoon the Hero, Eldric Shadowchaser, or Yin Tar weren't historical figures - they may have existed, but if they did they most likely had nothing to do with the end of the Long Night. Hyrkoon may even have been a fire mage and carried a burning sword as it seems he founded the Patrimony of Hyrkoon which apparently continued to practice fire and blood magic until its downfall in something that looks like an unnatural/magical desertification of their core lands.

[Stannis is the Fury]

The one thing that makes me question Jon being Azor Ahai is that he doesn't really have anything to sacrifice that is as important as Nissa Nissa was to Azor Ahai, does he? For Dany one of her Dragons may be significant enough. But I think Stannis is really Azor Ahai because 1) Mel believes that he is 2) His goal is the same as Azor Ahai's was, which was stopping the Long Night, and 3) he has the most significant sacrifice to make with Shireen.

Shireen is as important to Stannis as Nissa Nissa was to Azor Ahai and that is why I think that it is really Stannis who is Azor Ahai Reborn.

[Danta_Row]

Mel Believes Stannis is, but by the end of Dance every time she looks for Stannis/AA in her fires all she sees is Snow. Also, I'm not a believer in taking Mel at her word. She seems to be generally accurate, but when she goes into specifics she usually misses. I'm still undecided on who I think AA really is, but I don't buy an idea based on Mel. Though I agree that Shireen is a likely Nissa Nissa stand in.

[Ser Alex Dayne]

 

I disagree 100%. All kinds of ifs and maybes are necessary to make Jon fit the prophecies. Born of smoke and salt? Explain how Jon Snow could have been born under those circumstances without making any assumptions or using the words if or maybe. You can't do it. Dany on the other hand was born on a volcanic island (smoke) in the middle of the Narrow Sea. (salt) To wake dragons from stone? Okay explain how and when he did or is going to do that under the same conditions as the first example. No assumptions, ifs or maybes. Once again Dany hatched (woke) dragons from fossilized eggs. (stone) Last but not least beneath a bleeding star. Dany's dragons were born at night in the light of the Red Comet while it was at its zenith. What was Jon doing while the comet was in the skies? Certainly nothing that could be easily construed as waking dragons from stone. If you can think of anything please share but bear in mind the same rules apply. I didn't use any mental gymnastics to illustrate Dany's qualifications so you can't to illustrate Jon's.

 

I'm always puzzled frankly when people are absolutely convinced Jon is AA. Almost everything we know about that prophecy indicates its Dany. Yeah yeah I know "because obvious" that is not now nor has it ever been a good argument for anything. 

I will say this, even though I do believe that jon is azor ahai I do admit that at the moment dany fits more closely and has fits with more of the qualifications although the reasons I think Jon is Azor Ahai, and the prince that was promised since I believe that they are the same thing and am a firm believer in r+l=j, have more to do with prophetic dreams and hints strewn out throughout the story, like lyanna's promise me hence he would be a prince promised and when mel asks r'hollor to show her azor ahai it she expects stannis but it only shows her "Snow" like Jon Snow and in ADWD jon has had dreams where he is wielding a burning red sword killing an army of the dead now that's not to say that it confirms jon or that dany hasn't had similar dreams but none of them have had anything to do with a sword resembling lightbringer she has a dream that she was wearing rhaegars armour on the trident on her dragons and saw the usurpers men armored in Ice (Others?) and melted them with dragon fire but again that could just symbolize her role to play i  the coming war with the others while the story points strong hints that jon will be the one to lead them that he will be Azor Ahai

[Daemon The Black Dragon]

The one thing that makes me question Jon being Azor Ahai is that he doesn't really have anything to sacrifice that is as important as Nissa Nissa was to Azor Ahai, does he? For Dany one of her Dragons may be significant enough. But I think Stannis is really Azor Ahai because 1) Mel believes that he is 2) His goal is the same as Azor Ahai's was, which was stopping the Long Night, and 3) he has the most significant sacrifice to make with Shireen.
Shireen is as important to Stannis as Nissa Nissa was to Azor Ahai and that is why I think that it is really Stannis who is Azor Ahai Reborn.

Jon has important things to sacifice. If anyone does turn out to be Azor Ahai reborn it doesn't mean their story/life will play out like the first AA.

[The Dragons Hand]

Daenerys.

Jon is like AAR in training.

People can invent any reason for a character they like to be AAR, Theon, Jaime, Moon-Boy, etc.

[Drogonthedread]

Dany

and people can go in denial and still argue that hot pie is AAR after the series ended which will not matter ..if people want to be in that bubble then let them be

and do remember that in the draft of grrm R L=J was there mainly so jon can love arya

r l=j have importance but dont mix that with prophecies because dany as AAR and TPWP have more evidence than R L=J

But unforutanately there is no hundred iteration of threads because it involves dany

[Mithras]

If there is only one hero/savior it is most certainly Daenerys.

 

Then I am rooting for the Others.

 

But my guess actually is that there will be a savior trinity - Daenerys, Jon Snow, and Tyrion, the three heads of the three-headed dragon - who will more or less equally do the heroic stuff.

 

Then I am burning my books.