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Little Questions That Don't Fit Anywhere Else Part 3

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Will the winter end when the NK is killed?

In the show, I think so.

In the books, I dont know.

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On 9/28/2017 at 12:26 PM, valgrel said:

Who will use Heartsbane in the fight against WW ? Sam will certainly not, and it would be a waste to leave the only 2-handed valyrian sword (Longclaw, Oathkeeper are bastard swords) in its sheath. 

Jorah could be the best choice, or maybe Sandor. Anyone else ?

I don't think anyone will. I think Gendry will reforge it into two regular sized swords.

If it stays as one, The Hound would make sense because of it's size and his training with swords.

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Posted (edited)

OK, maybe I missed this, but I cant be the only one who has noticed that we have a  major character for each of The Seven? Assuming Boat Baby.....Father= Jon Snow, Mother= Daenerys, Warrior= Jamie, Smith= Gendry, Crone= Melisandre, Stranger= Arya. Perhaps this is how they defeat the NK?

Edited by Golden Eyed Meraxes

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Posted (edited)

I just remembered Benjen's horse from Season 7 Episode 6, when Benjen saves Jon and Jon rides on it to the Wall (and of course in earlier episodes too, with Bran and Meera) - Is Benjen's horse resurrected/living dead with COTF magic like he is or is it just a normal horse? I don't remember how it looked but I think maybe it was half decaying... Did the COTF save his horse with dragonglass through its heart just like they saved him? And if not, how the hell has that horse survived north of the Wall for so long?

Edited by Adam Targaryen

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@John Suburbs @Lord Varys

Even in the show, it looks like, Marge did it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2W2xHM4cWo

At 3:59 Joffrey gives his goblet to Marge, she goes with it to the table, not the table where Tyrion and Sansa were sitting (right table), not the table where Olenna was sitting with Mace (left table), but a different table, smaller than others, the one at which Joffret and Margaery were sitting in the beginning of the video (cetral table). Olenna didn't left her table. So, it was Marge, who dropped the poison into wine, while she was holding the cup in her hands.

In the book-version, during the adding of poison, the chalice was standing on Tyrion's table, on the inner side of it, closer to the pie, on the opposite side from Tyrion, on the side closer to Marge.

If I'm not mistaken, the script for this episode was written by GRRM. So, what their sitting arrangements looked like in the show, is close to what they were in the book.

Thus, when (in the book-version) Joffrey returned to Tyrion's table, after cutting the pie, he didn't went on the other side of the table, where Tyrion was sitting with Sansa, he stayed on the "inner side", and that's where he left his chalice, and from where he picked it up. So, when he was choking and dying from poison, he was separated by the table from Tyrion and Garlan. Thus, whoever poisoned his wine, was on this (inner) side of the table. And out of those three people (Joffrey, Marge and Olenna), Marge is the only one, who could have done it (Olenna is not tall enough, and Joffrey didn't poisoned himself).

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1 hour ago, Megorova said:

@John Suburbs @Lord Varys

Even in the show, it looks like, Marge did it.

The show has Olenna confess to Margaery that she killed Joffrey. And Margaery had no clue what was about to happen. We also see Olenna mess with the wine goblet in the episode. It is subtle but it is there.

 

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On 7/5/2019 at 3:46 PM, Megorova said:

@John Suburbs @Lord Varys

Even in the show, it looks like, Marge did it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2W2xHM4cWo

At 3:59 Joffrey gives his goblet to Marge, she goes with it to the table, not the table where Tyrion and Sansa were sitting (right table), not the table where Olenna was sitting with Mace (left table), but a different table, smaller than others, the one at which Joffret and Margaery were sitting in the beginning of the video (cetral table). Olenna didn't left her table. So, it was Marge, who dropped the poison into wine, while she was holding the cup in her hands.

In the book-version, during the adding of poison, the chalice was standing on Tyrion's table, on the inner side of it, closer to the pie, on the opposite side from Tyrion, on the side closer to Marge.

If I'm not mistaken, the script for this episode was written by GRRM. So, what their sitting arrangements looked like in the show, is close to what they were in the book.

Thus, when (in the book-version) Joffrey returned to Tyrion's table, after cutting the pie, he didn't went on the other side of the table, where Tyrion was sitting with Sansa, he stayed on the "inner side", and that's where he left his chalice, and from where he picked it up. So, when he was choking and dying from poison, he was separated by the table from Tyrion and Garlan. Thus, whoever poisoned his wine, was on this (inner) side of the table. And out of those three people (Joffrey, Marge and Olenna), Marge is the only one, who could have done it (Olenna is not tall enough, and Joffrey didn't poisoned himself).

 

On 7/5/2019 at 4:52 PM, Lord Varys said:

The show has Olenna confess to Margaery that she killed Joffrey. And Margaery had no clue what was about to happen. We also see Olenna mess with the wine goblet in the episode. It is subtle but it is there.

 

:agree:This. In the mummer's farce, it is clear that Margy did not do it, not like there is any reason to think that what that happens in the show confirms anything in the books.

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1 minute ago, John Suburbs said:

 

:agree:This. In the mummer's farce, it is clear that Margy did not do it, not like there is any reason to think that what that happens in the show confirms anything in the books.

Not exactly. The fact that George wrote the Purple Wedding certainly allows us to cite the fact that there is no pie there and no talk of him ever speculating about the pie. I mean, at this point in the story they certainly could have gone with whatever you think the pie poisoning plot was about if that was what George's intention was. They could also have decided to not go down that route, of course, but they could have made things right there, no? The fact that they made Joff's death more or less the way it went down as per the 'official story' in the books certainly helps to put your idea into way out there fringe conspiracy territory.

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On 7/9/2019 at 10:12 AM, Lord Varys said:

Not exactly. The fact that George wrote the Purple Wedding certainly allows us to cite the fact that there is no pie there and no talk of him ever speculating about the pie. I mean, at this point in the story they certainly could have gone with whatever you think the pie poisoning plot was about if that was what George's intention was. They could also have decided to not go down that route, of course, but they could have made things right there, no? The fact that they made Joff's death more or less the way it went down as per the 'official story' in the books certainly helps to put your idea into way out there fringe conspiracy territory.

The pie is too complicated for the show, and much less salacious. They would have to explain the history of Highgarden hegemony, the recent shifts in the balance of power, and all the rest. With the wine, they can first create the evil, sexually depraved Joffrey that makes for good television and then explain Lady Olenna's actions with nothing more than "you don't think I would really let you marry that monster, do you?"

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The whole goblet thing was still a pure stroke of luck for Olenna. Maergery could have easily drunk from it as well. And there was every chance she would. Hence this plan being completely bonkers in it's execution and only luck prevented someone else from choking to death, namely Olenna's own family and biggest chess piece.

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2 hours ago, John Suburbs said:

The pie is too complicated for the show, and much less salacious. They would have to explain the history of Highgarden hegemony, the recent shifts in the balance of power, and all the rest. With the wine, they can first create the evil, sexually depraved Joffrey that makes for good television and then explain Lady Olenna's actions with nothing more than "you don't think I would really let you marry that monster, do you?"

I'd say that the pie idea is also far too complicated for the novels ;-).

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17 hours ago, Mystical said:

The whole goblet thing was still a pure stroke of luck for Olenna. Maergery could have easily drunk from it as well. And there was every chance she would. Hence this plan being completely bonkers in it's execution and only luck prevented someone else from choking to death, namely Olenna's own family and biggest chess piece.

It was not luck nor was there ever any danger to Margaery because there was no poison in the chalice until Joffrey barfed into it. The poison was in the pie; Tyrion was the target, not Joffrey.

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17 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

I'd say that the pie idea is also far too complicated for the novels ;-).

It is not. The whole thing can, and will, be explained in two or three paragraphs -- a drop in the bucket for a 1000-page novel.

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42 minutes ago, John Suburbs said:

It is not. The whole thing can, and will, be explained in two or three paragraphs -- a drop in the bucket for a 1000-page novel.

Then it could also have been done in the show.

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Posted (edited)

Maybe this has been asked before, I apologize if it has.  I didn’t want to dig through three separate threads.  I was thinking about something earlier and it dawned on me, why was the term “war of the five kings” even a thing in the show?  Robb, Stannis, and Renly were vying for the iron throne or at least defeating the Lannister’s.  However, Balon Greyjoy literally had nothing to do with the conflicts in the crown, storm, or river lands.  He was calling himself king sure, but he wasn’t making any offensive moves against anybody relevant to the overall war.  The Iron Born in the show seem to literally just secede because there’s a war going on and forces who might retaliate are all too busy.  Nothing ever seems to answer the question of how their secession was ended either, at Joffrey’s wedding one of the dwarf jousters is Balon Greyjoy but the show never explains why he’s no longer king of the iron islands or what it had to do with the war “Joffrey won.”

I just watched seasons 1-4 within the last month or so and there weren’t any kind of skirmishes mentioned between Stark or Baratheon forces and the iron born.  The closest thing would be Theon taking Winterfell, and even then Balon Greyjoy didn’t want the north nor did he make any attempt to go after the iron throne.  That was solely a northern problem only faintly related to Robb’s involvement in the war against Joffrey.  It also happened after the war council in season two where “war of the five kings” was first talked about. 

Did I miss something really obvious or am I onto a plot hole that hasn’t gotten much attention?

Edited by YoungGriff89
I don’t know why some of it is highlighted and some isn’t.

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Is it possible Kit Harington left the coffee cup on the set? Since he was seen having too much of a drink some time after the show ended (plus the rehab clinic), and Sophie saying it's probably Kit who left the cup, is it possible Kit was simply drinking lots of coffee in and out of the set to be simply sober?

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