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Lord Neddard Stark

Biggest criticism of the series ?

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We always like to sing the numerous praises of the series, but for a change I'm curious, whats everyone's biggest criticism of the series ? To stop this just being a complete bash session, try and book end your criticism with one of the things you love most about the series... 

 

Mine...(Edit)

 

1) Chapters seem to end as soon as they seem to get a bit of momentum, I think they are too short.

 

2) Aegon still being alive felt like it came out of left field

 

3) There's always at least 1 story line in each book that feels like filler. Arya in book 1, Jon in book 2, Brienne in feast and Dany in Dance.

 

Favorite thing in the series, would be the diverse cast of characters. Well written women are somewhat of a rarity in the fantasy genre and it's nice to finally have some.  

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1. Ad nauseum repetition of certain lines.

2. The number of characters. If you can't remember its name, most likely the character shouldn't have existed.

3. Procrastination of certain things in the books.

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Too many characters pissing themselves. 

 

Brienne becoming disfigured and having her face chewed off. 

 

The unsullied training involving killing babies and puppies

 

unborn puppy on a stick

 

No Robb POV chapters

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I don't keep a record of every topic started on the site. and I don't have the time to check it everyday in case I repeat something somebody else has said. the amount of people that use this site it's going to happen. Shit happens

I'm not locking this since the other was locked already for length, but just as general advice for the future:
When the search function is working again, it would be preferable to use that, rather than ending up with multiple threads on the same topic.
Failing that, at least take a glance on the first 2 or 3 pages of the forum for threads your post is relevant for
If, whilst the search function is not working, you are looking for something on the forum, you can use google search with "site:Westeros.org *key words here*". Sometimes this is actually easier than the forums search function. Also handy for searching ssm's (just add /ssm to Westeros.org)

I'm happy to keep this open though. Threads are usually locked at the 400 replies mark.

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I'm not locking this since the other was locked already for length, but just as general advice for the future:
When the search function is working again, it would be preferable to use that, rather than ending up with multiple threads on the same topic.
Failing that, at least take a glance on the first 2 or 3 pages of the forum for threads your post is relevant for
If, whilst the search function is not working, you are looking for something on the forum, you can use google search with "site:Westeros.org *key words here*". Sometimes this is actually easier than the forums search function. Also handy for searching ssm's (just add /ssm to Westeros.org)

I'm happy to keep this open though. Threads are usually locked at the 400 replies mark.


Thanks for the clarification.

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The meal descriptions. Everything is dripping or running everywhere. Grease down people's chins, grease running through Weese's boils. Honey dripping off everyone's fingers. Also Ayra repeating all of Serio's wisdom constantly...barefoot surefoot lightfoot. Fear cuts deeper than swords. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush...blah blah blah we get it. 

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I'm not locking this since the other was locked already for length, but just as general advice for the future:
When the search function is working again, it would be preferable to use that, rather than ending up with multiple threads on the same topic.
Failing that, at least take a glance on the first 2 or 3 pages of the forum for threads your post is relevant for
If, whilst the search function is not working, you are looking for something on the forum, you can use google search with "site:Westeros.org *key words here*". Sometimes this is actually easier than the forums search function. Also handy for searching ssm's (just add /ssm to Westeros.org)

I'm happy to keep this open though. Threads are usually locked at the 400 replies mark.

 

Okay, thanks  for the clarification. I will make sure to do this next time :) 

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Too many POV characters. As much as I love some of the added one's (Jaime, Theon, Cersei, etc), I'd have been totally fine with him sticking with just the originals from AGoT. I wonder if the story wouldn't be taking so long to finish if he had. :dunno:

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3) There's always at least 1 story line in each book that feels like filler. Arya in book 1, Jon in book 2, Brienne in feast and Dany in Dance.

 

There are novels full of action and plot and things happening all the time, but there is actually very little conflict in those novels: the hero will do the right thing, the bad guy will do the bad thing and then plot plot plot....

 

Some people like that kind of books, some people only like that kind of books. Most of the best-selling authors write that kind of books, GRRM writes about "the human heart in conflict"!

 

GRRM has said that every POV character has a story: "a beginning, a middle and an end" so if you think that Brienne's chapters in AFfC "feels like filler" I would say you probably are not reading them right. You are looking for the action, the plot! and all you get is the heart in conflict!

 

I was reading reviews of GRRM first novel, Dying of the Light, and those who gave it 1 star were complaining of similar things you mention here: nothing happens, ambiguous ending, slow plot, etc etc. Now that whole novel is about a heart in conflict, so if you don't like that kind of novels you'll hate it and struggle to finish it (like those 1-star reviewers) and think the end is ambiguous when in truth the ending is very clear-cut if you consider the hero's inner journey although as a plot the novel ends just as a death-or-life duel starts so for those reading only the plot will go insane at the ending!

 

The real filler is not the parts where nothing happens, like Brienne's journey through the Crownlands, it is actually all the big battles and plot that happens in-between.

 

In my personal opinion (and my own personal taste) the mix between plot and internal conflict that develops the character is just about right in ASoIaF, some chapters have more of one part than the other but as a whole the portions are well divvied.

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No Robb POV chapters

 

GRRM said about POV characters: They must have a story, a begining, a middle and an end. GRRM also said that he writes about the human heart in conflict. So those two criteria in mind, lets ask: What's Robb's story? What's the conflict in Robb's heart??

 

Robb was brought up to be the lord of Winterfell and when Ned left to King's Landing he became the lord, no conflict, no doubt, no hesitation.

 

Ned gets arrested and Robb without a doubt, without hesitation calls his bannermen and marches south. Lots of action, but no real conflict.

 

Then Robb accept Frey's condition. Did he even hesitate about who is going to be his wife? No, not Robb "no conflict" Stark.

 

He is a natural born leader, no conflict here.

 

Then he rapes deflower bed seduce dishonor does something with the Westerling girl in the night and the next morning Robb "no hesitation" Stark weds her.

 

 

sure Robb has lots of plot and lots of things happen, but can you imagine his POV chapters? they will be all action all the time....if you want to read that kind of books I recommend the Jack Reacher series; by the time Brienne make up her mind about where to go next, good old Jack will eat a dozen waffles, beat six guys, solve three mysteries, bed two women and maybe change his cloths once....

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Jeor Mormont deciding to bring everyone out of their defensive stronghold and have a look-around north of the wall. 

 

Well, he was searching for Benjen. 

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Jeor Mormont deciding to bring everyone out of their defensive stronghold and have a look-around north of the wall. 

 

One of the worst decisions in the series. How is 300 people (a third of the Watch) searching through hundreds of miles of wilderness where they could easily be attacked by the gathering Wildling army or near invincible ice demons a good idea when they have a perfectly good 800 foot ice wall to hide behind?

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