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Daeren Waters

SPOILERS! Catelyn VII & Arya XI?!

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I know this has been discussed before. But, it's my first time reading ASoS. And I haven't seen any of the HBO series. These two chapters are.... I.... what the??!!!

Stunned, shocked there doesn't seem to be a good enough word to describe these two chapters. Whoa!!! Insane. What were the Frey's thinking?

Now I can't stop reading, but at the same time, I can't read anymore right now either. I had to stop & re-read to be certain of what I was reading. It wasn't making sense.

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I know this has been discussed before. But, it's my first time reading ASoS. And I haven't seen any of the HBO series. These two chapters are.... I.... what the??!!!

Stunned, shocked there doesn't seem to be a good enough word to describe these two chapters. Whoa!!! Insane. What were the Frey's thinking?

Now I can't stop reading, but at the same time, I can't read anymore right now either. I had to stop & re-read to be certain of what I was reading. It wasn't making sense.

 

It's foreshadowed. In aCoK Cat sees the Freys leaving RR en masse, Roose Bolton has a discussion with the Freys at HH that he's not a man to be undone when the Freys lament the fact that the war is lost after Stannis was beaten at the Blackwater, the Tyrells joined Tywin and WF was captured by Theon. Roose then goes hunting "wolves", and returns with several pelts including wolf pup pelts (symbolizing Bran & Rickon who allegedly died). He also sent Glover and Tallhart on a "revenge mission" in the Crownlands that makes no tactical sense with Robb fighting in the Westerlands, and later on lies about it to Robb when they meet at the Twins, making it sound as if it was Glover's and Tallhart's plan. In the same Arya chapter she also learns the Freys being mad over being dishonored and that Elmar now won't get to marry his princess (neither of them knowing Arya = his betrothed princess). Early on in aSoS Tywin also talks cryptically about Robb having wed Jeyne Westerling - being his father's son - and Tyrion being puzzled about the fact that Tywin seems pleased instead of angry about a marriage between the enemy and the daughter of one of Tywin's vassal's. Tywin also somehow knows about the Glover and Tallhart's intentions for their attack in the Crownlands and sends Tarly to give them a beating and the Mountain behind them, so the fleeing Glovers and Tallharts get smashed by Gregor as well. Vargo Hoat maims Jaime to cause Tywin to be angry at Roose, and Roose sends Jaime on his way to King's Landing with his regards and wanting the assurance that Jaime makes clear the maiming wasn't his doing. And then finally there is the Ghost of High Heart informing the Brotherhood that Catelyn, Robb and Edmure are going to the Twins for a wedding, as well as her recoiling from Arya because she already had gorged enough on the grief of Summerhal; implying that Arya will end up knowing a similar grief where most of her family will end up dying.

 

Roose planned to betray the Starks since aCoK. He was already in communication with Tywin, sending Glovers and Tallharts to a military trap he sets up together with Tywin. Robb marrying Jeyne Westerling pulled the Freys into the betrayal. And so, Roose, Freys and Tywin set up what's dubbed the Red Wedding.

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From Davos II

When the fool saw Davos, he jerked to a sudden halt, the bells on his antlered tin helmet going ting-a-ling, ting-a-ling. Hopping from one foot to the other, he sang, "Fool's blood, king's bloodblood on the maiden's thigh, but chains for the guests and chains for the bridegroom, aye aye aye."

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On 23. srpna 2015 at 11:06 PM, sweetsunray said:

 

It's foreshadowed. In aCoK Cat sees the Freys leaving RR en masse, Roose Bolton has a discussion with the Freys at HH that he's not a man to be undone when the Freys lament the fact that the war is lost after Stannis was beaten at the Blackwater, the Tyrells joined Tywin and WF was captured by Theon. Roose then goes hunting "wolves", and returns with several pelts including wolf pup pelts (symbolizing Bran & Rickon who allegedly died). He also sent Glover and Tallhart on a "revenge mission" in the Crownlands that makes no tactical sense with Robb fighting in the Westerlands, and later on lies about it to Robb when they meet at the Twins, making it sound as if it was Glover's and Tallhart's plan. In the same Arya chapter she also learns the Freys being mad over being dishonored and that Elmar now won't get to marry his princess (neither of them knowing Arya = his betrothed princess). Early on in aSoS Tywin also talks cryptically about Robb having wed Jeyne Westerling - being his father's son - and Tyrion being puzzled about the fact that Tywin seems pleased instead of angry about a marriage between the enemy and the daughter of one of Tywin's vassal's. Tywin also somehow knows about the Glover and Tallhart's intentions for their attack in the Crownlands and sends Tarly to give them a beating and the Mountain behind them, so the fleeing Glovers and Tallharts get smashed by Gregor as well. Vargo Hoat maims Jaime to cause Tywin to be angry at Roose, and Roose sends Jaime on his way to King's Landing with his regards and wanting the assurance that Jaime makes clear the maiming wasn't his doing. And then finally there is the Ghost of High Heart informing the Brotherhood that Catelyn, Robb and Edmure are going to the Twins for a wedding, as well as her recoiling from Arya because she already had gorged enough on the grief of Summerhal; implying that Arya will end up knowing a similar grief where most of her family will end up dying.

 

Roose planned to betray the Starks since aCoK. He was already in communication with Tywin, sending Glovers and Tallharts to a military trap he sets up together with Tywin. Robb marrying Jeyne Westerling pulled the Freys into the betrayal. And so, Roose, Freys and Tywin set up what's dubbed the Red Wedding.

Yes,its forshadowed numerous times, with Patchface and House of Undying being the biggest helps for me.

OTOH I dont think that Bolton was planning some betray since ACoK! Its true that he was very sceptical after the Blackwater, but I dont think it was written that he was in any contact with Lord Tywin then. Its true I dont really remember when there was a mentioning bout Glover and Tallhart torward Duskendale.

As for the OP the last big hint was when Robb,Catelyn,Greatjon,Edmure?, Roose talked in the chamber right before the wedding (previous Catelyn chapter) where the reader can see that Bolton has wholy different 'opinion' about what happened in Duskendale.He says Robb that he is very sorry, that he lost the troops that he couldnt control it cuz they wanted vengeance, but in previous chapters (Jaime one?) he decribes it with amusement and he admits he sent them there.

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