The Fattest Leech Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 In AFFC, Ser Creighton tells Brienne that he was paid by Varys to find Sansa.***In Brienne 1 we have this:She (Brienne) furrowed her brow. "Love?""Aye, love of gold. Unlike your good Ser Creighton, I did fight upon the Blackwater, but on the losing side. My ransom ruined me. You know who Varys is, I trust? The eunuch has offered a plump bag of gold for this girl you've never heard of. I am not a greedy man. If some oversized wench would help me find this naughty child, I would split the Spider's coin with her."Then the ADWD epilogue we have this:He stood in a pool of shadow by a bookcase, plump, pale-faced, round-shouldered, clutching a crossbow in soft powdered hands. Silk slippers swaddled his feet."Varys?"The eunuch set the crossbow down. "Ser Kevan. Forgive me if you can. I bear you no ill will. This was not done from malice. It was for the realm. For the children."***What children is Varys referring to? The Stark children? Sansa is the only one to be known alive by the majority of characters.Did Varys develop some paternal feeling for Sansa knowing what she went through during her time at King's Landing?Is he trying to seat her to the throne/ruling house? This could mean Sansa is the "prettier" one in Maggy's prophecy. It could also mean Varys could possibly be working his own plan without Ilyrio. This just popped out to me as I sit here needle felting and listening to AFFC in Audible. I have read and re-read, but this line never stuck out to me at it just did listening to it. I did try to do a search for answers to my questions but did not come up with much.Thanx in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcanderson6015 Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 He's probably taking about the children of the realm considering he may be the only one of the major players that actually cares about the realm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junkerjonasson Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 It is possible that Varys intended to have Sansa as a backup if Daenerys would decline to marry Aegon. This is also after Varys goes into hiding so he wouldnt gain anything from finding Sansa and give her up to the Lannisters. I doubt that Varys feels any real affection for Sansa, as he didnt do much to keep her safe in Kings Landing. Varys probably just sees her as the heir to the north. The Tyrells, the Lannisters and Lysa Arryn are all trying to have her married into their family just because she is the heir to Winterfell, so why should Varys be any different?When he is talking to Kevan about the children, I dont think he means any particular kid. He probably means the children of the realm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light a wight tonight Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I think the OP takes people at their word too easily. Varys is a notorious purveyor of half-truths if not outright lies. He's doing what he does "for the realm", but his idea of what the realm is almost certainly means something different than the casual listener would assume.It's Ser Shadrich, not Ser Creighton, who is looking for Sansa, and he's doing it for an expected reward, not for pay. Again, we don't know how much truth there is in his statements. I suspect that he's playing his own game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted November 15, 2015 Author Share Posted November 15, 2015 I think the OP takes people at their word too easily. Varys is a notorious purveyor of half-truths if not outright lies. He's doing what he does "for the realm", but his idea of what the realm is almost certainly means something different than the casual listener would assume.It's Ser Shadrich, not Ser Creighton, who is looking for Sansa, and he's doing it for an expected reward, not for pay. Again, we don't know how much truth there is in his statements. I suspect that he's playing his own game. That is what I am trying to figure out. It seems to me that at some point in conversation someone must be telling it straight and the time to do that (as all movie villains have shown ) is right as they are about to kill someone. The "for the realm" and the "for the children" is just working my brain.You are right about the Shadrich-Creighton mix up. Don't know what I was thinking??? A good example why asking forum questions helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light a wight tonight Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 That is what I am trying to figure out. It seems to me that at some point in conversation someone must be telling it straight and the time to do that (as all movie villains have shown ) is right as they are about to kill someone. The "for the realm" and the "for the children" is just working my brain.You are right about the Shadrich-Creighton mix up. Don't know what I was thinking??? A good example why asking forum questions helps.There have been a few discussions about the conversation with Kevan. There are three points brought out: why would Varys lie to a man he's about to kill, why would he say anything at all to that person, or he was speaking for someone other than Kevan's benefit, either a listener or for the "little birds" to report back to. I don't expect many players in the Game to tell the truth. Maybe the Elder Brother or Septon Meribald. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 The eunuch set the crossbow down. "Ser Kevan. Forgive me if you can. I bear you no ill will. This was not done from malice. It was for the realm. For the children." The realm, whispers of the Night's Watch oath, for the children.....of the forest? Hmmmmm, hard to tell really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Fauntleroy Posted November 17, 2015 Share Posted November 17, 2015 As far as Varys knows Tyrion is on his way to Dany with Aegon. If Varys can obtain Tyrion's current wife, that would be extremely beneficial. Whether they would use her presence to annul the union or strengthen Tyrions (and through him, Aegon's) sway over the North. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odon Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 It's not that puzzling. Queen Cersei wants Sansa's head because she thinks Sansa was involved in the death of her son, so as Master of Whispers it would look strange if Varys didn't put out a large reward for her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AerionBrightflameII Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 He wanted her on hand or at least knowledge of where she was.No idea why he wanted her and anybody who does is on crack.Only a spider knows a spider as they say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fattest Leech Posted November 18, 2015 Author Share Posted November 18, 2015 It's not that puzzling. Queen Cersei wants Sansa's head because she thinks Sansa was involved in the death of her son, so as Master of Whispers it would look strange if Varys didn't put out a large reward for her.In AFFC Varys is missing. When Cersei wakes to find her father had been killed she realizes everyone is there except Varys. Later, while Brienne is on the road looking for Sansa she comes across Ser Shadrich where he tells her Varys will reward him for the return/ location of Sansa. Then in the Winds chapter of Alayne Shadrich shows up at the Winged Knight Tournament. This, to me, is setting up something big for Sansa- probably without her consent and without LF. This and the "for the children" comment from Varys to Kevan has me wondering. Thank you for the input from you guys so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the Scorpion Knight Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 IMho Varys is playing the with LF and he has started the finshing moves. and LF diesn't realise it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odon Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 In AFFC Varys is missing. When Cersei wakes to find her father had been killed she realizes everyone is there except Varys. Later, while Brienne is on the road looking for Sansa she comes across Ser Shadrich where he tells her Varys will reward him for the return/ location of Sansa. Then in the Winds chapter of Alayne Shadrich shows up at the Winged Knight Tournament. This, to me, is setting up something big for Sansa- probably without her consent and without LF. This and the "for the children" comment from Varys to Kevan has me wondering. Thank you for the input from you guys so far. But the reward would have been put out after Joffrey's death, not Tywin's. Shardich has been on the road, and so probably hasn't heard about Varys fleeing KL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endymion I Targaryen Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 He sees Sansa as a second choice for Aegon's wife if the Dany plot fails (which happeneed)Maybe he collects heirs for Westeros's great houses (Aegon,Sansa,Tyrek,Edric/Gendry,Tyrion). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Wraith Posted November 23, 2015 Share Posted November 23, 2015 Aegon needs a queen and Sansa could fit the bill in his mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bemused Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 I can't remember where, offhand , but I thought Cersei ordered Varys to offer a reward ..?But leaving that aside ... Varys certainly knows about the prophecy that Rhaegar was interested in. Whether or not his Aegon is real (I doubt it), he may think that Aegon and Sansa could be held up as fulfilling the roles of Rhaegar and Lyanna...Of course, this could all get very complicated.. Varys was apparently inflaming Aerys' suspicions about Rhaegar.. and he would know if (e,g,) Rhaegar was actually rescuing Lyanna from abduction by Aerys... Like Mel with Stannis' sword, he could have it in mind to fake signs and portents to promote Aegon (whoever he is). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterfreak Posted November 29, 2015 Share Posted November 29, 2015 He just wants as many aces up his sleeve as he can. Sansa is heir to the North and a very valuable asset, so it's no wonder that he wants to find her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batbob45 Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 at least if she was with Varys, he wouldn't be acting as creepy as LF was acting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Suburbs Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Is it odd that Shadrich does not know that Varys is no longer at court? It's still pretty early in Feast, but Tyrion's disappearance is already well-known, but apparently Varys' is not, at least not to Shadrich or Brienne.So that begs the question: is Shad really a random hedge knight looking for a buck, or is he working for someone specific? Perhaps Varys himself? That would be interesting considering he is now in the Vale with Sansa and Littlefinger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odon Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Is it odd that Shadrich does not know that Varys is no longer at court? It's still pretty early in Feast, but Tyrion's disappearance is already well-known, but apparently Varys' is not, at least not to Shadrich or Brienne.So that begs the question: is Shad really a random hedge knight looking for a buck, or is he working for someone specific? Perhaps Varys himself? That would be interesting considering he is now in the Vale with Sansa and Littlefinger.Anything is possible, though Shad does have a plausible reason for ending up there. He would have followed up the Lyssa connection re Sansa, and when it apparently went cold with her aunt's death by jealous singer, the Mad Mouse finds Littlefinger is hiring swords. LF is a generous employer, there's a prospect of action with the tensions in the Vale, and winter is coming so it's a bad time to be a hedge knight -- it would seem like a good deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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