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TimJames

Game of Human Rights Milestones

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The World of Ice and Fire has human rights ideals that can be at best described as "backwards" or "wack-ass". However, there are milestones. 

Now, for an event to qualify, it must be one of the following:

  • An step in the right direction (even if it still needs work, or works in theory but less-so in practice, progress is still progress).
  • A new or rare policy (what seems obvious to us wouldn't seem that way to Westerosi People).
  • A precedence setter (no isolated incidents).

I won't bother dating them with years, but will instead just go by relative dating (A came before B, which came before C, ...).

  1. The culture of The First Men takes shape, forbidding the practices of murdering guests, murdering relatives, committing rape, or practicing incest.
  2. The Night's Watch is Established, giving prisoners a form of life imprisonment as an alternative to The Death Penalty.
  3. The Andals invade Westeros, bringing with them the idea that military officers should obey a code of conduct which forbids the murder or rape of non-combatants.
  4. Andal Septons convert The Sistermen to The Faith of The Seven, causing them to abandon the inhumane practice of drowning deformed babies.
  5. Eventually, both The Andals and The First men begin to desdain slavery as well as thralldom. This aversion becomes so entrenched that it becomes part of both The Faith of The Seven and The Faith of The Old Gods. Eventually, it reached the point that selling another human into slavery became a crime punishable by death.
  6. Rhoynar Refugees settle in Dorne. They bring to that region increased acceptance of homosexuality, lessened discrimination against bastards, and gender-equal inheritance laws. Unfortunatly, these do not spread to the rest of Westeros.
  7. King Harmund III Hoare of The Iron Isles converts to The Faith of The Seven. He makes thralldom, sexual slavery, and piracy all illegal in The Iron Islands. Sadly, the terrorist Shrike would mutilate Harmund III and reverse all of his progressive reforms.
  8. King Ageon I "the Conqueror" Targaryen accepts the surrenders of House Lannister, House Stark, and House Arryn. This is despite the fact that all three houses opposed them in war. He also allows Freedom of Religion in Westeros, dicriminating against none of the three major faiths in Westeros.
  9. Queen Rhaella Targaryen makes it illegal for a man to beat his wife to death, stating that any man who hits his wife more than six times has broken the law.
  10. King Jaehaerys I Targaryen ended the persicution of The Andal Clergy which had been constant under King Maegor "the Cruel". He also required court cases to be in secular (therefore not religiously biased) courts, granted rights to The Smallfolk, and created a unified legal code.
  11. At the same time, his wife Queen Alyssane "the Good" Targaryen ended the barbaric Right of First Night and made practicing it a crime punishable by death.
  12. King Baelor I "the Blessed" Targaryen preformed many acts of philanthrophy, giving food to the hungry and destitute of The Seven Kingdoms. He also banned prostitution in Kings Landing during his reign. This is being counted as a positive act because the vast majority of the prostitutes " take who they can get and do whatever they have to in order to survive, often living miserable lives.". In addition to this, King Baelor also made a goodwill visit to Dorne to help strengthen relations there.
  13. Daeron II "the Good" Targaryen brings Dorne into The Seven Kingdoms via peaceful diplomacy, both ensuring that Dorne can keep it's gender-equal inheritance laws and that nobody has to die in a war in another Dornish War.
  14. Ageon V passed laws to reduce the power of The Nobility as well as to grant freedoms and liberties to The Smallfolk. He even promoted a lowborn peasant named Duncan to Lord Commander of The Kingsguard, named his son after Duncan, and allowed Prince Duncan to marry a peasant girl. 
  15. Lord Paramount Quellon Greyjoy fought against slavers and corsairs, thereby reducing slavery on The High Seas. Later on, he passed progressive reforms which mirror those passed by Harmund III Hoare centuries prior. He outlawed thralldom as well as reaving, and greatly discouraged the sex-slavery known as Salt-Wives. In addition to this, he brought Maesters to The Iron Islands to increase education. Sadly, his son Balon Greyjoy would reverse practically all of his reforms.
  16. King Robert I Baratheon pardoned Jamie for the slaying of King Aerys II Targaryen, allowing him to keep his lands and title. This set the precedence that knights bound by oath did not have to obey orders that they know to be immoral or unethical.
  17. Lord Stannis Baratheon grants a knighthood and a title of nobility to the lowborn smuggler Davos Seaworth, rewarding merit instead of mere birth.
  18. Joffery Baratheon promotes Sandor Clegane to a position of Kingsguard due to exceptional loyalty. He also awards the lowborn Janos Slynt a title of nobility and a landed title as reward for siding with him during a sucession dispute. In doing this, Joffery rewarded merit rather than mere birth.
  19. Renly Baratheon gave Brienne Tarth a place on his Kingsguard, making him the first king to have a woman on his kingsguard.
  20. During The War of Five Kings, The Brotherhood Without Banners gives all of their prisoners fair trials rather then just executing them. They also hold tribunals, charging members of The Brave Companions with (and executing them for) Crimes Against Humanity.
  21. Stannis Baratheon punishes his own soldiers after catching them raping enemy women, making him one of the few military leaders to demand his soldiers show restraint towards enemy POWs and civilians.
  22. Randyll Tarly punishes his own soldiers after catching them raping enemy women, making him one of the few military leaders to demand his soldiers show restraint towards enemy POWs and civilians.
  23. The High Septon arrests both Margaery Tyrell and Cersei Lannister on accusations of treason. This marks the first known instance in which members of The Royal Family were legally held accountable for any crime, thereby marking the first known instance in which royalty was subject to law.
  24. Lord Commander Jon Snow and King Stannis Baratheon allow Wildling Refugees to move south of The Wall and thereby escape certain death. This is despite the fact that said wildlings were enemies just a few months prior.
  25. *will add more*

 

Let me know if you object to any of these, or if you want to add more.

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Rhaella didn't make it illegal for a man to hit his wife, she just make it illegal for a man to kill his wife. If I had hit my wife six times I would be in a jail, experimenting all wonders of human rights…

Also, I doubt they created an actual legal code as the ones you see in countries of civil law tradition. She merely expanded the heavily culture-based law into a whole continent, which is not only impossible but of bad taste. The cultures of Westeros wouldn't follow it. In the end, the lord is still the judge, and executor in some cases, no matter how twisted his views are.

I think that, outside Westeros, Braavos has the closest to your enlightenment/rationalism with views more palpable to us, still a long shot. Remember that GRRM believes that culture and technology is not linear… if human rights ever develop in Westeros, they may be very different from those we know.

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As I said before, progress is still progress.

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Dany making sure that freed men get payed for their work...less income only but it still better than nothing and only getting  beaten by whip....dany makes sure that no children or a slave fight in pit without consent ..

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Aegon V brought in laws to limit the powers of the Noblity and improve the rights of the smallfolk.

Shame Tywin un-did most of this when he was Aerys's Hand.

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The Night Watch was established as a military order, not a prison colony.  It was later that sending criminals wall was used as a punishment.  Didn't slow down or stop executions tho'.

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The Night Watch was established as a military order, not a prison colony.  It was later that sending criminals wall was used as a punishment.  Didn't slow down or stop executions tho'.

There are people on The Wall who would have been executed had The Wall never been there. So it did make a positive impact.

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Human Rights don't exist, just legal ones...

Saying that there are universal human rights is like telling all the dead people ever that life is an "unalienable right", haha

Democracy (even a limited one) is the first big milestone... And I don't think any society in the series has universal sufferage. After that you're really just judging based on your own opinions of right and wrong

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14. King Robert I Baratheon pardoned Jamie for the slaying of King Aerys II Targaryen, allowing him to keep his lands and title. This set the precedence that knights bound by oath did not have to obey orders that they know to be immoral or unethical

This one should be removed.  No such precedent was set.  No-one, including King Robert, was aware of any such motive.  If Jaime had any such motive, he kept it to himself.

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Septons stop pagans on the Sisters from throwing dwarfs into the sea (and presumably prevent other acts of human sacrifice throughout Westeros).

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This one should be removed.  No such precedent was set.  No-one, including King Robert, was aware of any such motive.  If Jaime had any such motive, he kept it to himself.

Agreed, no precedence was set. Robert just needed to keep Tywin happy.

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This one should be removed.  No such precedent was set.  No-one, including King Robert, was aware of any such motive.  If Jaime had any such motive, he kept it to himself.

Whether or not he intended to set such a precedence is irrelevent. He knew Jamie broke his Kingsguard oath, yet decided to let Jamie stay on The Kingsguard because Aerys was an evil murderous king. 

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The concept of human rights can't be boiled down to just mean "good law or ruling".  I don't think there's any hint of any idea of human rights in Westeros.  

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The concept of human rights can't be boiled down to just mean "good law or ruling".  I don't think there's any hint of any idea of human rights in Westeros.  

I disagree.

For example, in westeros slavery is strictly illegal. Jorah had to flee the continent after he was caught selling his fellow man into slavery, because if he didn't then Eddard would probably have executed him. 

Likewise, The Right of First Night is illegal. Roose Bolton had to pay money to silence a peasant woman whom he raped, because if Lord Stark found out he probably would have cut Roose's head off. 

Progress is far behind in Westeros, but it is progress none the less.

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The World of Ice and Fire has human rights ideals that can be at best described as "backwards" or "wack-ass". However, there are milestones. 

Now, for an event to qualify, it must be one of the following:

  • An step in the right direction (even if it still needs work, or works in theory but less-so in practice, progress is still progress).
  • A new or rare policy (what seems obvious to us wouldn't seem that way to Westerosi People).
  • A precedence setter (no isolated incidents).

I won't bother dating them with years, but will instead just go by relative dating (A came before B, which came before C, ...).

  1. The culture of The First Men takes shape, forbidding the practices of murdering guests, murdering relatives, committing rape, or practicing incest.
  2. The Night's Watch is Established, giving prisoners a form of life imprisonment as an alternative to The Death Penalty.
  3. The Andals invade Westeros, bringing with them the idea that military officers should obey a code of conduct which forbids the murder or rape of non-combatants.
  4. Eventually, both The Andals and The First men begin to desdain slavery as well as thralldom. This aversion becomes so entrenched that it becomes part of both The Faith of The Seven and The Faith of The Old Gods.
  5. Rhoynar Refugees settle in Dorne. They bring to that region increased acceptance of homosexuality, lessened discrimination against bastards, and gender-equal inheritance laws. Unfortunatly, these do not spread to the rest of Westeros.
  6. King Harmund III Hoare of The Iron Isles converts to The Faith of The Seven. He makes thralldom, sexual slavery, and piracy all illegal in The Iron Islands. Sadly, the terrorist Shrike would mutilate Harmund III and reverse all of his progressive reforms.
  7. King Ageon I "the Conqueror" Targaryen accepts the surrenders of House Lannister, House Stark, and House Arryn. This is despite the fact that all three houses opposed them in war. He also allows Freedom of Religion in Westeros, dicriminating against none of the three major faiths in Westeros.
  8. Queen Rhaella Targaryen makes it illegal for a man to beat his wife to death, stating that any man who hits his wife more than six times has broken the law.
  9. King Jaehaerys I Targaryen ended the persicution of The Andal Clergy which had been constant under King Maegor "the Cruel". He also required court cases to be in secular (therefore not religiously biased) courts, granted rights to The Smallfolk, and created a unified legal code.
  10. At the same time, his wife Queen Alyssane "the Good" Targaryen ended the barbaric Right of First Night and made practicing it a crime punishable by death.
  11. King Baelor I "the Blessed" Targaryen preformed many acts of philanthrophy, giving food to the hungry and destitute of The Seven Kingdoms. He also banned prostitution in Kings Landing during his reign. This is being counted as a positive act because the vast majority of the prostitutes " take who they can get and do whatever they have to in order to survive, often living miserable lives.". In addition to this, King Baelor also made a goodwill visit to Dorne to help strengthen relations there.
  12. Daeron II "the Good" Targaryen brings Dorne into The Seven Kingdoms via peaceful diplomacy, both ensuring that Dorne can keep it's gender-equal inheritance laws and that nobody has to die in a war in another Dornish War.
  13. Ageon V passed laws to reduce the power of The Nobility as well as to grant freedoms and liberties to The Smallfolk. He even allowed his son Prince Duncan Targaryen to marry a peasant girl.
  14. King Robert I Baratheon pardoned Jamie for the slaying of King Aerys II Targaryen, allowing him to keep his lands and title. This set the precedence that knights bound by oath did not have to obey orders that they know to be immoral or unethical.
  15. Lord Stannis Baratheon grants a knighthood and a title of nobility to the lowborn smuggler Davos Seaworth, rewarding merit instead of mere birth.
  16. During The War of Five Kings, The Brotherhood Without Banners gives all of their prisoners fair trials rather then just executing them. They also hold tribunals, charging members of The Brave Companions with (and executing them for) Crimes Against Humanity.
  17. Stannis Baratheon punishes his own soldiers after catching them raping enemy women, making him one of the few military leaders to demand his soldiers show restraint towards enemy POWs and civilians.
  18. Randyll Tarly punishes his own soldiers after catching them raping enemy women, making him one of the few military leaders to demand his soldiers show restraint towards enemy POWs and civilians.
  19. *will add more*

 

Let me know if you object to any of these, or if you want to add more.

so you won't add dany to the list is that it or u didnt see it ...or you could have said except dany ...then y ask for the progress when its said in the text that it was a progress by the memeber of a slaver family (hizdar points that she had changed amd its a slow process but nevertheless a progressprogress while going to the pit  ) ... And there are characters who punish their army for raping as well dany and randyl tarly ....the whole point of buying unsullied was they won't rape and pillage...

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The World of Ice and Fire has human rights ideals that can be at best described as "backwards" or "wack-ass". However, there are milestones. 

Now, for an event to qualify, it must be one of the following:

  • An step in the right direction (even if it still needs work, or works in theory but less-so in practice, progress is still progress).
  • A new or rare policy (what seems obvious to us wouldn't seem that way to Westerosi People).
  • A precedence setter (no isolated incidents).

I won't bother dating them with years, but will instead just go by relative dating (A came before B, which came before C, ...).

  1. The culture of The First Men takes shape, forbidding the practices of murdering guests, murdering relatives, committing rape, or practicing incest.
  2. The Night's Watch is Established, giving prisoners a form of life imprisonment as an alternative to The Death Penalty.
  3. The Andals invade Westeros, bringing with them the idea that military officers should obey a code of conduct which forbids the murder or rape of non-combatants.
  4. Andal Septons convert The Sistermen to The Faith of The Seven, causing them to abandon the inhumane practice of drowning deformed babies.
  5. Eventually, both The Andals and The First men begin to desdain slavery as well as thralldom. This aversion becomes so entrenched that it becomes part of both The Faith of The Seven and The Faith of The Old Gods. Eventually, it reached the point that selling another human into slavery became a crime punishable by death.
  6. Rhoynar Refugees settle in Dorne. They bring to that region increased acceptance of homosexuality, lessened discrimination against bastards, and gender-equal inheritance laws. Unfortunatly, these do not spread to the rest of Westeros.
  7. King Harmund III Hoare of The Iron Isles converts to The Faith of The Seven. He makes thralldom, sexual slavery, and piracy all illegal in The Iron Islands. Sadly, the terrorist Shrike would mutilate Harmund III and reverse all of his progressive reforms.
  8. King Ageon I "the Conqueror" Targaryen accepts the surrenders of House Lannister, House Stark, and House Arryn. This is despite the fact that all three houses opposed them in war. He also allows Freedom of Religion in Westeros, dicriminating against none of the three major faiths in Westeros.
  9. Queen Rhaella Targaryen makes it illegal for a man to beat his wife to death, stating that any man who hits his wife more than six times has broken the law.
  10. King Jaehaerys I Targaryen ended the persicution of The Andal Clergy which had been constant under King Maegor "the Cruel". He also required court cases to be in secular (therefore not religiously biased) courts, granted rights to The Smallfolk, and created a unified legal code.
  11. At the same time, his wife Queen Alyssane "the Good" Targaryen ended the barbaric Right of First Night and made practicing it a crime punishable by death.
  12. King Baelor I "the Blessed" Targaryen preformed many acts of philanthrophy, giving food to the hungry and destitute of The Seven Kingdoms. He also banned prostitution in Kings Landing during his reign. This is being counted as a positive act because the vast majority of the prostitutes " take who they can get and do whatever they have to in order to survive, often living miserable lives.". In addition to this, King Baelor also made a goodwill visit to Dorne to help strengthen relations there.
  13. Daeron II "the Good" Targaryen brings Dorne into The Seven Kingdoms via peaceful diplomacy, both ensuring that Dorne can keep it's gender-equal inheritance laws and that nobody has to die in a war in another Dornish War.
  14. Ageon V passed laws to reduce the power of The Nobility as well as to grant freedoms and liberties to The Smallfolk. He even allowed his son Prince Duncan Targaryen to marry a peasant girl.
  15. King Robert I Baratheon pardoned Jamie for the slaying of King Aerys II Targaryen, allowing him to keep his lands and title. This set the precedence that knights bound by oath did not have to obey orders that they know to be immoral or unethical.
  16. Lord Stannis Baratheon grants a knighthood and a title of nobility to the lowborn smuggler Davos Seaworth, rewarding merit instead of mere birth.
  17. During The War of Five Kings, The Brotherhood Without Banners gives all of their prisoners fair trials rather then just executing them. They also hold tribunals, charging members of The Brave Companions with (and executing them for) Crimes Against Humanity.
  18. Stannis Baratheon punishes his own soldiers after catching them raping enemy women, making him one of the few military leaders to demand his soldiers show restraint towards enemy POWs and civilians.
  19. Randyll Tarly punishes his own soldiers after catching them raping enemy women, making him one of the few military leaders to demand his soldiers show restraint towards enemy POWs and civilians.
  20. The High Septon arrests both Margaery Tyrell and Cersei Lannister on accusations of treason. This marks the first known instance in which members of The Royal Family were legally held accountable for any crime, thereby marking the first known instance in which royalty was subject to law.
  21. Lord Commander Jon Snow and King Stannis Baratheon allow Wildling Refugees to move south of The Wall and thereby escape certain death. This is despite the fact that said wildlings were enemies just a few months prior.
  22. *will add more*

 

Let me know if you object to any of these, or if you want to add more.

If you praise Stannis for rewarding Davos based on merit, then you would have to praise Joffrey for doing the same with Janos Slynt.

Also, Theon punished rapists within his own men as well, he'd have to be praised too.

Essentially, I think number 16, 18, and 19 are nothing extraordinary.

EDIT: Also, Renly allowing a woman in his Kingsguard is worthy of mention.

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