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Why didn't Barristan leave Joffrey ?

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He said he chose to served Robert and abandoned the family he swore to protect when they needed him the most because according to him Viserys showed signs of madness, keep in mind that Viserys was only about 7 at that point. Even Dany, his casual victim thinks that Viserys was a good brother to her at first, he grew bitter and abusive after he received multiples mockery and rejection over the year so i think it's safe to say that Viserys wasn't mad when he was in KL, it was just Barry's lie to cover his ass to get into Dany's service. Yet he only did so because Joffrey fired him, the semi-psycho entitled brat who opened up a pregnant cat's belly and took the kitten but he has never said a thing about it. Only that Robert was a good knight but he grew to be a bad king, he continued to serve Joff with full knowledge that he's a cruel psycho. Interestingly he defended himself and wanted to be in Joffrey's KG until he understood that there's no chanceWTF ?

I think Barristan is a terrible KG, he's lucky he got a good reputation and great skill because if not then he'd just be a twice turncloak. If he's a knight who refused to serve a bad king why didn't he leave Joffrey ?

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Why do you automatically assume Dany was correct and Barry wrong? As far as I am concerned, Viserys was indeed mad and Dany didn't notice it… after all, her brother was everything she had ever met and her skewed views of the world could have prevented her to see it.

Barry has far more credibility to me than Dany, specially when she was a young girl. Nothing against Dany but Barristan is Barristan.

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Why do you automatically assume Dany was correct and Barry wrong? As far as I am concerned, Viserys was indeed mad and Dany didn't notice it… after all, her brother was everything she had ever met and her skewed views of the world could have prevented her to see it.

 

Barry has far more credibility to me than Dany, specially when she was a young girl. Nothing against Dany but Barristan is Barristan.

Because we have Dany's POV, her inner thoughts when she's thinking to herself. What's the point of lying to herself that Viserys was mad from the start ? Her views might be skewed at AGOT but not in ADWD when she has really changed and met a lot of people. 
Twice turncloak Barry has less credibility to me than Dany regarding Viserys, she saw her brother descending from her nice brother into a weak and cruel man. I think Barry lied, it's odd that he left the Targaryens because the only male was mad (according to him) but he had no problem serving Joffrey,a spoiled cruel kid yet made no attempt to leave

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Because we have Dany's POV, her inner thoughts when she's thinking to herself. What's the point of lying to herself that Viserys was mad from the start ? Her views might be skewed at AGOT but not in ADWD when she has really changed and met a lot of people. 

Twice turncloak Barry has less credibility to me than Dany regarding Viserys, she saw her brother descending from her nice brother into a weak and cruel man. I think Barry lied, it's odd that he left the Targaryens because the only male was mad (according to him) but he had no problem serving Joffrey,a spoiled cruel kid yet made no attempt to leave

So we have different opinions. And she didn't lie, she actually believed Viserys was not mad, even if he was.

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The reason being that the Lord commander of the Kingsguard role is a comfortable role and it comes with a set of perks. It allowed Selmy to mingle among superiors who had to show respect to him. That's why Selmy bent the knee towards the Usuper and against the king he had sworn to serve and that is why he continued to serve Joffrey too only to turn against him when he fired him. There again Westeros is full of hypocrisy. Robert Baratheon saw fit to call a rebellion because he was cuckolded by the crown Prince which is kind of ironic considering that he couldn't keep his pants up throughout most of his life. Plenty of scandal was caused by Lord Walder Frey's habit of marrying kids and yet everyone applauded Arryn's decision of marrying the Tully girl. A king kills a Lord Paramount and his son and end up with a rebellion in his hands. A Lord Paramount kill an innocent queen and butchers her own children and isn't even taken into custody and questioned. Different weights and different measures. 

Joffrey made a horrendous amount of mistakes but he nailed this decision. Selmy was getting old and complacent. The past two hands of the king were allowed to make investigations about the legitimacy of the King's own son and get away with it, one of his own men fought the hand of the king and got away with it too. The king died at his watch. You don't get away with that. 

 

 

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Because we have Dany's POV, her inner thoughts when she's thinking to herself. What's the point of lying to herself that Viserys was mad from the start ? Her views might be skewed at AGOT but not in ADWD when she has really changed and met a lot of people. 
Twice turncloak Barry has less credibility to me than Dany regarding Viserys, she saw her brother descending from her nice brother into a weak and cruel man. I think Barry lied, it's odd that he left the Targaryens because the only male was mad (according to him) but he had no problem serving Joffrey,a spoiled cruel kid yet made no attempt to leave

abused persons charcterisically make excuses for their abusers.  And abusers characteristically mix their abuse with kindness.  It's a strategy to make their victims emotionally dependent and isolated.  Then, they escalate the violence.  It perfectly normal behavior for Dany to think fondly of her abuser.  

As for Joffery he was just a kid when the cat thing happened.  I believe like Robert, Barristan hoped that Joffery could be helped to be an OK kingwith good guidance.  And it very well might have been true.  What he got instead was Cersei as regent encouraging and modeling cruel and ruthless behavior, and Robert modeling (before his death) that a king does whatever he wants. 

Basically Barristan had to choose A) do what he can to try to improve the kingdom from within or B.) support a foreign invasion and civil war, with a king potentially as cruel as Joffery at its head.  He thought A was the better option, especially with Winter Coming.  

Then, he is forced to choose again, to retire into obscurity or to support civil war against Westeros.  He remains undecided until he has been in Danys service for some time as Arstan.  I honestly believe that if Barristan had seen "the taint" in her, he would have either retired, or become a free sword in Essos or Westeros.  

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He had respect for the throne, not necessarily whose ass was in it. Barristan also had personal honor; how would it look to be a Kingsguard who openly rebuffed the king, and who was outright removed from the office "for being too old"? But once he'd been ousted, he realized that what he should've been doing was respecting the ruler, not the title.

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He said he chose to served Robert and abandoned the family he swore to protect when they needed him the most because according to him Viserys showed signs of madness, keep in mind that Viserys was only about 7 at that point. Even Dany, his casual victim thinks that Viserys was a good brother to her at first, he grew bitter and abusive after he received multiples mockery and rejection over the year so i think it's safe to say that Viserys wasn't mad when he was in KL, it was just Barry's lie to cover his ass to get into Dany's service. Yet he only did so because Joffrey fired him, the semi-psycho entitled brat who opened up a pregnant cat's belly and took the kitten but he has never said a thing about it. Only that Robert was a good knight but he grew to be a bad king, he continued to serve Joff with full knowledge that he's a cruel psycho. Interestingly he defended himself and wanted to be in Joffrey's KG until he understood that there's no chanceWTF ?

I think Barristan is a terrible KG, he's lucky he got a good reputation and great skill because if not then he'd just be a twice turncloak. If he's a knight who refused to serve a bad king why didn't he leave Joffrey ?

Isn't KG oath for life?  He became part of KG under Targaryen's, fought for them. Then new king came in power and chose to honor his service as a knight. What's the dispute here? Joining Danny after being kicked out is totally different thing as his oath got disrespected by someone else, so he was free to do whatever he wants.

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He had respect for the throne, not necessarily whose ass was in it. Barristan also had personal honor; how would it look to be a Kingsguard who openly rebuffed the king, and who was outright removed from the office "for being too old"? But once he'd been ousted, he realized that what he should've been doing was respecting the ruler, not the title.

Isn't KG oath for life?  He became part of KG under Targaryen's, fought for them. Then new king came in power and chose to honor his service as a knight. What's the dispute here? Joining Danny after being kicked out is totally different thing as his oath got disrespected by someone else, so he was free to do whatever he wants.

Exactly, it's to death to be exact. If the king die you should at least die trying to defend him, case in point just like Tommen and one of the KG who gave up and surrender him when he was on his way to Rosby. The oath was also to the king's family not just the king on the throne, especially when the new king got the throne by murdering the heir, legalizing murder of another heir and threatening another heir. That was him being turncloak

Can you imagine the Manderlys serving the Boltons without complain after he stabbed Rob's heart, killed Catelyn and tried to hunt another Starks and saying "Well, he's lord of Winterfell now so i serve him. Bye Starks". It doesn't work like that, loyalty is to the family not the title. 

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Barristan wants to be LC of the Kingsguard. So long as he got to be in that position, he served Aerys as he raped his wife and burned hundreds of innocents alive, he served the "usurper" even after the murder of Elia and her children, and he served Joffrey even after he saw that Cersei was pulling a coup against the wishes of Robert's last will. He "suddenly" has an epiphany after being fired that he must serve someone else. Convenient. Renly calls it out, the man needs a king to serve or else who is he? Barristan then gets contacted by Varys with a way out, enters the temporary service of Ilyrio, and sets sail to take part in what is already a well established conspiracy to topple the current dynasty and reestablish the Targs. Notice his lack of caring for the revelation that Varys is in bed with forieng agents and interests, that he has been plotting for years now, Barristan is all about getting back to the gig he wants to do. Hell, the guy cares so little for how to stay in his position that during the Siege of Meereen he contacts the Windblown and agrees to aid them in taking Pentos, Ilyrio's city. So much for "thanks for getting me out of Westeros and helping me get back the gig I want"...

 

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According to Barristan in his POV, the KG is only to protect the king and not the family, unless the king orders it. It is not an issue of being a turncloak when the king is replaced that the KG is to serve the new king. That is part of the job. Just that they should prevent this, does not mean that the oath is broken upon failure. 

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Exactly, it's to death to be exact. If the king die you should at least die trying to defend him, case in point just like Tommen and one of the KG who gave up and surrender him when he was on his way to Rosby. The oath was also to the king's family not just the king on the throne, especially when the new king got the throne by murdering the heir, legalizing murder of another heir and threatening another heir. That was him being turncloak

Can you imagine the Manderlys serving the Boltons without complain after he stabbed Rob's heart, killed Catelyn and tried to hunt another Starks and saying "Well, he's lord of Winterfell now so i serve him. Bye Starks". It doesn't work like that, loyalty is to the family not the title. 

But Barristan fought for Targs didn't he? He tries protecting them. It's one thing to fail in a war and another to disrespect your oath. 

KG protects the king, defends him. Barristan did that, his oath remained, what was he supposed to do? Betray his king because he took an oath to protect a king? That's silly. 

Manderlys lost relatives, they loved Starks, Barristan served the Mad King, not all loving Ned Stark, so why would he have a problem with transition? He did all he could.

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According to Barristan in his POV, the KG is only to protect the king and not the family, unless the king orders it. It is not an issue of being a turncloak when the king is replaced that the KG is to serve the new king. That is part of the job. Just that they should prevent this, does not mean that the oath is broken upon failure. 

Which chapter is that ? It's an elite bodyguard squad for those of royal blood not just the king
The oath is to defend to their death, not to flee to the new king who murdered the previous royal family he sworned to

"a knight of the Kingsguard was supposed to die in defense of the king and royal family"
- ACOK

 

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Flee? He was wounded and captured. You wanted him to kill himself just so we can say he died with the king?

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Flee? He was wounded and captured. You wanted him to kill himself just so we can say he died with the king?

Robert spared his life, he wasn't going to kill him, he could've taken the black. And an oath is an oath no matter how you spin it. Willem Darry wasn't even a KG but he stayed loyal to his death. 

KG protects the king, defends him. Barristan did that, his oath remained, what was he supposed to do? Betray his king because he took an oath to protect a king? That's silly. 

Sorry to say but that's in the oath, his first oath was to the Targaryen yet he served the new king who usurped their throne with a queen whose family butchered the heirs. He could've taken the black but he happily chose to serve Robert and abandoned Viserys to live and die in exile, the one he swore to protect 1st. And Barristan himself doesn't spin it into 'i served the new king' stance btw

“It may be that I must die a traitor’s death,” Ser Barristan said
- ASOS

 

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What happened to Aegon II-s Kingsguard?

(Queensguard was slaughtered to the last when Rhaenyra was apprehended at Dragonstone)

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The reason being that the Lord commander of the Kingsguard role is a comfortable role and it comes with a set of perks. It allowed Selmy to mingle among superiors who had to show respect to him. That's why Selmy bent the knee towards the Usuper and against the king he had sworn to serve and that is why he continued to serve Joffrey too only to turn against him when he fired him. There again Westeros is full of hypocrisy. Robert Baratheon saw fit to call a rebellion because he was cuckolded by the crown Prince which is kind of ironic considering that he couldn't keep his pants up throughout most of his life. Plenty of scandal was caused by Lord Walder Frey's habit of marrying kids and yet everyone applauded Arryn's decision of marrying the Tully girl. A king kills a Lord Paramount and his son and end up with a rebellion in his hands. A Lord Paramount kill an innocent queen and butchers her own children and isn't even taken into custody and questioned. Different weights and different measures. 

Joffrey made a horrendous amount of mistakes but he nailed this decision. Selmy was getting old and complacent. The past two hands of the king were allowed to make investigations about the legitimacy of the King's own son and get away with it, one of his own men fought the hand of the king and got away with it too. The king died at his watch. You don't get away with that. 

 

 

Robert didn't rebel until someone called for his head, and even then it was Jon Arryn who led the way (he had the men after all). 

What happened to Aegon II-s Kingsguard?

(Queensguard was slaughtered to the last when Rhaenyra was apprehended at Dragonstone)

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Kingsguard#Dance_of_the_Dragons_.28129_AC-131_AC.29

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Barristan took an oath to protect the king, not the Targaryen family. After Aerys and Rhaegar were dead, and Robert declared king he had no obligation to serve any Targaryen. There was no Targaryen regime to turn his cloak on. The Targarysn dynasty was broken and the heir in exile. The new king offered Barristan his old job back and he accepted, as did Jaime. 

The statement that he stood aside while Aerys committed various atrocities is equally true for Arthur Dayne, Gerold Hightower, Lewyn Martel, Jaime Lannister and the rest of the KG. 

Saying that he was used up and needed to be replaced is actually funny when you see that Boros Blount and Meryn Trant, were kept. If Sandor had to become a KG Blount should have been sacked, not Barristan. The move was purely political, removing someone who wasn't obligated to the Lannisters, not replacing in ineffectual old man. The fact is that under Robert's negligent rule the KG declined in quality, from either Varys's or the Lannisters' conniving. 

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