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redtree

Who Died First, Jaehara or Alicent ?

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We know that they both died in the same year but not the order. If Jaehara died first i imagine someone would had a great time telling her that her last line had gone, and suspected murdered by her ex-follower. Who do you think died first ?

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For Alicent's sake I hope she died first, but I wouldn't count on it. To be honest though, I don't really feel I have something to base a speculation on.

I also hope Alicent died first. Alicent was an unpleasant person, but she really lost everything. Having to watch all your children and grandchildren die horribly is an awful thing, especially when you bear so much responsibility for it.

If Jaehaera died first, I don't doubt that eager tongues would have borne the tale to Alicent, dwelling on her agonised screaming as she was impaled.

This was a war without winners. I feel very sorry for Aegon III, staring into space for hours on end, and dying of TB. And his line (as a royal line) died out with his sons.

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I believe it was Jaehaera poor girl she was last of Alicent's line a either Aegon's bastards or one-eye Daemon Targaryen (bastard) could not be in line for throne.

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I'm pretty sure that Tyland Lannister and Roland Westerling predeceased Jaehaera because I don't think Unwin Peake was powerful enough to arrange Jaehaera's murder while those two guys was still around (nor would he have gotten away with it thereafter) - and while the winter fever had not yet claimed many other mid-level courtiers and officials in KL, giving Peake the opportunity to put all his people into high office (which was already the case when he murdered the queen).

My gut feeling is that the winter fever was a very infectious plague that claimed many people at court roughly at the same time, making it less likely that Alicent died long before or long after Lannister and Westerling, and therefore my guess is that Alicent predeceased Jaehaera. But that is by far not clear

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I hope it was Jaehaera. I want Hellicent to witness the consequences of her actions, to see how her spawns were affected by her actions and see Rhaenyra's victory at the end.

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Alicent did nothing wrong according to Andal succesion sons go before daughters. And according to the Iron Throne succesion males always go first be they nephew, cousin or uncle.

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11 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

I hope it was Jaehaera. I want Hellicent to witness the consequences of her actions, to see how her spawns were affected by her actions and see Rhaenyra's victory at the end.

What actions? Following the laws of the land?

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3 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

What actions? Following the laws of the land?

When exactly the Targs gave a damn and followed the laws of the land? Also she most likely killed Viserys which is against the laws of the land.

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Just now, Jon's Queen Consort said:

When exactly the Targs gave a damn and followed the laws of the land?

Most did if you look away from the incest.

Viserys the second became king after Baelor so

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1 minute ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Most did if you look away from the incest.

No. The incest is an abomination and illegal so it's not a minor thing also Jaehaerys broke the laws of succession when he passed Rhaenys and named Viserys his heir.

1 minute ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Viserys the second became king after Baelor so

And?

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2 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Alicent did nothing wrong according to Andal succesion sons go before daughters. And according to the Iron Throne succesion males always go first be they nephew, cousin or uncle.

Kings and lords can choose their successors if they want.

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8 minutes ago, Jon's Queen Consort said:

No. The incest is an abomination and illegal so it's not a minor thing also Jaehaerys broke the laws of succession when he passed Rhaenys and named Viserys his heir.

And?

only males can inherit the IT, woman can inherit if they are the last of their House, AKA Daenerys.

During the dance Aegon the elder was the rightful king.

Jaehaerys became king himself by passing his to nieces

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4 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

only males can inherit the IT, woman can inherit if they are the last of their House, AKA Daenerys.

Who said it? Jaehaerys who btw broke the law.

4 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

During the dance Aegon the elder was the rightful king.

That is your opinion. By the law of the land Rhaenys was the rightful Queen, Jaehaerys broke the law by changing the law and chose his heir which is what Viserys did; he chose his most capable heir.

4 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Jaehaerys became king himself by passing his to nieces

We don't know if his nieces were alive when he became the King. Even of they were alive it would mean that someone had broke the law.

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I'm pretty sure that when the King declares his oldest child from his first wife his heir and has literally every lord in the realm swear fealty to that person, that it is pretty clear who the heir is.  

If you need more convincing, just look to Aegons own words, they were something along the line of "Rhaenyra is Queen, it is a poor brother who steals his sisters crown"

Had Cole not been such a deuchbag, and the Hightowers so power hungry, the realm would've remained at peace.

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41 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

Alicent did nothing wrong according to Andal succesion sons go before daughters. And according to the Iron Throne succesion males always go first be they nephew, cousin or uncle.

Well the New Gods or GRRM will disagree that she did nothing wrong. She lived to see all her children and grandchildren die and to see the woman's son/bloodline she hated sit on the throne because of her actions. 

That greedy beast absolutely did something wrong when she went after the throne and she paid for it, ~Kanye shrug~ she deserved it. 

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21 minutes ago, The Wolves said:

Well the New Gods or GRRM will disagree that she did nothing wrong. She lived to see all her children and grandchildren die and to see the woman's son/bloodline she hated sit on the throne because of her actions. 

That greedy beast absolutely did something wrong when she went after the throne and she paid for it, ~Kanye shrug~ she deserved it. 

The Hightowers did have role in moving towars the war by.

- First convincing Viserys 1 to name Rhaenyra heir after Daemon swiped Alicents V-card

- Convincing Viserys 1 not to let Rhaneyra marry Daemon when Daemon asked, at the time Daemon was Viserys's heir

Rhaneyra should have married Aegon the Second to avoid this war, but Aegon was the true king.

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11 minutes ago, norwaywolf123 said:

- Convincing Viserys 1 not to let Rhaneyra marry Daemon when Daemon asked, at the time Daemon was Viserys's heir

Rhaneyra should have married Aegon the Second to avoid this war, but Aegon was the true king.

When Daemon asked that he was still married to Rhea Royce, and that was after Rhaenyra was named heir. They had left the poligamy thing for at least 80+ years. I'm not sure that Otto had a hand about the Daemon poligamy-to-be stuff, was he even in KL ? He was fired after bothering Viserys too many times about switching his heir to Aegon. Viserys repeated refused him but Otto was too deaf and thought too highly of Alicent's grip on Viserys

Also that true king apparently didn't even want to be king at first and seemed shocked when Alicent said to him that he should be king, only under false threat that Rhaenyra would kill him and his children that he finally made a move. 

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58 minutes ago, aryagonnakill#2 said:

If you need more convincing, just look to Aegons own words, they were something along the line of "Rhaenyra is Queen, it is a poor brother who steals his sisters crown"

 

18 minutes ago, redtree said:

Also that true king apparently didn't even want to be king at first and seemed shocked when Alicent said to him that he should be king, only under false threat that Rhaenyra would kill him and his children that he finally made a move. 

While I agree that Rhaenyra was Viserys' rightful heir, I don't think we can trust the passage about Aegon's reaction, as Ran indicated here.

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