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2016 NFL Wildcard cont: Their Bones Will Turn To ICE!


Jace, Extat

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Not as bad as the Harden trade, but still pretty terrible.

I wish trades were more common in the NFL though, and not just draft pick swaps or teams giving up on a player and trading them for a 5th rounder or worse. I want to see straight up player trades more. I get why it doesn't happen much in the regular season, too difficult to pickup the playbook and you could never trade to someone you'll be playing later in the season, but I wish there were more offseason trades.

I think that unlike in basketball, there is an actual cost of trading a player.  When a player is drafted, he learns that system and that teams way of doing things.  There's a good chance that is the system that teaches him to succeed in the NFL.  When he switches teams, it is not a 50/50 chance that he will be more or less productive than before.  It seems like most players are worse the more times they change teams.  Just look at the top 5 "prized" free agents every year.  Those are guys who are already productive, seemingly without red flags, and young enough to still have their prime years ahead of them.  But so often even these cream of the crop free agents are complete busts on a new team.  For every successful "Jared Allen to the Vikings" it seems like there are three cases of Nnamdi Asomogha or Jarius Byrd or Demarco Murray.

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He's right, I mean how do you screw up with THAT many picks? It is astounding

That's what terrible interventionist ownership does! It destroys even the best things. Hell the Cowboys only built their dynasty due to Jimmy Johnson successfully keeping Jerry Jones out. The second Johnson was gone and Jerr-ah took over, it all started to crumble.

I wish trades were more common in the NFL though, and not just draft pick swaps or teams giving up on a player and trading them for a 5th rounder or worse. I want to see straight up player trades more. I get why it doesn't happen much in the regular season, too difficult to pickup the playbook and you could never trade to someone you'll be playing later in the season, but I wish there were more offseason trades.

The one trade I think really should have been done mid-season this year was the Patriots acquiring Danny Woodhead from the Chargers. They still haven't filled the void from the loss of Dion Lewis. Woodhead not only knows the system but he's great at what he does. Feel like a great pass-catching back could be the difference in a title this year for the Patriots. And the Chargers weren't going anywhere - why not get some draft picks out of him? 

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I think that unlike in basketball, there is an actual cost of trading a player.  When a player is drafted, he learns that system and that teams way of doing things.  There's a good chance that is the system that teaches him to succeed in the NFL.  When he switches teams, it is not a 50/50 chance that he will be more or less productive than before.  It seems like most players are worse the more times they change teams.  Just look at the top 5 "prized" free agents every year.  Those are guys who are already productive, seemingly without red flags, and young enough to still have their prime years ahead of them.  So often even these cream of the crop free agents are complete busts on a new team.  For every successful "Jared Allen to the Vikings" it seems like there are three cases of Nnamdi Asomogha or Jarius Byrd or Demarco Murray.

True. I've likely become biased because of how well the Brandon Marshall and Ryan Fitzpatrick trades worked out for the Jets. But I wonder if NFL team systems need to be as complicated as they are. There certainly used to be a time when trades were more common, when coaching positions didn't require 70+ hour work weeks during the season, and players' offseasons really were offseason and didn't require anything more than staying in shape. I suppose that's a larger question though.

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People seem to forget, you have to scout and draft well. If the Browns, Raiders, (name a team here) made the Herschal Walker trade they would have screwed it up and picked all the wrong players. Dallas had the right people in place to pick the right players.

Also, do not forget, Dallas drafted Micheal Irvin, Ken Norton and Chad Hennings in 1988, Troy Aikman, Steve Wisnewski, Mark Stepnoski in 1989, and Emmitt Smith in 1990.  All of these key players were drafted before the trade or not with the trade picks.

As a Cowboys fan I get irritated when people say that without that trade Dallas wouldn't have won anything. Clearly looking at the talent they were drafting before it, they were absolutely on the right path.

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You don't need to suppose whether a huge stockpile of draft picks will allow a terrible team to become good.  We already have two examples of terrible teams failing in spite of a bevy of draft riches:  the 00 Redskins with the Ricky Williams trade and the current Rams with the RG3 picks.

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You don't need to suppose whether a huge stockpile of draft picks will allow a terrible team to become good.  We already have two examples of terrible teams failing in spite of a bevy of draft riches:  the 00 Redskins with the Ricky Williams trade and the current Rams with the RG3 picks.

The Browns qualify, I think. They had like 6 first rounders in 4 years.

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You don't need to suppose whether a huge stockpile of draft picks will allow a terrible team to become good.  We already have two examples of terrible teams failing in spite of a bevy of draft riches:  the 00 Redskins with the Ricky Williams trade and the current Rams with the RG3 picks.

And the Skins are proof that even getting great players out of the haul aren't necessarily enough. Casserly picked the right guys: 3 stars, one of whom is an obvious HoFer, but it means nothing if you spend the next 5 years getting rid of all your draft picks. 

The Rams OTOH got some solid players, but no-one spectacular. I mean quality depth is important and there's 4 starters here but it's kinda crazy that not a single one of these guys has made even a single Pro Bowl yet. 

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The Jets had four (!!!) first rounders in 2000 and actually did reasonably well in the draft. Shaun Ellis and John Abrahams were really good players, Chad Pennington was a fine QB, and Anthony Becht was okay though certainly not worth a 1st round pick. The Jets also drafted Laverenus Cole in the 3rd round, who had a decent career; although often not with the Jets.

The first rounders actually did improve the team a fair bit (and were starters on the team for 11, 6, 8, and 5 years, respectively) but hardly made the team a dynasty. And that's not because of what was going on in New England already. In 2002 the Jets actually won the division but were still only 9-7 (although they did destroy the Colts 41-0 in the wild card round).

It takes more than just good drafting to become a top team, coaching really is vital.

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Also, do not forget, Dallas drafted Micheal Irvin, Ken Norton and Chad Hennings in 1988, Troy Aikman, Steve Wisnewski, Mark Stepnoski in 1989, and Emmitt Smith in 1990.  All of these key players were drafted before the trade or not with the trade picks.

Eh? Your larger point is valid, but Emmitt Smith definitely came from a Herschel Walker pick. According to Wiki anyway, they got the 21st pick in 1990, which they packaged with a third-rounder to move up to 17 and take Smith.

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The one trade I think really should have been done mid-season this year was the Patriots acquiring Danny Woodhead from the Chargers. They still haven't filled the void from the loss of Dion Lewis. Woodhead not only knows the system but he's great at what he does. Feel like a great pass-catching back could be the difference in a title this year for the Patriots. And the Chargers weren't going anywhere - why not get some draft picks out of him? 

At the home opener against the Steelers, my buddy and I had a discussion - specifically regarding the loss of RB Shane Vareen who -its easily forgotten- had caught 11 balls in the Superbowl.  I was saying how the lack of a "go-to," safety-valve RB who can play receiver was troubling.

My buddy then said that he had felt the same way when the Pats moved away from Danny Woodhead in favor of Vareen... 

I then said that I had felt the same way when Kevin Faulk retired in favor of Danny Woodhead... 

And that we both were surprised by the rise of Faulk after the Pats got rid of their prior third down back, J.R. Redmond. 

About that point we realized something- maybe its not the guy catching the ball ... but more the one throwing it.

 

James White starts Saturday Afternoon.  

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At the home opener against the Steelers, my buddy and I had a discussion - specifically regarding the loss of RB Shane Vareen who -its easily forgotten- had caught 11 balls in the Superbowl.  I was saying how the lack of a "go-to," safety-valve RB who can play receiver was troubling.

My buddy then said that he had felt the same way when the Pats moved away from Danny Woodhead in favor of Vareen... 

I then said that I had felt the same way when Kevin Faulk retired in favor of Danny Woodhead... 

And that we both were surprised by the rise of Faulk after the Pats got rid of their prior third down back, J.R. Redmond. 

About that point we realized something- maybe its not the guy catching the ball ... but more the one throwing it.

 

James White starts Saturday Afternoon.  

Don't think this is true at all.  Great QBs don't look great when they have no help. Brady's team is 4-4 over the last half of the season when guys started going down.

Belichick just doesn't overpay these guys when they reach free agency.

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You people pick the game winners straight up? Where's the fun in that? Picks should be against the spread.

I do a pick five every year (pick five games each week against spread. Weekly payouts for going 5-0 and payouts for ripe 3 season records.) My six year old really got into football this year. He's a Jets fan. Despite all my best efforts to pour Black and Gold into his veins I ran into the first instance of children following peer group friends over parental influence. Depressing on several levels. Well he got into doing the pick five with me each week, which was a ton of fun bonding. (I choose to ignore the moral implications of teaching a six year old about gambling.)

Chiefs +5 - I think this is a very fair line but feel like Smith keeps them in the game until the end when Pats win on a last second FG. Honestly could see Pats blowing this game wide open, but they haven't been decimating good teams down the stretch.

Cardinals -7 - This is the no brainer of the week. The public is fixated on the Seattle blowout of the Cards and Aaron Rodgers playing on good game last week. Cards are dominant and balanced compared to GB who will not be able to run the ball. Look for Fitz to to have a huge game, showing the world he still has it and wants to go out on top.

Panthers -2.5 - Again a bad line. Should be more than a FG so jump on it now. Seahawk Magic ends this week when they cannot keep Cam in the pocket. Look for Wilson to throw a pick six trying to make a comeback in the second half.

Steelers +6.5 - this is a bit of going with my heart over head. But I think the beat up Steelers have enough in them to stay close with the Broncos. This line will fluctuate towards game time. Look for it to drop to +4 or go to +7 based on injury news at skill positions.

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Eh? Your larger point is valid, but Emmitt Smith definitely came from a Herschel Walker pick. According to Wiki anyway, they got the 21st pick in 1990, which they packaged with a third-rounder to move up to 17 and take Smith.

Which goes to the talent evaluation. They clearly saw his talent, packaged a pick to move up and draft someone that 16 other teams passed up.

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