Question about "dragon has three heads"

[purple-eyes]

10 minutes ago, Dorian Martell said:

You are very confused. We do not know that the prince prophecy is the same as AA. Nothing in the prince prophecy mentions a flaming sword, killing the prince's wife, or the prince being a swordsmith. Rhaegar insisted the dragon has three heads because that is what the theory is.  He discussed it with Aemon at the wall often. Aemon mentions their correspondence, he also mentions the AA prophecy and in no way connects it to the Prince that was Promised prophecy. They are different. The only connections happen in the minds of readers. Read more carefully, pay attention to details and leave assumptions with no text evidence in the toilet where they belong 

I am not confused. App confirmed AA will be reborn as the promised prince. So they are the one person  in current story. 

And we do not know if this prince still needs to kill his wife or not. 

[RobOsevens]

9 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Check my edit above...

haha we may be on to something!

[Dorian Martell]

2 minutes ago, purple-eyes said:

I am not confused. App confirmed AA will be reborn as the promised prince. So they are the one person  in current story. 

And we do not know if this prince still needs to kill his wife or not. 

Interesting. There is nothing in the actual books that connect the two prophecies. 

[RobOsevens]

Just now, Dorian Martell said:

Interesting. There is nothing in the actual books that connect the two prophecies. 

other than they both seem to do with saving the world, which I think is why many of us tie the two together

[Lost Melnibonean]

15 minutes ago, Dorian Martell said:

Interesting. There is nothing in the actual books that connect the two prophecies. 

There is nothing conclusive, true, but the interchangeable use of the terms by Aemon and Melisandre suggest they are interpretations of the same prophecy.

[Dorian Martell]

32 minutes ago, RobOsevens said:

other than they both seem to do with saving the world, which I think is why many of us tie the two together

So, both prophecies are bastardizations of the story of the Last Hero 

[RobOsevens]

1 minute ago, Dorian Martell said:

So, both prophecies are bastardizations of the story of the Last Hero 

really I guess any of the three could be a bastardization of the other, more likely they are different cultures (North = Last hero, AA= Essos and PtwP = Targ?) retelling of the same story / prophecy

[purple-eyes]

It is safe to say there is only one savior and different cultures had different versions. 

I remebered roynar people said a hero will gather people to sing a song and defeat long night. 

I am sure that song is song of ice and fire. 

[HallowedMarcus]

I believe the three heads are Daenerys Targaryen, Aegon Targaryen (Young Griff) and Jon Dragon (Jon Snow).

[Drogonthedread]

11 hours ago, RobOsevens said:

Thanks Lost,

I haven't done much research on it so there may be a few holes in it but I find it ties most of the prophecies together

thats exactly what i was saying for a long time

promised prince is actually a Dragon

and three prophecies which speak about Promised prince AAR ,TPTWP,TSWMTW is actually a Dragon that will fulfill these prophecies

and that inturn will become a part of the dragons  head and hence the mentions of Dragon must have three heads

A true targaryen and dragon based on the birth and parentage is Daenerys targaryen Last of the dragon ..

i hope you like this one

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/137300-the-dragon-did-wake-from-stone-and-she-has-three-heads-and-her-name-is-daenerys-targaryen/

[Drogonthedread]

11 hours ago, Dorian Martell said:

Interesting. There is nothing in the actual books that connect the two prophecies. 

if only you ignore Melisandre calling Stannis as TPTWP couple of times in ASOS

and Aemon using TPTWP interchangeably when speaking to MeL about AAR and LOng NIGHT and war of Dawn

or when he uses Salt and smoke and bleeding star when speaking about TPTWP to sam ..all three salt and smoke and bleeding star all present in the contents of AAR prophecy as well

[Dorian Martell]

22 minutes ago, Drogonthedread said:

if only you ignore Melisandre calling Stannis as TPTWP couple of times in ASOS

and Aemon using TPTWP interchangeably when speaking to MeL about AAR and LOng NIGHT and war of Dawn

or when he uses Salt and smoke and bleeding star when speaking about TPTWP to sam ..all three salt and smoke and bleeding star all present in the contents of AAR prophecy as well

Where in storm did Mel refer to Stannis as TPTWP? 
Where did Aemon ever conflate TPTWP with AA?

[Nozlym]

hey dorian martell, on the newest episode of radio westeros they talk about this topic. in which aemon does combine the 2 prophecies

[Drogonthedread]

2 minutes ago, Dorian Martell said:

Where in storm did Mel refer to Stannis as TPTWP? 
Where did Aemon ever conflate TPTWP with AA?

You can see in my other thread that I linked in the above post....i have provided the quotes Mel calling stannis TpTWP while in dragonstone at the early stage of ASOS 

And later on storm aemon asks mel " you speak about war of dawn ,my lady.but where is the TPTWp " and Mel answers he stands right before you stannis is AAr ..

And Aemon asks about lightbringer giving heat to Sam ..

And in feast we learn that TPTWP must be born amidst salt and smoke and bring dragons back and bleeding star ..all those are attributed to AAR ..

You can check my other thread for those quotes because now iam in my mobile can't quote ..

[Dorian Martell]

9 minutes ago, Drogonthedread said:

You can see in my other thread that I linked in the above post....i have provided the quotes Mel calling stannis TpTWP while in dragonstone at the early stage of ASOS 

And later on storm aemon asks mel " you speak about war of dawn ,my lady.but where is the TPTWp " and Mel answers he stands right before you stannis is AAr ..

And Aemon asks about lightbringer giving heat to Sam ..

And in feast we learn that TPTWP must be born amidst salt and smoke and bring dragons back and bleeding star ..all those are attributed to AAR ..

You can check my other thread for those quotes because now iam in my mobile can't quote ..

I checked it out. By your quotes, only Mel conflates the two. Aemon only talks about the prince/ss.  the only real similarities seem to be the comet. In older times, comets were always seen as portents so I would throw that one out. Mel could be merging the two for political reasons. When the next book is announced I will do a reread of the series and I will look for this.

[Drogonthedread]

4 minutes ago, Dorian Martell said:

I checked it out. By your quotes, only Mel conflates the two. Aemon only talks about the prince/ss.  the only real similarities seem to be the comet. In older times, comets were always seen as portents so I would throw that one out. Mel could be merging the two for political reasons. When the next book is announced I will do a reread of the series and I will look for this.

 

 

There is also born amidst salt and smoke ..

There is alos born amidst salt and smoke ..

I believe we will get answers in the next book too not only AAR and TPWTWP but TSWMTW will also be connected to one other and revealed as one ...looking forward to marwyn ...

If anything the show which has not done prophecies so far seem to use the term" the one who was promised " coming season which i believe is clear indication that they three are one and same 

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

I think we can pretty conclusively say that TPTWP and AAR are the same prophesy.  I mean there is that YouTube clip of GRRM saying as much for a start. 

 

[Amris]

18 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

[snip]

"What fools we were, who thought ourselves so wise! The error crept in from the translation. Dragons are neither male nor female, Barth saw the truth of that, but now one and now the other, as changeable as flame. The language misled us all for a thousand years."

"Dragons," not "princes"...

Does that mean that the Valyrian word for 'prince/princess' is the same as the word for 'dragon'?

It seems so.

If that's the case then it is possible that Rhaegar and Aemon were mistaken when they were looking for a human as 'Prince that was Promised' and that Drogon, Rhaegal and Viserion are the fulfillment of the prophecy.

 

[RobOsevens]

8 hours ago, Drogonthedread said:

thats exactly what i was saying for a long time

promised prince is actually a Dragon

and three prophecies which speak about Promised prince AAR ,TPTWP,TSWMTW is actually a Dragon that will fulfill these prophecies

and that inturn will become a part of the dragons  head and hence the mentions of Dragon must have three heads

A true targaryen and dragon based on the birth and parentage is Daenerys targaryen Last of the dragon ..

i hope you like this one

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/137300-the-dragon-did-wake-from-stone-and-she-has-three-heads-and-her-name-is-daenerys-targaryen/

Great job Drogonthedread! This is basically where I was going with this, I had never formulated my own theory with evidence but this is essentially where I was going 

[Lost Melnibonean]

8 hours ago, Drogonthedread said:

thats exactly what i was saying for a long time

promised prince is actually a Dragon

and three prophecies which speak about Promised prince AAR ,TPTWP,TSWMTW is actually a Dragon that will fulfill these prophecies

and that inturn will become a part of the dragons  head and hence the mentions of Dragon must have three heads

A true targaryen and dragon based on the birth and parentage is Daenerys targaryen Last of the dragon ..

i hope you like this one

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/137300-the-dragon-did-wake-from-stone-and-she-has-three-heads-and-her-name-is-daenerys-targaryen/

Well, assuming Jon Snow is the Trueborn son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark, he could be this "dragon," and since his is the song of ice and fire, he would seem to be the principal protagonist, with Daenerys set up by Daenerys to be the red herring. At least she'll be able to add a little lemon juice, but that might not be such a good thing...

The George apparently forgot to change her dialect several chapters later, but I dont think he forgot to remove the lemon tree. I think he transplanted it. The George obviously had a reason for putting that lemon tree outside Daenerys's window, since he left it there after he moved her backstory to Braavos.

But what was the purpose of the lemon tree? Well, Im glad you asked . . . You see, the lemon, of course, is defined by its yellow color and sour taste. In addition to its use as food and drink, lemons can be used to clean. After a brief review of the use of lemons in art and literature, my understanding is that the lemon symbolizes bitterness and disappointment.(Exhibit A would be the Lemon Tree, the Israeli film from 2008, in which a Palestinian attempts to stop her neighbor, who happens to be the Israeli Defense Minister, from destroying the family's lemon grove.

In the end, the protagonist's efforts fail, and the trees are cut down.

The lemon is also used to symbolize power. The fruit appears to have originated in South Asia. Although they were known in Ancient Rome, they were not widely known in Europe until the tenth century. The first significant cultivation of lemons in Europe did not happen until the very end of the Middle Ages. Since they had to be imported to medieval Europe, lemons became associated with wealth and power. This symbolism of wealth and power seems to have been The George's intention when he had

Petyr serve the giant lemon cake in Alayne, Winds.

Fans of Sansa who think her weakness for lemon cakes is a symbol of her innocence and purity should take note and be wary. They might be comforted at least to note that within the Church, the lemon is considered a symbol of fidelity. But I believe The George included the lemon tree to foreshadow Daenerys's ultimate bitterness and disappointment. 

When we see lemons, things don't usually end well... In Sansa I, Game 15, she was looking forward to lemon cakes in the queen's wheelhouse, but her day ended with her prince's loathing and contempt. Samwell's early childhood went from snitching lemon cakes to contempt, abuse, and banishment by his father. In Sansa II, Game 29, Sansa went from enjoying lemon cakes with Joffrey at the feast following the first day of jousting to being escorted back to her cell by the Hound. In Sansa III, Game 44, Sansa and Jeyne (poor Jeyne) looked for lemon cakes in the kitchen, but at the end of the chapter learned her father was sending back to Winterfell. Sansa shared lemon cakes with the Tyrells before being forced to wed the imp. Before donning the ugly little girl's face, the kindly man gave a girl a drink so tart it was like biting into lemon. That made "no one" think of Arya's sister, and Sansa's fondness for lemon cakes.

In Arya V, Game 65, Arya offered to trade a fat pigeon for a lemon, but ened up at her father's execution. Jeor Mormont drank lemon in his beer every day. He still had his own teeth but his men mutinied and murdered him. At Bitterbridge, Renly's bannermen feasted on lemon cakes. Of course, Renly's campaign ened shortly thereafter. As Davos sailed with Stannis's fleet into Blackwater Bay, he observed Aegon's High Hill, dark against a lemon sky. That's an odd description for a sky, no? As Davos turned downstream, the mouth of the Blackwater Rush had turned into the mouth of hell.

At Edmure's wedding feast Catelyn noted that Ryman Frey had bathed in lemon water but failed to mask his sour sweat, and that Roose smelled sweeter but no more pleasant. The Feast did not end on a happy note. At Joffrey's wedding feast Tyrion had a slice of pigeon pie covered with a spoon of lemon cream. A few paragraphs later he stood accused of regicide. Cersei drank lemon water so tart she had to spit it out the morning she learned that Tyrion had murdered their father.

Lem Lemoncloak just reeks of bitterness and disappointment, and I am glad I'm not associated with House Dalt of Lemonwood. Doran's Water Gardens smell of lemons and blood oranges. Anybody think Dorne is going end up happy with their blood and fire? In The Queenmaker, Arianne noticed that Darkstar preferred lemon water to summer wine, and she served lemonsweet to Myrcella before Darkstar cut off Myrcella's ear amidst lemon orchards watered by a spider's web of old canals.

Stannis enjoys boiled eggs and lemon water for breakfast, and, well, I think we all know his end will be bitter and disappointing. In Jon IV, Dance 17, Stannis offers lemon water to Jon. Wisely, Jon refuses. Stannis drinks more.

The merry band aboard the Shy Maid enjoy a pike with lemon juice, but come on, who doesn't eat Pike without lemon, and Ysilla was from Dorne. Still, I woulda passed. Tyrion suspected Yezzan was drinking lemon water as the yellow whale bid on him and Penny. Tyrion served Nurse lemonsweet with the mushrooms from Illyrio's garden.The Green Grace accepted a goblet of sweetened lemon juice from the Queen's Hand. 

Oh, and dig this... Daenerys's terrace in Mereen had lemon trees... Go figure.