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Lost Melnibonean

Jojen Paste

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6 hours ago, aryagonnakill#2 said:

Just for the record, its not WW's outside the cave, only wights.  Not all that many either since Summers pack are capable of taking them down 1 at a time and eating them.  It's perfectly conceivable that with a few torches people could escape/ kill them all.

And there is also a backdoor. It seems this will be used if it was mentioned (and kind of an odd, generic term to use). Maybe Meera will make a break for it and will forever be known as Backdoor Meera?

A Dance with Dragons - Bran II

"Is this the only way in?" asked Meera.
"The back door is three leagues north, down a sinkhole." (Coldhands)
That was all he had to say. Not even Hodor could climb down into a sinkhole with Bran heavy on his back, and Jojen could no more walk three leagues than run a thousand.

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17 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I love Jojen paste. I plan on making and serving it for my next pre-divorce ceremony. The sickles and wood boles/bowls and sadness are all great forshadowing. Bran was one of the best POV's in Dance. I love the Three-Eyed Crow as well and the old sinister sorcerer he is. That pile of mulch is up to no good and I can't wait... even though I have to :crying:

Just a thought about just how much blood is needed or how that process goes back in the cave-kitchen. There is a chapter in Dance-Bran 3 that mentions other CotF that are hooked up to the roots... and I don't think they are other greenseers... are they? We have TTEC/Bloodraven and now Bran that are supposed to be the last greenseers. So what are the CotF doing hooked up and dead-like while one of them tries to speak to Bran?

P.S. Whatever the show shows does not mean anything, really. They play their own game of Plotzee with every character. However, part of that game of Plotzee could be that they wanted to rid themselves of the younger Reeds quickly (to make room for more Missandai/Grey Worm kissy time) so they killed Jojen with power skeletons and fireballs and maybe, maybe, they will have Meera be the paste in this coming season????

I am all in favor of more kissy time with fully grown show Missandei! 

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1 minute ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

I am all in favor of more kissy time with fully grown show Missandei! 

GRRRR:angry: Everytime those asinine scenes grace my box I will curse your name! I ain't got time for that. There are direwolves and ice dragons to be seen. ;)

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56 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I love Jojen paste. I plan on making and serving it for my next pre-divorce ceremony. The sickles and wood boles/bowls and sadness are all great forshadowing. Bran was one of the best POV's in Dance. I love the Three-Eyed Crow as well and the old sinister sorcerer he is. That pile of mulch is up to no good and I can't wait... even though I have to :crying:

Just a thought about just how much blood is needed or how that process goes back in the cave-kitchen. There is a chapter in Dance-Bran 3 that mentions other CotF that are hooked up to the roots... and I don't think they are other greenseers... are they? We have TTEC/Bloodraven and now Bran that are supposed to be the last greenseers. So what are the CotF doing hooked up and dead-like while one of them tries to speak to Bran?

P.S. Whatever the show shows does not mean anything, really. They play their own game of Plotzee with every character. However, part of that game of Plotzee could be that they wanted to rid themselves of the younger Reeds quickly (to make room for more Missandai/Grey Worm kissy time) so they killed Jojen with power skeletons and fireballs and maybe, maybe, they will have Meera be the paste in this coming season????

I really wonder about the process, too. I'm not totally convinced about Jojenpaste, but recently I've been thinking along the lines that we never see or hear about CotF using blood sacrifice to weirwoods; that seems to be a human addition to the Old Gods worship. So maybe regular greenseers don't need to consume blood to bond with the trees but humans do. In that case, who was Bloodraven's paste? I wonder.

 

Lol at "Plotzee." That's a very good term for it. I tend to think that Jojen got a clean death because the show likes to paint characters more black-and-white than the books. A lot of Tyrion's dark deeds get skipped, and so far we've only seen Bran in a positive light. He only wargs Hodor for dire and immediate good reasons. I think we'll likely skip the warging of Hodor for fun as well as the blood-paste bit. So Bran can continue to be a fairly uncomplicated hero in the eyes of the audience.

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52 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

And there is also a backdoor. It seems this will be used if it was mentioned (and kind of an odd, generic term to use). Maybe Meera will make a break for it and will forever be known as Backdoor Meera?

A Dance with Dragons - Bran II

"Is this the only way in?" asked Meera.
"The back door is three leagues north, down a sinkhole." (Coldhands)
That was all he had to say. Not even Hodor could climb down into a sinkhole with Bran heavy on his back, and Jojen could no more walk three leagues than run a thousand.

Oooh, yeah....but what if it was just Meera and BranDor??? Totally workable then...

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2 minutes ago, Blind Beth the Cat Lady said:

I really wonder about the process, too. I'm not totally convinced about Jojenpaste, but recently I've been thinking along the lines that we never see or hear about CotF using blood sacrifice to weirwoods; that seems to be a human addition to the Old Gods worship. So maybe regular greenseers don't need to consume blood to bond with the trees but humans do. 1) In that case, who was Bloodraven's paste? I wonder.

 

Lol at "Plotzee." That's a very good term for it. I tend to think that Jojen got a clean death because the show likes to paint characters more black-and-white than the books. 2) A lot of Tyrion's dark deeds get skipped, and so far we've only seen Bran in a positive light. He only wargs Hodor for dire and immediate good reasons. I think we'll likely skip the warging of Hodor for fun as well as the blood-paste bit. So Bran can continue to be a fairly uncomplicated hero in the eyes of the audience.

1) I have been semi-obsessed with BR for a little while and have asked that same question myself. I did not get much of an answer but I am very happy to see someone else ask as well. I judt don't know we have enough info right now to answer that question. I wish we did.

2) Yup, TV Tyrion has a lot of fan-fav armor that protects him. He really is kind of a gross, mean, killing bastard. And again with Bran, I have always wondered if and when he will ever find out that skinchanging into a human is considered an abomination. He never had a proper warg teacher until he got to BR, yet BR doesn't seem to be in any hurry to teach him about those small, inconvenient details ;)

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3 minutes ago, Blind Beth the Cat Lady said:

Oooh, yeah....but what if it was just Meera and BranDor??? Totally workable then...

I can see this happening (in all seriousness, but who likes that?)

I can see the two of them getting "smart" about what is going on and having to run for their lives. Now that I think about it... if Bran is hooked up permanently, and he finds out what happened to Jojen and what is going to happen to Meera, he could warn her and she could bolt on her own. Either way, soemeone will make use of the back door if it was mentioned the way it was. But three leagues is a long way off! ^_^

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8 minutes ago, Blind Beth the Cat Lady said:

:cheers:

I kind of love Missandei and Grey Worm, even though I'm usually meh on romantic subplots.

NOT YOU TOOO! I feel betrayed :P

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Just now, The Fattest Leech said:

I can see this happening (in all seriousness, but who likes that?)

I can see the two of them getting "smart" about what is going on and having to run for their lives. Now that I think about it... if Bran is hooked up permanently, and he finds out what happened to Jojen and what is going to happen to Meera, he could warn her and she could bolt on her own. Either way, someone will make use of the back door if it was mentioned the way it was. But three leagues is a long way off! ^_^

I think that if Meera escapes, Hodor is going with her. Bran using Hodor's body to fight is rather neatly foreshadowed in the chapter when the Frey kids are playing Lord of the Crossing. And I think Bran warging Hodor during the wight fight is just more buildup to that rather than the payoff. Unless BranDor goes on an underhill rampage, escorting Meera out of the cave and making a break south would be the most reasonable scenario for that to come to fruition IMO.

Plus, if Bran is stuck under the hill for whatever reason, or believes that is the best place for him to be, he may want as many eyes and ears outside as possible, making Hodor a lot more useful outside of the caves. Hodor also has the advantage of being hands and feet--things Bran would not otherwise have access to. It's sad to think of Hodor being treated that way indefinitely, but hard to see Bran backing off his habit any time soon.

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2 hours ago, The Fattest Leech said:

I love Jojen paste. I plan on making and serving it for my next pre-divorce ceremony. The sickles and wood boles/bowls and sadness are all great forshadowing. Bran was one of the best POV's in Dance. I love the Three-Eyed Crow as well and the old sinister sorcerer he is. That pile of mulch is up to no good and I can't wait... even though I have to :crying:

Just a thought about just how much blood is needed or how that process goes back in the cave-kitchen. There is a chapter in Dance-Bran 3 that mentions other CotF that are hooked up to the roots... and I don't think they are other greenseers... are they? We have TTEC/Bloodraven and now Bran that are supposed to be the last greenseers. So what are the CotF doing hooked up and dead-like while one of them tries to speak to Bran?

P.S. Whatever the show shows does not mean anything, really. They play their own game of Plotzee with every character. However, part of that game of Plotzee could be that they wanted to rid themselves of the younger Reeds quickly (to make room for more Missandai/Grey Worm kissy time) so they killed Jojen with power skeletons and fireballs and maybe, maybe, they will have Meera be the paste in this coming season????

Haha, "Meera Paste" - congratulations, you've just made of the most awful ASOIAF theories even more awful! You're a real champ!

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1 hour ago, LmL said:

Haha, "Meera Paste" - congratulations, you've just made of the most awful ASOIAF theories even more awful! You're a real champ!

Thanks... I think :dunno:

Jojen paste has grown on me over time and I can see it being a real possibility and guts and gore are personal favorites of mine.  

My mistake in that post was I crossed the streams between ASOIAF and HBO. HBO has the tendency to muck things up for "creative" reasons and I pulled out my hazy crystal ball, smeared a little Vaseline on my eyes and made my prediction of how they could possibly rearrange that story arc. 

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1 hour ago, LmL said:

Haha, "Meera Paste" - congratulations, you've just made of the most awful ASOIAF theories even more awful! You're a real champ!

Meera paste is just worse than Daario being Euron, and if Jojen's paste (if it is to be real) is going to become Meera paste I'll never ever watch the show again. If the books confirm any Meera paste theory I just don't know how I will react, it's just insane.

 

.........

about Jojen paste, despite of the fact that it may be foreshadowed as mentioned here and in other threads, I am not completely sure of this. But the thing which that I believe the most is that Jojen might have been killed in sacrifice and he ate his eyes. 

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Um, er, do you really think Meera or Hodor would just sit by and let Jojen be either bled or killed for any reason, least of all to feed Bran?   Ewww indeed.  

I think Jojen following his fate rather than fighting it like Cersei does brings a nice dutiful balance to the story.   Jojen is just a kid and this story is full of sullen teenage boys.    It doesn't have to mean anything, but I think with Jojen being aware of his fate, he has obviously embraced it...however reluctantly.

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11 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

1) Um, er, do you really think Meera or Hodor would just sit by and let Jojen be either bled or killed for any reason, least of all to feed Bran?   Ewww indeed.  

2) I think Jojen following his fate rather than fighting it like Cersei does brings a nice dutiful balance to the story.   Jojen is just a kid and this story is full of sullen teenage boys.    It doesn't have to mean anything, but I think with Jojen being aware of his fate, he has obviously embraced it...however reluctantly.

1) Ewww indeed, indeed. Meera and Hodor may not have a choice in saving Jojen or releasing Bran. We just don't know yet. The CotF may end up as little cretins or something? Bloodraven appears to have the ability to glamour (on some level) and could have them under his control. He was a "sinister sorcerer" in his flesh-life. Meera and Hodor may not really know what is happening until it's too late, try to save Jojen or release Bran only to either be killed or have to flee out the back door. Jojen may think of his death as a sacrifice for the greater good and goes along with it??? Kinda like Mel could be the Nissa Nissa in the AA prophecy. She is just THAT devout a follower.

I have a mini-theory that while Bran is hooked up and has his visions he sees Jon being stabbed either through Mormont's Raven's eyes or sees Jon about to be burned/resurrected at the ring of Wierwoods where Jon took his Watch vows. Maybe this is where Bran decides he wants to leave, to go hep his brother, but Bloodraven refuses, an arguement ensues, the glamored CotF try to step in to hold Bran down, Meera and Hodor fight and tussle with them and then they make a break for it.

I just don't see this whole cave scenario as just an innocent training experience. Since when in the entire series have we met any character that was just all "good" or didn't have an ulterior motive? ;) Something bad, weird, gross or creepy will happen.

2) Agreed. Jojen is aware of something gloomy-doomy. He has embraced it but Meera is refusing to accept it, acknowledge it or doesn't know every little detail yet.

Whatever happens, who lives or dies, this is definitely one of the top two storylines I cannot wait to read more of... one day ^_^

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I saw a theory that Jojen is going to be eaten by Ghost, while Jon is either in his second life or temporarily warging him.  There's a mention of a sinkhole that leads into the caves, what other reason than to have something fall accidentally into the cave?  When Jojen and Meera first see Summer and Shaggydog, Meera is scared for Jojen, but Jojen is unafraid - the theory is that Jojen saw that he was going to be eaten by a direwolf and has told Meera, but did not tell her that it was a white direwolf.  The theory is that Ghost is going to be drawn to the cave by Bloodraven or Bran and be starving to death when he gets there.  He will fall through the sinkhole into the cave, and then come across a little crannogman who seems to be ready to be eaten.

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