Jump to content
Rhaenys_Targaryen

Small Questions v. 10105

Recommended Posts

31 minutes ago, MtnLion said:

No, but the quote says that Jon and his wetnurse were already at Winterfell when Catelyn and Robb arrived.  The quote also tells us that Catelyn and Robb set out from Riverrun alone (probably had an household escort).  What Ned could have been doing is returning Lord Dustin's horse to Lady Dustin and offering his condolences to those widows and families of the senior lords that accompanied him during the war, not to return.  So, there is a valid reason for Ned's absence from any of the perspectives. 

Except that it doesn't. The quote only mentions Catelyn travelling to Winterfell. As well, it only states that, when Catelyn arrived at Winterfell, Jon and his wetnurse were already there. It doesn't mention anyone who travelled with her at all. But that Ned isn't mentioned, doesn't mean he wasn't there.

Catelyn was hurt that Jon and his wetnurse were already at Winterfell before she ever got there. Wouldn't it have hurt much more to know that Ned escorted his bastard and bastard's wetnurse to his home (as she mentions he did), but did not escort his new bride and heir home?

There's also this quote,

“Gods have mercy,” Ser Brynden exclaimed when he saw what lay before them. “This is Moat Cailin? It’s no more than a-”
“-death trap,” Catelyn finished. “I know how it looks, Uncle. I thought the same the first time I saw it, but Ned assured me that this ruin is more formidable than it seems. The three surviving towers command the causeway from all sides, and any enemy must pass between them. The bogs here are impenetrable, full of quicksands and suckholes and teeming with snakes. To assault any of the towers, an army would need to wade through waist-deep black muck, cross a moat full of lizard-lions, and scale walls slimy with moss, all the while exposing themselves to fire from archers in the other towers.” She gave her uncle a grim smile. “And when night falls, there are said to be ghosts, cold vengeful spirits of the north who hunger for southron blood.”

Catelyn presumably would have passed Moat Cailin on her way from Riverrun to Winterfell, which would mean that's when she saw it fort he first time. That Ned assured her about Moat Cailin, might be a suggestion that he was there, after all.

To be sure, there's the chance that he assured her about MC after she had arrived at Winterfell and spoken with him about it, but the first scenario is possible as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

And don't forget Luwin delivered Robb. Sorry, I couldn't help myself. 

Could Luwin have been the maester at Riverrun, and had traveled north with Cat as part of her household and delivered the remaining children at Winterfell?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Arya Stoneheart said:

Small question, cant find answer anywhere. Does Lady Stoneheart have a coat of arms? Or a banner??

She is the leader of the Brotherhood without Banners;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, daccu65 said:

Could Luwin have been the maester at Riverrun, and had traveled north with Cat as part of her household and delivered the remaining children at Winterfell?

Cat is neither a Lady in respect of being the mistress of a noble house nor of a castle at the time she delivers Robb; so there would not have been a call for another master than the one of Riverrun.
But if Luwin was maester in Riverrun, why would the Citadel have him move to Winterfell? That kind of thing isn't happening anywhere in the books.
Construe that he was Winterfell's maester and Ned had him come south to take care of Catelyn and her pregnancy... but that still seems a bit strange.

More likely the error it became in hindsight, when the ways of the Citadel were fleshed out: When A Game of Thrones was written, maesters were not yet that well defined breed of servants than what they became in A Clash of Kings and the following books.

Edited by Jon Weirgaryen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

Except that it doesn't. The quote only mentions Catelyn travelling to Winterfell. As well, it only states that, when Catelyn arrived at Winterfell, Jon and his wetnurse were already there. It doesn't mention anyone who travelled with her at all. But that Ned isn't mentioned, doesn't mean he wasn't there.

She said that Ned brought Jon home, not sent Jon home. Ned went to Winterfell with Jon.

8 hours ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

Catelyn was hurt that Jon and his wetnurse were already at Winterfell before she ever got there. Wouldn't it have hurt much more to know that Ned escorted his bastard and bastard's wetnurse to his home (as she mentions he did), but did not escort his new bride and heir home?

Possibly, but I think this is an enormous leap that isn't a sound basis for any speculation. Its just as likely that Ned came back to Winterfell by a different route due to when and where he was and the need to get back home quickly, and Catelyn understood those things and took no offense.
Ned also might like to get back to Winterfell before Catelyn in order to make it his and theirs. Remember, he wasn't living there and wasn't Lord when the wheels of war were set in motion. The place would have had Rickard's stamp still, or a war-footing stamp, which he may have wished to change. And little things, like setting up the Lord's bedchamber as the Lord's and Lady's bedchamber, arranging a nursery, even getting the arrangements under way for the construction of a Sept and inviting a Septon or Septa to take up residence.
All in all, if I was Ned I'd have been more concerned about preparing my new bride's home to receive her  as her home than being her personal escort on the trip.

8 hours ago, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

There's also this quote,

“Gods have mercy,” Ser Brynden exclaimed when he saw what lay before them. “This is Moat Cailin? It’s no more than a-”
“-death trap,” Catelyn finished. “I know how it looks, Uncle. I thought the same the first time I saw it, but Ned assured me that this ruin is more formidable than it seems. The three surviving towers command the causeway from all sides, and any enemy must pass between them. The bogs here are impenetrable, full of quicksands and suckholes and teeming with snakes. To assault any of the towers, an army would need to wade through waist-deep black muck, cross a moat full of lizard-lions, and scale walls slimy with moss, all the while exposing themselves to fire from archers in the other towers.” She gave her uncle a grim smile. “And when night falls, there are said to be ghosts, cold vengeful spirits of the north who hunger for southron blood.”

Catelyn presumably would have passed Moat Cailin on her way from Riverrun to Winterfell, which would mean that's when she saw it fort he first time. That Ned assured her about Moat Cailin, might be a suggestion that he was there, after all.

To be sure, there's the chance that he assured her about MC after she had arrived at Winterfell and spoken with him about it, but the first scenario is possible as well.

I think its very unlikely that Ned went to Winterfell and then back to Riverrun to escort her (or even only most of the way back as far as Moat Cailin). I think its pretty straightforward that Ned has assured her about Moat Cailin at a later time than when she first passed by it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Jon Weirgaryen said:

But if Luwin was maester in Riverrun, why would the Citadel have him move to Winterfell? That kind of thing isn't happening anywhere in the books.

Cressen followed Stannis to Dragonstone, if I remember right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, RumHam said:

Cressen followed Stannis to Dragonstone, if I remember right.

Also, it seems as though Maester Walys died during the war, or its lead up (maybe he went south with Rickard?)
Possibly Luwin was sent to Winterfell to replace Walys and stopped at Riverrun on the way as he knew Catelyn would be there?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, corbon said:

Also, it seems as though Maester Walys died during the war, or its lead up (maybe he went south with Rickard?)
Possibly Luwin was sent to Winterfell to replace Walys and stopped at Riverrun on the way as he knew Catelyn would be there?

That's a good explanation. He may also have been Riverrun's Maester who accompanied Catelyn in the absence of any other companions. That would give both Lysa and Cat a familiar face when they left their homes to join their husbands. Cat would be going to a rather different culture, so it would make sense if she had some kind of companion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok here's another dumb newbie question. What does IMO stand for? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Nissa said:

Ok here's another dumb newbie question. What does IMO stand for? 

And welcome!  There's also...

IMHO - In my humble opinion

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Nissa said:

Ok here's another dumb newbie question. What does IMO stand for? 

 

Just now, DarkSister1001 said:

In my opinion

 

In addition, IMHO means "in my honest opinion"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Rhaenys_Targaryen said:

 

 

In addition, IMHO means "in my honest opinion"

Ha!  I thought it was "humble".  Whoops!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×