Arch-MaesterPhilip Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 6 minutes ago, Jack Bauer 24 said: During Paige's tantrum she yells "I've never been to Russia"...except you have. Just ten episodes ago in the Season 3 finale :facepalm: No, I think they brought her Grandmother to West Berlin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 I am feeling very very sorry for the South Korean family Elizabeth has infiltrated. She's obviously almost destroyed them, and I assume we will see the coup de grace next week. Well, unless Gabriel can find some other way to do the thing, whatever that thing is. But that long pause of Elizabeth's seems to show she's cracking, doesn't it? The hard-liner. And oh my, what to do about Pastor Tim and his wife now? I wonder how badly Paige might be torn if something does happen, after Alice put them through some pretty fierce terror. I was so sorry to see them kill former director Gaad that way. Almost comically. And at the same time as Elizabeth and Phillip are telling Paige that the KGB aren't everywhere, ya know. Oh, and Paige is turning into quite the little spy, isn't she? I actually laughed out loud when Elizabeth got stressed over Henry's tennis balls on the garage door, and then Paige came in and mimicked her. The apple and the tree.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 Why did Phillip visit Kimmy? Also thought it was weird she said her father is in the CIA and that was a surprise? I checked the wiki and it already had her dad listed as a CIA agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arch-MaesterPhilip Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 11 minutes ago, Jack Bauer 24 said: Why did Phillip visit Kimmy? Also thought it was weird she said her father is in the CIA and that was a surprise? I checked the wiki and it already had her dad listed as a CIA agent. Because her father's study is bugged. And she never actually told him her father was in the CIA so he had to act like he was surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 The name of the episode was "Munchkins", so it was a good place to bring in another child/parent relationship, particularly one that had the same issue Paige and Phillip had, a father lying about what he really does for a living in an atmosphere where secrecy was essential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 It was just weird to me because we hadn't seen the Kimmy arc in a while and it seemed like it was done. Isn't that particular thread over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 I don't recall anything to indicate that they had stopped working with their long time agents and marks. I assume that, unless explicitly stated or shown, they are still doing all that spy work on the side. Picking up recordings, drops, etc. And there is a difference between the audience knowing something and the characters knowing something. The audience knew Kimmy's dad was CIA. Kimmy didn't, and now she knows and she's shared. It's a little on the nose with how it mirrors the Jenningses situation, but it's always nice to check in with a past character. Poor Gaad. I didn't have as much of an emotional response to his death as I had to Nina's, but it was still quite unfortunate. I wonder what they wanted him for. They seemed genuinely sorry that this thing happened. Perhaps they were going to defect or something like that. I keep expecting Oleg or Tatiana to be the movers behind the Rezindentura plot, but it almost looks like it could turn out to be Arkady. Elizabeth's pause makes me nervous for her. The Center was willing to give the Jennings a break, but the weight of what they have to do has only become heavier. They are a huge investment, but they could become a liability. I'm eager to know what Gabriel would do. In fact, I want to know what Gabriel does when he isn't around them, when his handler mask is off. Does the weight burden him as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 32 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said: I don't recall anything to indicate that they had stopped working with their long time agents and marks. I assume that, unless explicitly stated or shown, they are still doing all that spy work on the side. Picking up recordings, drops, etc. And there is a difference between the audience knowing something and the characters knowing something. The audience knew Kimmy's dad was CIA. Kimmy didn't, and now she knows and she's shared. It's a little on the nose with how it mirrors the Jenningses situation, but it's always nice to check in with a past character. Poor Gaad. I didn't have as much of an emotional response to his death as I had to Nina's, but it was still quite unfortunate. I wonder what they wanted him for. They seemed genuinely sorry that this thing happened. Perhaps they were going to defect or something like that. I keep expecting Oleg or Tatiana to be the movers behind the Rezindentura plot, but it almost looks like it could turn out to be Arkady. Elizabeth's pause makes me nervous for her. The Center was willing to give the Jennings a break, but the weight of what they have to do has only become heavier. They are a huge investment, but they could become a liability. I'm eager to know what Gabriel would do. In fact, I want to know what Gabriel does when he isn't around them, when his handler mask is off. Does the weight burden him as well? I'm certain that Gabriel is working them. He says he'll ask the center, but I don't think he's genuine. I didn't like that Elizabeth broke at the end. She's supposed to be the rock. And now Tatianna wants to bring in Martha it seems. She's using Oleg. Hopefully that ends soon because we don't need anymore Oleg sex scenes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 How is Tatiana trying to bring in Martha? Certainly not for the operation she was discussing with Oleg (Martha is not a grandmotherly computer expert). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 52 minutes ago, Dr. Pepper said: How is Tatiana trying to bring in Martha? Certainly not for the operation she was discussing with Oleg (Martha is not a grandmotherly computer expert). I guarantee that's how Martha comes back into the story. She's a former American secretary, so that will suffice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 33 minutes ago, Jack Bauer 24 said: I guarantee that's how Martha comes back into the story. She's a former American secretary, so that will suffice. I suppose they can put a disguise on Martha to make her look nearly twice her age, but has there been any suggestion that she's a computer expert? Or are you thinking that she's taken high level computer courses alongside her Russian language classes since she's been in Moscow? There not looking for someone with secretary skills. They are looking for a Claudia figure, a grandmother who no one will think twice about, who also happens to be a computer expert and speaks perfect English. This is why it's pointed out that this is an extremely specific request. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martini Sigil Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 I also thought bringing the Kimmy storyline back was weird.... My thinking is that between this, and Martha's dad still being in the story.... along with the knowledge Pastor Tim & his wife have.... and Elizabeth (probably) failed blackmail attempt (I don't think this guy will go along with it) ..... they're creating a perfect storm to be caught... Also.... RIP Johnboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mance Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 13 hours ago, Jack Bauer 24 said: I guarantee that's how Martha comes back into the story. She's a former American secretary, so that will suffice. Why the hell would they bring Martha back tot he US? They need a trained operative, not a volatile, recent traitor, currently being searched for and investigated by every security force in the nation. That makes no sense, and you are wrong. 12 hours ago, Martini Sigil said: I also thought bringing the Kimmy storyline back was weird.... .... and Elizabeth (probably) failed blackmail attempt (I don't think this guy will go along with it) My take is that, with Martha gone, they need to step up their information gathering operations from other sources. And, yeah, the blackmail will fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 So for 3+ Seasons they beat us over the head with Elizabeth being an unwavering rock. A hardcore devotee to "the mission" and Mother Russia. Now she's breaking because she made a friend? Not buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 Except she hasn't always been an unwavering rock. In the pilot, she was this close to screwing up a mission to get revenge on her rapist. Her relationship with Gregory is another example. We've seen her struggle with the things she's had to do multiple times. Recall when she had to kill the lady at the mail robot factory. At this point, she's spent nearly a year, maybe more, making friends with an entire family. It's not just a casual friendship where she occasionally goes to the movies with Yong Hee. She even babysat the kids for an entire weekend, and even the most hardened think twice before deliberately destroying children. Couple that with Elizabeth having spent the year with her own family hanging in the balance, one single thread being able to destroy it. Things have a different look to them. We're talking 15 years of experiences building up to this moment where Elizabeth wants to find another way before she destroys a family. She might have been unwavering with her allegiance to Russia and communism, but she certainly hasn't been an immovable rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commodore Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 Well both of them have straight up murdered civilians without hesitation (Liz moreso than Phillip) But it's obviously harder when you know the person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 That's why I'm not buying it. She's a trained KGB agent who's been doing this for a long time. She's constantly challenging Phillip when he wavers. Now this one family is breaking her because she spends time with them? That's what spys do lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consigliere Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 Phillip is also a trained KGB agent who has been doing this for years and guess what, he wavers. It's just taken Liz longer to reach that point. Don't see why it's believable with Phillip and not Liz and as Dr Pepper has already pointed out, Liz has not always been unwavering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Bauer 24 Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 Have to see how it plays out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consigliere Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 I'm sure if Benioff and Weiss wrote it, you'd be hailing it as the greatest thing ever. I can see that nuanced characterisation isn't your strong point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.