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Vikings X: Halfway Through the Madness


Corvinus85

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Haha, nice one ! 

Could have been a more crazy title but quite appropriate actually ! 

And I'm sad the show is mostly hyping up the mid-finale on Rollo vs Ragnar... maybe they'll surprise me, but I sure as hell dont expect any of them to be offed... yeah, I know it's gonna be the big-payoff of the season, but I feel like expectations for the episode would have been better raised higher by focusing the promos on other characters.

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No problem, Corvinus, I do not have a good idea for a thread title anyway. ;)

How long will it take Ragnar to lose the effect of the drug addiction? I want to see him doing cool stuff again, not crawling on the floor and seeing spiders.

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8 hours ago, Arkash said:

Haha, nice one ! 

Could have been a more crazy title but quite appropriate actually ! 

And I'm sad the show is mostly hyping up the mid-finale on Rollo vs Ragnar... maybe they'll surprise me, but I sure as hell dont expect any of them to be offed... yeah, I know it's gonna be the big-payoff of the season, but I feel like expectations for the episode would have been better raised higher by focusing the promos on other characters.

I'm thinking they might actually kill off Rollo as a way of dropping Paris in the next half of the season. Or maybe I'm being overly optimistic because I want rid of the tripe that is Paris.

I'm also completely baffled as to how not a single word is supposed to have reached Paris that the Vikings were crossing overland. Apparently France is completely uninhabited (except for that one farm, obviously) and nobody ever leaves their house and notices hey, someone cut down vast swathes of our forests overnight...

1 hour ago, Buckwheat said:

No problem, Corvinus, I do not have a good idea for a thread title anyway. ;)

How long will it take Ragnar to lose the effect of the drug addiction? I want to see him doing cool stuff again, not crawling on the floor and seeing spiders.

Well he will be going through withdrawal right now and that should last for a long time. Though judging from Lagertha's state in the episode before this one, a fair few months already passed while they were porting the ships so who knows really. 

Im over trippy Ragnar too though. This season has been really poor :( It's a worrying sign when the children on the show have become the best thing about it

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My take on the madness is that all the flaws, mistakes, and Hirst hallucinating about something that never happened were present in the first two seasons as well but have now been blown out of proportion. Let me explain.

Silly plot points:
- S01-S02 --> jarl Haraldson stubbornly rejecting the idea that there could be lands to the West, which was the epitome of silly. Still, Gabriel Byrne's acting was great, and the jarl's true reasons actually made sense;
- S03-S04 --> Ragnar joining Kwenthrith's struggle for Mercia, Ecbert "freeing" Judith, Harbard, 3/4 of what's happening in Paris, Yidu.

Questionable costumes:
- S01-S02 --> leather galore, Anglo-saxons wearing pseudo-Roman armours, Wessex cavalry with 16th century burgonets;
- S03-S04 --> every Anglo-saxon army wear completely different armours (notable mention for the Mercia soldiers in pseudo-Anglo-norman clothes), even more leather for the Norse (e.g.: Floki and Ragnar), 1st century Roman guards watching over a Renaissance pope in a baroque Vatican, Ecbert in plate armour.

More than that, though, it's the atmosphere, the feel of the whole series. The first two seasons shone because they were focused on everyday life, showing all the aspects of Norse culture. The whole scenic design was great even when some parts of it weren't. Take the sacrifice festival in season 1, for example: it's far from being accurate (what with the temple being a church and general silliness), but it's played so well you don't even mind.
The episode in which jarl Borg gets the blood eagle is still one of the best for me. Not just the execution, but nearly every scene, from Ragnar and Torstein's drunken game to Helga telling Floki she's pregnant ("Floki the fisherman, Floki the carpenter... Floki the father!", God, I love that line) feels good, feels real. The music is perfect, everything is in place.
Season 3 and 4 never reached that level again, apart maybe for the first assault on Paris and Floki killing Athelstan (again, the music, the acting, the vibes). There has been a lot of wasted potential in this season in particular: Bjorn's bear and berserker fights, and Erlendur's death are the first that pop in my mind.
Where Hirst really failed was in trying to make it bigger, as if it were GoT. He went for the kolossal kind of show, threw in more actors, plots, gratuitous sex, even costumes (some of the gear the main characters are wearing looks like an upgraded version of what they were wearing in the previous seasons), and forgot about the rest, which was what really made this show great.

EDIT: about last episode, I only want to say that I'm glad Monty Python's foot managed to make an appearance. That was a nice touch.

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1 hour ago, Floke said:

My take on the madness is that all the flaws, mistakes, and Hirst hallucinating about something that never happened were present in the first two seasons as well but have now been blown out of proportion. Let me explain.

Silly plot points:
- S01-S02 --> jarl Haraldson stubbornly rejecting the idea that there could be lands to the West, which was the epitome of silly. Still, Gabriel Byrne's acting was great, and the jarl's true reasons actually made sense;
- S03-S04 --> Ragnar joining Kwenthrith's struggle for Mercia, Ecbert "freeing" Judith, Harbard, 3/4 of what's happening in Paris, Yidu.

Questionable costumes:
- S01-S02 --> leather galore, Anglo-saxons wearing pseudo-Roman armours, Wessex cavalry with 16th century burgonets;
- S03-S04 --> every Anglo-saxon army wear completely different armours (notable mention for the Mercia soldiers in pseudo-Anglo-norman clothes), even more leather for the Norse (e.g.: Floki and Ragnar), 1st century Roman guards watching over a Renaissance pope in a baroque Vatican, Ecbert in plate armour.

More than that, though, it's the atmosphere, the feel of the whole series. The first two seasons shone because they were focused on everyday life, showing all the aspects of Norse culture. The whole scenic design was great even when some parts of it weren't. Take the sacrifice festival in season 1, for example: it's far from being accurate (what with the temple being a church and general silliness), but it's played so well you don't even mind.
The episode in which jarl Borg gets the blood eagle is still one of the best for me. Not just the execution, but nearly every scene, from Ragnar and Torstein's drunken game to Helga telling Floki she's pregnant ("Floki the fisherman, Floki the carpenter... Floki the father!", God, I love that line) feels good, feels real. The music is perfect, everything is in place.
Season 3 and 4 never reached that level again, apart maybe for the first assault on Paris and Floki killing Athelstan (again, the music, the acting, the vibes). There has been a lot of wasted potential in this season in particular: Bjorn's bear and berserker fights, and Erlendur's death are the first that pop in my mind.
Where Hirst really failed was in trying to make it bigger, as if it were GoT. He went for the kolossal kind of show, threw in more actors, plots, gratuitous sex, even costumes (some of the gear the main characters are wearing looks like an upgraded version of what they were wearing in the previous seasons), and forgot about the rest, which was what really made this show great.

EDIT: about last episode, I only want to say that I'm glad Monty Python's foot managed to make an appearance. That was a nice touch.

Have to sort of agree, the show has always had silly moments and is full of brain farts that don't alway make a lot of sense. Its just that the first couple of seasons were written in a way that was fast paced and full of event and drama. There was never a dull moment and the show didn't spend a lot of time just sitting around having long pointless conversations, which is good because the dialogue was never all that clever anyway.

It also had a bunch of interesting characters, who were sometimes larger than life, and some powerful interplay in their relationships. The Rollo / Ragnar relationship was always interesting, even when it pushed credibility. Ragnar and the English was interesting as well, and Ragnar and his wife.. Floki and Rollo.. it created a sort of bouncing tension within each episode. 

Now by season 4 those relationships have broken up or changed. Floki has become something unrecognisable, Rollo is miles away.. Ragnar has lost a lot of his mojo. Theres no electricity there.

I also think the quality of the writing is worse, just on a basic level the way they do exposition, dialogue, the way they write scenes feel a lot heavier and more amateurish than previously. 

I might go back to the show but I'm gonna start Black Sails after all the fuss it gets on here now.

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3 hours ago, Floke said:

 Still, Gabriel Byrne's acting was great

No, it really wasn't. I'm a fan of Byrne, but he was sleepwalking through that season. He was obviously the name actor they signed on to give the whole project some legitimacy but I don't think they found enough money for him to do more than show up and read his lines. I was severely disappointed in his performance.

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49 minutes ago, matt b said:

No, it really wasn't. I'm a fan of Byrne, but he was sleepwalking through that season. He was obviously the name actor they signed on to give the whole project some legitimacy but I don't think they found enough money for him to do more than show up and read his lines. I was severely disappointed in his performance.

Glad it wasn't just me who thought that. He never really got to the heart of the character, and mostly came off as a stereotypical villain. There was definitely an interesting take on him, but I'm not sure he put all that much work into it. 

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58 minutes ago, matt b said:

No, it really wasn't. I'm a fan of Byrne, but he was sleepwalking through that season. He was obviously the name actor they signed on to give the whole project some legitimacy but I don't think they found enough money for him to do more than show up and read his lines. I was severely disappointed in his performance.

Yeah, Bryne wasn't very good for most of season 1. It did seem like he woke in the episode where Haraldson is killed though and I though he very good in there.

2 hours ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

I might go back to the show but I'm gonna start Black Sails after all the fuss it gets on here now.

Word of warning, first season of Black Sails is kinda bad, but once that is over with the show is great.

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32 minutes ago, The_Gallows_Knight said:

Yeah, Bryne wasn't very good for most of season 1. It did seem like he woke in the episode where Haraldson is killed though and I though he very good in there.

Word of warning, first season of Black Sails is kinda bad, but once that is over with the show is great.

Yeah I have noticed, i tried once before and thought it was cheesy nonsense.. I guess I'll have to grit my teeth and endure it.

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"Therese and Gisla look very different from one another." - Buckwheat

There are a lot closer than you think. Both French, have long brown hair and a significant that has similar sounding names (Rollo/Roland). It got to a point where I completely forgot about Therese and thought that Gisla were in all those scenes. It probably just shows how the Paris scenes are to begin with.

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14 minutes ago, Channel4s-JonSnow said:

Yeah I have noticed, i tried once before and thought it was cheesy nonsense.. I guess I'll have to grit my teeth and endure it.

I'm not sure why anyone would say this even about season 1. Cheesy nonsense is what Pirates of Caribbean has, even discounting the fantasy aspect. But hop on to the Black Sails thread, if you wish to discuss more.

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2 hours ago, matt b said:

No, it really wasn't. I'm a fan of Byrne, but he was sleepwalking through that season. He was obviously the name actor they signed on to give the whole project some legitimacy but I don't think they found enough money for him to do more than show up and read his lines. I was severely disappointed in his performance.

I remember it as being quite good, but maybe it's just me looking back through rose-coloured glasses.

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I can't help but think the show went to shit when they offed Torstein.  You're my boyyyy Torstein!!

 

Also,I can't remember, but is Thorunn still alive? if she's alive and still hung up on the ol' scars she really ought to ask Rollo for the name of the plastic surgeon that healed all his facial scarring. It's almost as if that never happened him.

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Gisela and Therese are such different looking women to my eyes, I'd never confuse the two. Their style in clothing is different. They carry their bodies differently.  Therese's hair is darker and curly, whereas Gisela's is lighter and rather limp.  

Gisela has more similarities in terms of body type and body kinetics with Saxon Judith, though I'd never confuse those two either. For two examples as why not, Judith is much larger than Gisela, and her hair is darker, thicker and longer.

 

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6 hours ago, Floke said:

 

More than that, though, it's the atmosphere, the feel of the whole series. The first two seasons shone because they were focused on everyday life, showing all the aspects of Norse culture. The whole scenic design was great even when some parts of it weren't. Take the sacrifice festival in season 1, for example: it's far from being accurate (what with the temple being a church and general silliness), but it's played so well you don't even mind.
The episode in which jarl Borg gets the blood eagle is still one of the best for me. Not just the execution, but nearly every scene, from Ragnar and Torstein's drunken game to Helga telling Floki she's pregnant ("Floki the fisherman, Floki the carpenter... Floki the father!", God, I love that line) feels good, feels real. The music is perfect, everything is in place.
Season 3 and 4 never reached that level again, apart maybe for the first assault on Paris and Floki killing Athelstan (again, the music, the acting, the vibes). There has been a lot of wasted potential in this season in particular: Bjorn's bear and berserker fights, and Erlendur's death are the first that pop in my mind.
Where Hirst really failed was in trying to make it bigger, as if it were GoT. He went for the kolossal kind of show, threw in more actors, plots, gratuitous sex, even costumes (some of the gear the main characters are wearing looks like an upgraded version of what they were wearing in the previous seasons), and forgot about the rest, which was what really made this show great.

EDIT: about last episode, I only want to say that I'm glad Monty Python's foot managed to make an appearance. That was a nice touch.

These are my favorite episodes. The show is at it's best when it is exploring and contrasting cultures. Hirst has gotten away from that in seasons 3 and 4, focusing almost exclusively on story and no longer on the atmosphere of the show.  The only episode this season to remind me of seasons 1 and 2 was Yul  What happened to those magnificent scenes showcasing and contrasting cultures with Wardruna adding to the atmosphere? 

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3 hours ago, dooog said:

I can't help but think the show went to shit when they offed Torstein.  You're my boyyyy Torstein!!

 

Also,I can't remember, but is Thorunn still alive? if she's alive and still hung up on the ol' scars she really ought to ask Rollo for the name of the plastic surgeon that healed all his facial scarring. It's almost as if that never happened him.

She was alive last season when she left Kattegat. I was expecting to see her this season actually, but looks like they just dropped her

3 hours ago, Zorral said:

Gisela and Therese are such different looking women to my eyes, I'd never confuse the two. Their style in clothing is different. They carry their bodies differently.  Therese's hair is darker and curly, whereas Gisela's is lighter and rather limp.  

Gisela has more similarities in terms of body type and body kinetics with Saxon Judith, though I'd never confuse those two either. For two examples as why not, Judith is much larger than Gisela, and her hair is darker, thicker and longer.

 

Yeah I don't really see the confusion between Therese and Gisla. They don't look similar and even their (admittedly rather poor) characterisations are not similar either. There's is typical Courtly schemer, Gisla is..,well who knows anymore what she is. This season she's pretty much been a prop.

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7 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

She was alive last season when she left Kattegat. I was expecting to see her this season actually, but looks like they just dropped her

Yeah I don't really see the confusion between Therese and Gisla. They don't look similar and even their (admittedly rather poor) characterisations are not similar either. There's is typical Courtly schemer, Gisla is..,well who knows anymore what she is. This season she's pretty much been a prop.

You know though what is preposterous regarding Gisela and Therese is that Therese has this veddy cliched french accent for her English (which probably didn't exist in the 9th century or whatever century this is supposedly playing out in) while Gisela does not.  :rolleyes:

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5 hours ago, Zorral said:

You know though what is preposterous regarding Gisela and Therese is that Therese has this veddy cliched french accent for her English (which probably didn't exist in the 9th century or whatever century this is supposedly playing out in) while Gisela does not.  :rolleyes:

Gisela had it in the last season. I find it much better she does not now, I thought it sounded awful when she was speaking like that.

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