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To continue my impressions on S6 EP1 geographically.

The North - Sansa, Reek/Theon and then Brienne & Pod. The strongest part after the Wall stuff, and for me personally, I loved it because it brought together many favourite characters. Reek is really reclaiming some of his Theon-ness and maybe a better Theon than the one that was Reekified. Their desperate huddle/hug before the hounds come, I thought it was really poignant. And then Reek/Theon's futile attempt to sacrifice himself to protect Sansa... Only it doesn't go too well... Until Brienne and everybody's favourite squire Pod burst on the scene, just in time! WOOHOO!

Brienne has obviously taught Pod some horse-riding and sword-fighting skills but he didn't seem all that skilled. Rather clumsy, in fact. He managed to kill that Bolton man on horseback but then got his sword stuck and went down with him. Brienne wasn't having an easy time of it either, she was unhorsed and lost her sword for a while (I wonder what Jaime would say about that). All Brienne's fights seem to be brutal but she never gives up and gets the job done. And Reek/Theon had a Theon moment, picking up the sword and saving Pod's life. For that, I'll always be grateful to Theon. (Someone on the internets pointed out a continuity error. The Bolton soldied Theon stabbed in the back falls forward on his stomach... and has his shield covering his back...)

Brienne then swears an oath of fealty to Sansa (who struggles with the words but is prompted by Pod, he's a clever lad), a call-back to her oath to Lady Catlyn Stark. I went oh-oh, because this really sets up conflicting vows & loyalities for Brienne, if and when she meets up with Jaime (the man she loves, snif, sob).

Oh, and the disappearing hounds? I watched the episode twice and never noticed it, it was only when I got on the interwebs that I realised it's a thing. Call me inattentive. :-D

The rest of the North storyline, i.e. the Boltons. Aww, Ramsay's having a human emotion moment. My girlfriend didn't fear me like everybody else because she smelled of dogs and shared my liking for blood sports. "She's good meat. Feed her to the dogs." It's what Myranda would've wanted, really.

Daddy Bolton isn't too pleased about his son's actions, "playing his games" and losing Sansa. Thank the gods, Lady Walda is probably carrying a son. OK, Roose just signed his own and Fat Walda's death warrant.

Roose is so cool and calculating but he has a blind spot when it comes to Ramsay. Without getting too deep into the books but Roose is the more dangerous one and more than likely to take out Ramsay, the show seems to have reveresed this. For one, show Ramsay is a lot more skilled and intelligent than the cartoonish, stupid psychopath in the books. I'll wait and see.

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To go on geogrphically on S6EP1, next we come to King's Landing.

OK, a caveat here. I try to keep the show and books separate but I find it really hard when it comes to my favourite, complex book character Jaime. In the books he's already ditched Cersei... And in the show we get Jaime still in thrall to her.

Maybe seasons 4 and 5 he was just in a holding pattern, waiting for the stories to catch up. We saw some deteriation of J&C relationship, but then strange reconciliations and... it's all just a mess. Well, break-ups can be messy, but the show isn't yet really doing a break-up. If they don't do it this season, I'll... make futile internet threats or something!

I like that the show has made Cersei a bit more three-dimensional than the cartoon villain she is in the books (and Lena Heady is excellent in her portrayal as D&D have written her) but... It kind of leaves poor Jaime holding the can of the "bad" Lannister. Because show Tyrion is also a "good guy". In the books, my reading is that they're all grey but Cersei is the blackest, Tyrion is quite grey and Jaime is actually the lightest grey, an idealist and a romatic at heart, despite everything, and especially after he met Brienne and lost his hand.

So, how to take the Jaime & Cersei scene in this episode? Trying to forget book stuff and just focus on show stuff. It still jarred that Cersei would admit any fault in herself. OK, I can understand we were wanted to show a moment of vulnerability, and where Jaime's response came from. He still loves Cersei, he's just brought her daughter's dead body home, he wants to comfort Cersei and say whatever he thinks she wants to hear. Vengeance etc... Saying things before really thinking them through. A recent EW interview with NCW confirmes this. But Jaime will soon learn the mess the Lannister hegemony is in (mostly thanks to Cersei), and he might take his own path.

Oh, and Cersei morbidly imagining their mother's and Myrcella's bodies rotting... Does anybody else think this is foreshadowing for Cersei giving Myrcella to Qyburn? There was that leaked set photo, seemingly from Qyburn's lab, where Cersei looked triumphant and Jaime very unhappy and disturbed, and NCW has said in an interview that Jaime gets disturbed by what Cersei does.

Where's Bronn? He probably went off to a brothel of something. He's a sellsword, not someone you'd take with you to meet the queen mother. Though, to make sense of other things that happened in last season's last episode and this season's first episode... Bronn was there with Jaime to tell him about that poison and the antidote, so Jaime would know it was Ellaria/Sand Snakes who poiseoned Myrcella.

It wasn't crystal clear in the show that Jaime does not blame Trystane in any way for Myrcella's death, he mostly suspects Ellaria and the Sand Snakes, and keeps Trystane on the ship and intends to send him back for his (Trystane's) safety because he fears Cersei would summarily kill him. The message Prince Doran got about Myrcella's death actually came from Jaime. A dipomatic message urging caution and peace, Jaime being thinking and diplomatic (a bit like he was in the Riverlands in AFFC). http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/objects-from-dorne None of this made the show, they're just explaining afterwards. (My personal nit-pick is: who wrote it for Jaime? Ellaria made a point late in season 5 to say that Jaime writes like a six-year-old with his left hand and we got a glimpse of large, clumsy, sprawing writing with the lines going up and down, a mess. The prop letter we're shown has very neat handwriting, so Jaime couldn't have written it himself, physically. And I don't think Bronn knows how to read and write.)

Sorry, a long post again, and I haven't even got to Dorne! :-D

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To continue my geographical recap/musings on S6EP1, we now come to Dorne.

Dorne, Dorne, Dorne... Not my favourite in the books either but... OK, I'll start with the positive. I really like the visual aesthetic of Dorne on the show. The costumes, the architecture (the amazing Alcazar with its amazing azulejos they got to film in), the lighting in Belfast studios. It all really takes you to this southern part of Westeros, kind of moorish Spanish. Such a shame that the writing and acting has been so bad.

Some of this, I lay the blame at GRRM's door. (f)Aegon and possible Dornish alliance seems like an afterthought, a vehicle to provide a war in the south for the Lannister/Tyrell alliance. The show has brutally cut corners. No (f)Aegon (or Quentyn), so Ellaria's coup t'etat makes show sense, sparks a war in the south against the Lannisters. We might even be getting some Ironborn warring in the Reach now that the Ironborn and Euron are back. The Dornish might even be possible allies to Dany if she ever gets her arse over to Westeros.
So, yeah, I see some logic to it. D&D had to keep Dorne because it's important in the end game. But cutting (the ultimately pointless) (f)Aegon cut a lot of the Dornish storylines and intrigue elements and we were given a holding pattern (with Jaime&Bronn bro roadtrip thrown in). We're left with a seemingly ineffectual but maybe deeper playing ruler and his awesome bodyguard. Oh. Were left with with moronic, vengeful Ellaria and the Sand Snakes.

One thing that really jarred with me on first/second watch was how easily Tyene killed Areo Hotah. This little girl stuck her little knife in the back of this big, tall, muscular guy... and he just drops? Wait, what? While Ellaria stabs weak, ailing Doran in the heart, and he lives on to deliver several more lines. Since then, people on the internet have rationalised that Tyene stabbed Areo Hotah's spine and paralysed him, fair enough.

I liked how they showed the impassivity of the Dornish guards. They were with Ellaria and her coup.

Ah, and the rest of the Dornish coup. OK, I totally got that Trystane was staying on the ship, the one he and Myrcella's body and Jaime and Bronn sailed to KL on, because Jaime wasn't blaming him (or Prince Doran) for Myrcella's death (and the picture of the letter Jaime wrote to Doran, shown on the HBO Making of GoT site confirms this http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/objects-from-dorne ) and Jaime knows Trystane isn't safe, Cersei would have him killed on the spot, and he is actually trying to have some sort of a peaceful resolution... untill he tells Cersei what he thinks she wants to hear.

Anyway, Ob and Nym appearing on the boat in KL. I was a bit wait, what? How did they get there to deliver their cheesy lines and kill dumb Trystane? OK, so may be they jumped on the next boat, and Trystane's boat's guards wouldn't have stopped them, they're the prince's cousins, Prince Doran's nieces. OK. Still, not a very elegant piece of screen-writing. (I mean, couldn't they have show a 2-3 second shot of another ship trailing Trystane's/Jaime's?)

Apparently two Sand Snakes are now in KL but I can't see them taking up any positions in the King's Small Council, Ellaria has staged a coup in Dorne and wants to go to war against that Lannisters... I just don't know where this mess is going. They seem like natural allies to Dany but they can't spend their power now, before Dany gets to Westeros - and she won't this season.

 

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OK, we can now move to Essos, and let's start with Braavos.

What I really, really liked about Blind Beth's (Arya's) scene was how the ambient sound was turned up. She's hearing things. Street sounds and snatches of conversation from passers-by. "... did you hear what happened to that kingsguard..."

The Waif comes to train her, and I'm pretty meh about it. Maybe it's an Essosi curse, every character on that continent gets their story slowed down and made boring.

Because Meereen... Tyrion's and Varys's banter wasn't up to their usual standard. We got a walking montage of the problems. Lame baby-eating joke, which demonstrated that Tyrion needs Varys and his skills. Some English graffiti spelling out one of the problems. A red priest demonstrating another problem. Oh, and a Harpy looking at them from the shadows. And finally the 93 ships captured by Daario last season (which enraged book-readers) burned, so "We won't be sailing to Westeros anytime soon." AAAARGH! Just get Yara (taking over Victarion's role) and the Iron Fleet there, soon, please!

Jorah and Daario roadtrip. I quite liked it. Daario needling Jorah about unrequited love and how he wishes to be a romantic like Jorah when he gets old like Jorah. Ouch. He's such a dick. A loveable one but still a dick. Jorah, in contrast, is a man with a mission.

Now, let me explain how Jorah found Dany's ring. First they followed the general direction that the dragon flew. They might've even got reports from peasants to guide them. They find dragon leavings, so they know they're on the right track. They find trampled ground, a circle left by a Dothraki horde (Jorah knows a lot about the Dothraki). Jorah goes to investigate the centre of the circle left by the Dothraki horde, quite a small area. Maybe the sun glinted off the ring. Jorah knows she was there, and knowing Dothraki customs, makes an informed guess where they might've gone next.

Some silly people on the interwebby insist that the horses would've messed the circle when the Dothraki left. Assuming that the Dothraki somehow stopped riding around in a circle and just cut straight across to get from A to B. Those people have obviously never ridden a horse. It's far more instinctive and easier to ride along the circumference and "drop off" at any point you want to go, not stall and turn your horse suddenly to make the shortest A to B.

Dany with the Dothraki... I liked the Dothraki scenes. First the warriors bantering and Dany not letting on that she speaks fairly fluent Dothraki because she's learned some politics. The scene in Khal Moro's awning, loved it. The jealous wives. "Take off her head" "It is known". The chillaxed bloodriders... and the FIVE best things in life, lol. I was screaming with laughter, it's the Monty Python Spanish Inquisition thing all over again! (Later, on interwebby, I discovered many thought it was MP's Life of Brian "What have the Romans ever done for us?" or Terry Pratchett Cohan the Barbarian - but both of those spring from the original Spanish Inquisition skit.)

Some people don't like it that the Dothraki were "reduced" to frat boy humour and Monty Python references, but I loved it. They're not just monosyllabilc savages, they have personalities and senses of humour. But Khal Moro is a traditionalist. Howevermuch he might've desired one of the five best things in life, it is his duty to escort Dany back to Vaes Dothrak to join the Dosh Khaleen. He's a bit of a knight.

OK, so Dany got out of trouble ridiculously easily one more time. I mean, Jon Snow has to DIE to get ANYTHING, not even half of what Dany has, how fair is that! haha!

Really looking forward to next week's episode!

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Thank you talvikorpii! I love reading people's analyses of the show, and yours is one of the most in depth I've seen so far. I agree with most everything you've said and you pointed out a few things I didn't know/didn't think about.

Thank you again! :D

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7 hours ago, talvikorppi said:

Now, let me explain how Jorah found Dany's ring. First they followed the general direction that the dragon flew. They might've even got reports from peasants to guide them. They find dragon leavings, so they know they're on the right track. They find trampled ground, a circle left by a Dothraki horde (Jorah knows a lot about the Dothraki). Jorah goes to investigate the centre of the circle left by the Dothraki horde, quite a small area. Maybe the sun glinted off the ring. Jorah knows she was there, and knowing Dothraki customs, makes an informed guess where they might've gone next.

Some silly people on the interwebby insist that the horses would've messed the circle when the Dothraki left. Assuming that the Dothraki somehow stopped riding around in a circle and just cut straight across to get from A to B. Those people have obviously never ridden a horse. It's far more instinctive and easier to ride along the circumference and "drop off" at any point you want to go, not stall and turn your horse suddenly to make the shortest A to B.

I am only going to comment on this part because I don't even bother to address everything unbelieable farfetched anymore since people stay with their opinion anyway even though I don't see why.

A dragon can maybe fly about 100 miles an hour (Very rough guess. One of the only real tidbits in the books is "Uncle and niece began to fly together almost daily, racing Syrax against Caraxes to Dragonstone and back". One way trip is about 350 miles. I don't think it would be fun the race like 12+ hours daily. So 100 mph seems about right. He was wounded so the numbers are probably quite smaller but it doesn't even matter much.

The Dothraki Sea is about the size of Westeros. I doubt there are that many if any "peasants" in the middle of nowhere. Also why would anyone stare at the sky all day long? Is the dragon only flying near ground level? Why you pay that much attention to what direction exactly a shape in the sky was going? Especially if you don't have any anchor points on the horizon. As everything is just green?The dragon is not going to fly a straight line. The charred corpse Jorah somehow (LOL) found might be in the direct opposite direction of where he was headed. Now you found a clue but are going completly wrong way. When do you go circle back? How much food does a dragon need? He can surely survive a few hours of flight. How can anyone honestly believe you can track a dragon (when we cannot even track a plane with satellites)

To the crop circle. The problem is not that there is a visible spot in the middle but that that spot is preserved perfectly. You are right a single horse / rider might avoid going through it but just the sheer number of riders do make it a neccessity that some go through it. Now your ring is trampled into the ground and probably even harder to find. Or are they just going to do their ridiculous circling performance again when they head home? 

If you look at the circle. It is actually not that small at all. Atleast a few metres in diameter with ankle high grass. Ever lost something in such conditions? Even if you stand directly above it you might not find it without brushing through the grass. Now watch the scene again if you can. Jorah enters the circle at the edge as the trampled part is clearly only a few feet away. He looks a bit into nothing then down and immediately finds the ring. He is not actively looking for anything. He just happened to stand exactly above it. You might argue that he would look for clues as he knows something weird was going on but that is that what happened in the scene. This is just one of many examples where absolutely lazy writing takes me out of the immersion. It would have taken a few seconds to include a scene where he is scanning the inner circle and going through the grass but why make it plausible when it was obvious that he would find it because he is a master tracker (why anyway?) 

 

Edited by flare
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1 hour ago, flare said:

I am only going to comment on this part because I don't even bother to address everything unbelieable farfetched anymore since people stay with their opinion anyway even though I don't see why. /snip

You're putting way to much thought in this. Yes it's odd that they find the circle & the ring, but what would you rather have? Scenes of Jorah & Daario not finding anything? They come back to Tyrion & co and just say: Yeah we've been away for days and found nothing.. Oh btw the ships are gone, a what a bummer.

Don't freaking overthink every single thing. Just assume they saw the dragon fly in a general direction and followed that. With some help/luck they found the dragon.

Oh, and a small remark: Comparing it to planes is stupid. Planes make huge turns (because of taking off & landing) and follow fly routes, where the dragon most likely did fly straight to his lair. 

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5 hours ago, Attitude said:

You're putting way to much thought in this. Yes it's odd that they find the circle & the ring, but what would you rather have? Scenes of Jorah & Daario not finding anything? They come back to Tyrion & co and just say: Yeah we've been away for days and found nothing.. Oh btw the ships are gone, a what a bummer.

Don't freaking overthink every single thing. Just assume they saw the dragon fly in a general direction and followed that. With some help/luck they found the dragon.

Oh, and a small remark: Comparing it to planes is stupid. Planes make huge turns (because of taking off & landing) and follow fly routes, where the dragon most likely did fly straight to his lair. 

There are plenty of things they could have done other than finding the leaf of lorien out in the middle of nowhere.

There could be no ring and they continue to track based on Drogon's ranging.  They simply put 2+2 together that they find Drogon's leavings and evidence of a Dothraki horde and decide to follow the horde since Jorah is known and respected by the Dothraki and speaks their language.  There is absolutley no need to purposely put in a totally implausible plot point like that and then make it worse since he finds the ring in less than a minute where he happens to literally be standing next to it.

Jorah would also know if they find Dany they're going to take her to Vaes Dothrak because he is familiar with the culture.

The ring is nothing more than another glaring red flag about the level of hackery on the show now.

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The circle made by the dothraki riders would remain even if a few horses cut across. So it would still be possible to find the center.

As for tracking down Drogon, his lair is one of the very few high points in the Dothraki sea. Even if that wasn't his lair, it would be the obvious place to look.

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35 minutes ago, hallam said:

The circle made by the dothraki riders would remain even if a few horses cut across. So it would still be possible to find the center.

As for tracking down Drogon, his lair is one of the very few high points in the Dothraki sea. Even if that wasn't his lair, it would be the obvious place to look.

Actually, we don't know if it was in the Dothraki Sea. I tend to think it was somewhere nearer Meereen (where there would've been shepherds/peasants). Dany got intercepted by Dothraki raiding beyond the Dothraki Sea. They found a Khaleesi, and Khal Moro - the traditionalist and stickler for rules and honour etc. that he is, sees it as his duty to escort Dany to Vaes Dothrak.

Yes, Jorah finding that ring so easily is a bit cheesy but it didn't ruin the story for me. I tend to suspend my disbelief quite a lot when reading or watching fiction. I mean, I buy dragons, being able to track Dany is small fry compared to that. The cheesy ring was a confirmation that Dany was there, leading to Jorah's deduction that she'd be taken to Vaes Dothrak. I mean, if the ring wasn't there, Jorah would've seen some Dothraki horde evidence but no way of connecting it with Dany, right?

Edited by talvikorppi
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On 4/28/2016 at 7:22 PM, talvikorppi said:

To continue my geographical recap/musings on S6EP1, we now come to Dorne.

Dorne, Dorne, Dorne... Not my favourite in the books either but... OK, I'll start with the positive. I really like the visual aesthetic of Dorne on the show. The costumes, the architecture (the amazing Alcazar with its amazing azulejos they got to film in), the lighting in Belfast studios. It all really takes you to this southern part of Westeros, kind of moorish Spanish. Such a shame that the writing and acting has been so bad.

Some of this, I lay the blame at GRRM's door. (f)Aegon and possible Dornish alliance seems like an afterthought, a vehicle to provide a war in the south for the Lannister/Tyrell alliance. The show has brutally cut corners. No (f)Aegon (or Quentyn), so Ellaria's coup t'etat makes show sense, sparks a war in the south against the Lannisters. We might even be getting some Ironborn warring in the Reach now that the Ironborn and Euron are back. The Dornish might even be possible allies to Dany if she ever gets her arse over to Westeros.
So, yeah, I see some logic to it. D&D had to keep Dorne because it's important in the end game. But cutting (the ultimately pointless) (f)Aegon cut a lot of the Dornish storylines and intrigue elements and we were given a holding pattern (with Jaime&Bronn bro roadtrip thrown in). We're left with a seemingly ineffectual but maybe deeper playing ruler and his awesome bodyguard. Oh. Were left with with moronic, vengeful Ellaria and the Sand Snakes.

One thing that really jarred with me on first/second watch was how easily Tyene killed Areo Hotah. This little girl stuck her little knife in the back of this big, tall, muscular guy... and he just drops? Wait, what? While Ellaria stabs weak, ailing Doran in the heart, and he lives on to deliver several more lines. Since then, people on the internet have rationalised that Tyene stabbed Areo Hotah's spine and paralysed him, fair enough.

I liked how they showed the impassivity of the Dornish guards. They were with Ellaria and her coup.

Ah, and the rest of the Dornish coup. OK, I totally got that Trystane was staying on the ship, the one he and Myrcella's body and Jaime and Bronn sailed to KL on, because Jaime wasn't blaming him (or Prince Doran) for Myrcella's death (and the picture of the letter Jaime wrote to Doran, shown on the HBO Making of GoT site confirms this http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/objects-from-dorne ) and Jaime knows Trystane isn't safe, Cersei would have him killed on the spot, and he is actually trying to have some sort of a peaceful resolution... untill he tells Cersei what he thinks she wants to hear.

Anyway, Ob and Nym appearing on the boat in KL. I was a bit wait, what? How did they get there to deliver their cheesy lines and kill dumb Trystane? OK, so may be they jumped on the next boat, and Trystane's boat's guards wouldn't have stopped them, they're the prince's cousins, Prince Doran's nieces. OK. Still, not a very elegant piece of screen-writing. (I mean, couldn't they have show a 2-3 second shot of another ship trailing Trystane's/Jaime's?)

Apparently two Sand Snakes are now in KL but I can't see them taking up any positions in the King's Small Council, Ellaria has staged a coup in Dorne and wants to go to war against that Lannisters... I just don't know where this mess is going. They seem like natural allies to Dany but they can't spend their power now, before Dany gets to Westeros - and she won't this season.

 

Wow! Thanks for sharing that.  So cool we get to see that letter!:D

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38 minutes ago, Visenya the Dragon said:

Wow! Thanks for sharing that.  So cool we get to see that letter!:D

The problem I have is that we have to resort to extra-show stuff like the letter depicted in my link. The show should've made all that clear as it ran.

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2 hours ago, Travis said:

I don't think she's pregnant. Do you mean in her face? I think makeup just wanted her to look more tired and older after her walk of shame. That would be crazy, though.

They keep showing her waist and it looks like she could be a couple months pregnant. I really see it in th still pics of her. I could be wrong.  She has not been able to get moon tea being in the cell. 

I wished I knew how to link the pics.

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5 hours ago, talvikorppi said:

The problem I have is that we have to resort to extra-show stuff like the letter depicted in my link. The show should've made all that clear as it ran.

I agree. People like my sister who only watch the show only would never know this. And that's a bummer. Reading that letter let's us know Jamie does not want to be involved in hurting the innocent. 

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Well I gotta get his off my chest.

 

Something needs to be done about Dorne. I really hope this little coup starts Dorne plot line to be connected on screen with some other plot. It's quite clear with how little time they have to actually portray Dorne, nothing will ever be satisfying. This is not a book reader issue, but forever one. Very little of dorm has anything to do with any other plot line. In the books, plot lines that don't converge much is not a problem, but in a tv series it is. I'm hoping that Dorne plot line aligns with the high septon. 

 

With that said, I like their spin with Jon. For someone who believes in the theory, it's clear what they are trying to do but for my friends who haven't read the book, they haven't really caught on. 

Arya is still a pretty good story line. 

I'm not too excited for Sansa and Theon. I feel like their story will have to converge with Jon or end. It's weird but where does their story end? Is she to take winter fell because of that little hint we got in season 4? In the books the path seemed quite different and painted her as a more powerful figure

im very excited for what is going on in Kings landing. Sparrow vs the King! This is one plot that the series have done much better than the books 

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4 minutes ago, Visenya the Dragon said:

I did not know that. Oops. She is still beautiful and evil. 

I would think they would avoid showing her waist to not confuse us viewer's 

I wasn't confused at all. I didn't notice anything. They're not going to 'avoid showing her waist' because a few people will be confused. Very few people would even notice it.

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