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1 hour ago, Rhoynar said:

Didn't anyone else think Ramsay's mourning over Miranda's death was very off-character? Come on, he's a total psychopath, he would be mad at someone daring to kill his plaything but he wouldn't be all sad and teary.

Not particularly. He was quickly bought back with the 'Feed her to the dogs' line 

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At the end of the Dorne debacle in the premiere we are left with highly anti-Lannister rebels ruling Dorne. What would it mean for the future? I've seen people theorizing that Dorne will back Dany (in the show). But Dany is clearly going to be on the same side as Tyrion. With this much stupid revenge done by Sand snakes, I an inclined to think the Dornish will try/succeed in killing Dany after she reaches Westeros, because the new Dornish motto is that everyone who cooperates with Lannisters must be killed.

When I read the books, the character I wanted most to lose was Euron. In the show however, I hope he wins. He is the king D&D's Westeros deserves.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Hos the Hostage said:

At the end of the Dorne debacle in the premiere we are left with highly anti-Lannister rebels ruling Dorne. What would it mean for the future? I've seen people theorizing that Dorne will back Dany (in the show). But Dany is clearly going to be on the same side as Tyrion. With this much stupid revenge done by Sand snakes, I an inclined to think the Dornish will try/succeed in killing Dany after she reaches Westeros, because the new Dornish motto is that everyone who cooperates with Lannisters must be killed.

When I read the books, the character I wanted most to lose was Euron. In the show however, I hope he wins. He is the king D&D's Westeros deserves.

 

 

Look at it this way:

Dorne is going to revolt against the Lannisters. On the books, this will be done through the Aegon-Arianne marriage. With no Aegon on the Show, D&D needed to come up with some other way to make this happen. 

This is the way they chose. If you ask me, it's plainly wrong, but they did it anyways.

As soon as D&D realized there was no screentime left for Aegon (and the fact that he is NOT going to win on the books), they should have cut out Dorne. Make Cersei and the Lannisters (and KL) fall some other way

Edited by Ingelheim

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15 hours ago, robasp2 said:

Og I predicted Brienne will save Sansa JUST IN TIME long ago.

Now from the trailers we have Thorne tearing fown the door. And we will see the wildlings arrive with Edd JUST IN TIME...

D&D are too predictable. The show has lost its thrill.

^^ Agree. This "just in time" stuff is easy to spot miles off in the show.

13 hours ago, The Dames do Moan said:

Yeah, idk, they made it a point to show that Sansa had to look at Theon and get his ok before telling Brienne she would accept her.

Sansa getting Theon's OK was not empowering for the character. That she accepted an unknown woman, one who is carrying a Lannister sword and is with Podrick Payne, Tryion's squire, that should mean something to her. She should wonder about Brienne's allegiance. The Hound wondered - and it led to Arya wondering, rightly so. Brienne's allegiance will be called into question. That's a given for me. And I'm pretty certain she won't be choosing the Stark (or Sansa's) side in the future. To her regret, of course.

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41 minutes ago, Karmarni said:

^^ Agree. This "just in time" stuff is easy to spot miles off in the show.

Sansa getting Theon's OK was not empowering for the character. That she accepted an unknown woman, one who is carrying a Lannister sword and is with Podrick Payne, Tryion's squire, that should mean something to her. She should wonder about Brienne's allegiance. The Hound wondered - and it led to Arya wondering, rightly so. Brienne's allegiance will be called into question. That's a given for me. And I'm pretty certain she won't be choosing the Stark (or Sansa's) side in the future. To her regret, of course.

I'm confused as to what your saying. I mean I understand that you think Brienne's allegiance will be called into question and she'll not choose the Starks /Sansa.

Thinking that though wouldn't affect how empowered Sanda was or wasn't. Her ability to make a decision, feel like she has the right to make that decision and control her own future is what makes her empowered. If u think Brienne's going to switch allegiance, betray Sansa then that is just poor decision making by her.

I don't agree that she'll betray her but of course you could be right, we don't know what's going to happen yet. I'm interested to know who you think she'll betray Sansa for and how and/ or why? Just the situation around the betrayal?

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I am hoping the changes in Dorne with Ellaria in charge could mean things will get shaken up a bit and see more exciting events happening in the Dorne story lines. If Dorne goes to war against the Iron Throne, not only would it cause trouble of Cersei, always a plus,  could it  mean we might see some of the Marcher Lords, Highgarden, and maybe a Dayne or two in the future? It could change Sam's plans to study in Oldtown..  Does Ellaria want Dorne to break off from the 7 kingdoms, revenge, or does she have bigger ambitions.

 Ellaria seems to have had a personality change with what happened to Oberyn. She is a wild card and her people seem to be behind her, we may get to see the Dornish people act more like the Dornish peoples we have heard about. 

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I have mixed feelings, but for the most part I didn't care for it. 

Dorne - You don't have a bad-ass like Aero get sucker-stabbed by a sandsnake.  It was almost as bad as what they did to Barristan.  And IF you have to kill off Doran you at least let him have his grass/viper speech.

Castle Black - Since when does Thorne inspire people?! 

Winterfell - I do like how they made us cringe with Sansa's escape.  I was afraid she would be taken back to Ramsey.  And I like how Brienne rescued her and swore her oath.  But I dislike that she was in that place to begin with, LF wouldn't sell her to the likes of Ramsey.  He's too well-informed to not know what kind of monster Ramsey was and Sansa is his prize, Cat reborn in his eyes. 

Myrcella - WTF?!  Trystan was supposed to go to KL to take his seat on the council.  Why wasn't he on the ship with Jaime?!

Dany - I have a hard time beliving that no one realized that Dany was Drogo's khalessi.  She sticks out like a sore thumb amongst the Dothraki, someone would have noticed.

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I really didn't enjoy the episode that much. I'd say it's a forgettable episode, but it's not since it's the worst episode in the show. Too many unbelievable things happened or contradictions. Lots of screw ups this episode. 

 

 

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On ‎4‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 11:11 PM, Good Guy Garlan said:

Obara probably monologued her way into the ship. Just...shaking my head. But this is par for the course with Dorne, and it highlights the lack of connection between D&D and their audience. I mean, after the widespread criticism of the Sand Snakes and Ellaria, D&D choose to...give us an extra serving? Guess that's one way to tell the critics to fuck off, but I don't even know...like, why? 

Maybe they flashed their breasts and the guards were mesmerized into submission-- just as D&D expect their audience to be with their crude dialogue.  And we're just supposed to believe that Jaime and Bronn magnanimously left Trystane to his own devices to potter around painting stones on the ship by himself after Myrcella had just died in suspicious circumstances.  Perhaps they were cowed by the Dornishmen who outnumbered them, although we were also expected to buy that Bronn and Jaime on foot with the three hands between them took out four mounted Dornish guards in the dunes. 

Last season they gave us 'bad pussy' for which they were thoroughly lambasted, so in response this season they give us an extra serving of leering sneering 'greedy bitch' and periodically lapse into a self-conscious parody of Monty Python (I'm thinking of the '5 best things' Dothraki debate, Davos's 'I want some mootin,' and Tyrion's silly non-joke 'you're not a boy because you don't have a cock'; let's all wince along with Varys...).  

Over at the 'watchers on the wall' site it's curious how there's a not-so-subtle peer pressure to be 'positive'...'  Cue Monty Python refrain: 'Always look on the bright side of life!'  It's amazing how motivated they are, bending over backwards to fill in D&D's gaping plot holes and justify their whimsical character assassinations.  Any criticism of D&D's writing is condemned as evidence of how 'spoiled' and ungrateful the fandom has become.  On the contrary, I would posit it's the opposite:  D&D are the spoiled ones.  The series is so wildly successful, they know that no matter what they do or write we're still going to be here hanging on their every (even if it is badly-written) word, and the ratings, money and accolades will keep pouring in. 

Does that answer your question as to 'why?'  Perhaps the question we ought to be asking is 'why not?'  People (I include myself in this number) are not going to stop watching, so why not push the envelope of bad writing and see what happens, or doesn't!  It's a good thing Dinklage has two Emmys under his belt, or they'd get rid of him just to shock/spite us.  But they know he's gold in the bank, so Tyrion is safe.  He will survive those dragons!

I also expect them to draw out Jon's fate over several episodes, milk it for all it's worth until the milk is sour on the tongue and curdles in the stomach. 

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I can't believe so many people get butt hurt over characters dying. OMG Areo is dead, killed by a girl no less!!! Funny, last time I read the books the Sand Snakes were fearsome and known killers. So a guard unexpectedly got killed by one, big deal.

This is the television adaptation, in this adaptation Areo was never built up to be anything special and he died exactly like that, nothing special, killed by the people we have been shown are special at killing.

If you want to have expansive details on every person, every place, every piece of food, read the books. You cannot expect to get that kind of depth or detail in a tv series from 1000 page books, just can't do it. It has taken GRRM years and years just to write one book, in tv you don't have that luxury.

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31 minutes ago, dbunting said:

I can't believe so many people get butt hurt over characters dying. OMG Areo is dead, killed by a girl no less!!! Funny, last time I read the books the Sand Snakes were fearsome and known killers. So a guard unexpectedly got killed by one, big deal.

This is the television adaptation, in this adaptation Areo was never built up to be anything special and he died exactly like that, nothing special, killed by the people we have been shown are special at killing.

If you want to have expansive details on every person, every place, every piece of food, read the books. You cannot expect to get that kind of depth or detail in a tv series from 1000 page books, just can't do it. It has taken GRRM years and years just to write one book, in tv you don't have that luxury.

Not "butt hurt", disappointed.  I would say him putting his weapon at Jaime's throat and saying "it would have been a great contest if Jaime was still whole" sets Areo up as being an excellent fighter.  And isn't this the place to air those likes and dislikes? 

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I liked it. Was super happy to get some decent series after the long wait. Could have been more action, Kings Landin was kinda boring.

I like the new direction Dorne is taking, lil bit makes up for suffering thru Dorne last season.

Liked the Mel scene. I believe she wanted to wipe out the Baratheon line and was succesful now. No clue as to what her real plan is yet. Going to be interesting.

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Well,since I don`t have HBO ,I didn`t watch the show.Curiousity demanded reading this thread and I feel like I didn`t miss much,lol.The show and the books are now two different stories,and the books are WAY better.The show means nothing now,it bears only slight resemblance to the books.Enjoy both,but they are not the same.

 

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3 hours ago, ravenous reader said:

 

Maybe they flashed their breasts and the guards were mesmerized into submission-- just as D&D expect their audience to be with their crude dialogue.  And we're just supposed to believe that Jaime and Bronn magnanimously left Trystane to his own devices to potter around painting stones on the ship by himself after Myrcella had just died in suspicious circumstances.  Perhaps they were cowed by the Dornishmen who outnumbered them, although we were also expected to buy that Bronn and Jaime on foot with the three hands between them took out four mounted Dornish guards in the dunes. 

Last season they gave us 'bad pussy' for which they were thoroughly lambasted, so in response this season they give us an extra serving of leering sneering 'greedy bitch' and periodically lapse into a self-conscious parody of Monty Python (I'm thinking of the '5 best things' Dothraki debate, Davos's 'I want some mootin,' and Tyrion's silly non-joke 'you're not a boy because you don't have a cock'; let's all wince along with Varys...).  

Over at the 'watchers on the wall' site it's curious how there's a not-so-subtle peer pressure to be 'positive'...'  Cue Monty Python refrain: 'Always look on the bright side of life!'  It's amazing how motivated they are, bending over backwards to fill in D&D's gaping plot holes and justify their whimsical character assassinations.  Any criticism of D&D's writing is condemned as evidence of how 'spoiled' and ungrateful the fandom has become.  On the contrary, I would posit it's the opposite:  D&D are the spoiled ones.  The series is so wildly successful, they know that no matter what they do or write we're still going to be here hanging on their every (even if it is badly-written) word, and the ratings, money and accolades will keep pouring in. 

Does that answer your question as to 'why?'  Perhaps the question we ought to be asking is 'why not?'  People (I include myself in this number) are not going to stop watching, so why not push the envelope of bad writing and see what happens, or doesn't!  It's a good thing Dinklage has two Emmys under his belt, or they'd get rid of him just to shock/spite us.  But they know he's gold in the bank, so Tyrion is safe.  He will survive those dragons!

I also expect them to draw out Jon's fate over several episodes, milk it for all it's worth until the milk is sour on the tongue and curdles in the stomach. 

Agreed.  Kudos to Elio and Linda for being honest enough to give the show its just criticism and not censoring or even trying to strong-arm people with dissenting opinions.

I started as a show-watcher, then picked up the books.  I enjoy both and have no problem with the show diverging, it's the manner in which they do it and the writing they give to 'altered' storylines.  

No problem with Hotah dying, but like that?  It seems rather nonchalant, as if he's no better than a Lannister arms-man or some random Wildling.  Why bother casting him to do 'that'?  Couldn't any extra have done the same?  Nod a few times, say a line or two... boom, done, how much $ did we save for 'what matters'?  Doran dying... no problem, but in that manner suggests he's completely ignorant to his brother's paramour's volatility and capability... RIGHT after she disrespects him in trying to kidnap/murder Myrcella, much less what she said to his face.  It doesn't follow logic and makes these folks who are leaders, powerful leaders in their own right, seem no wiser or aware than the average peasant slaughtered by Gregor and his henchmen.

The show can and more importantly HAS done better.  

Yeah sure I'll watch, my HBO subscription isn't coming off the bill anytime soon, but when GRRM actually finishes... I doubt I'll be watching these seasons as much.  I appreciate many things they've done, their casting has been very good on the whole.  When I read now, I see Gwen Christie when I read Brienne, and Nicolai when I read Jaime... even their voices, same with Peter/Tyrion and so on... they've done many things well to be at the point they are with the show's popularity, it just makes one scratch their head in frustration when they allow their product to drop in quality.

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5 hours ago, Ingelheim said:

Look at it this way:

Dorne is going to revolt against the Lannisters. On the books, this will be done through the Aegon-Arianne marriage. With no Aegon on the Show, D&D needed to come up with some other way to make this happen. 

This is the way they chose. If you ask me, it's plainly wrong, but they did it anyways.

As soon as D&D realized there was no screentime left for Aegon (and the fact that he is NOT going to win on the books), they should have cut out Dorne. Make Cersei and the Lannisters (and KL) fall some other way

 

That's what I concluded after watching the episode. The Aegon storyline is going to happen without Aegon. Woopty doo...

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https://t.co/uwik45vdgx

 

Hi all! First post here! This picture of a screen grab of Jons bloodstain that I've cropped a little bit. It's takes a while of staring, but once you see it, I think it very clearly shows Ned standing above Lyanna. After staring at the bloodstain for literally hours, I think the entire thing is composed of dozens of images layered on top of each other. I could be wrong, but I don't think so! Let me know what y'all think!

https://t.co/Fu16Zw1iX4

this one is cropped in further on Ned's head because I feel this it's the easiest thing to pick out, and once you do, the rest becomes obvious 

Edited by Jsnow91

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On 4/25/2016 at 9:04 AM, hallam said:

That is what they will do now. I think that if there were only two seasons left, we would have had very little time for the Ironborn subplot. They killed the fake Aegon plot, I think the ironborn would have gone for much the same reason.

Clearly D&D have changed their minds and gone back and forth a number of times on this and a number of stories in their adaptation going from season to season. I imagine though after this season, their plan for the final 13 to 15 episodes is pretty locked up. We'll have a better idea once we see ho things play out this year.

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Random thoughts

I have disliked the acting and dialog of the sand snakes from the beginning. They seem like characatures. The book (I know the book and show are different) does a much better job of developing them. These are kind of like short amazons and Hotah deserved better!

I kind of see what you mean in the pictures of the snow, but I see something more like Dani on the right since the figure is all in white.

is this going to be the end of Mel? Who knows.... I have watched a video that makes a good argument for JS to return as a result of the funeral pyre - very compelling. 

Will sansa now be LSH? How does Baelish return since he was seen in the snow in the trailers? How will that all reconcile with the HUGE difference in the books for the Sansa arc?

as always, enjoy reading (most) of your comments and looking forward to any insights you have on my questions.  In the meantime, it's back to playing Game of Thrones Ascent!

 

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8 hours ago, DarkSister1001 said:

I have mixed feelings, but for the most part I didn't care for it. 

Dorne - You don't have a bad-ass like Aero get sucker-stabbed by a sandsnake.  It was almost as bad as what they did to Barristan.  And IF you have to kill off Doran you at least let him have his grass/viper speech.

Castle Black - Since when does Thorne inspire people?! 

Winterfell - I do like how they made us cringe with Sansa's escape.  I was afraid she would be taken back to Ramsey.  And I like how Brienne rescued her and swore her oath.  But I dislike that she was in that place to begin with, LF wouldn't sell her to the likes of Ramsey.  He's too well-informed to not know what kind of monster Ramsey was and Sansa is his prize, Cat reborn in his eyes. 

Myrcella - WTF?!  Trystan was supposed to go to KL to take his seat on the council.  Why wasn't he on the ship with Jaime?!

Dany - I have a hard time beliving that no one realized that Dany was Drogo's khalessi.  She sticks out like a sore thumb amongst the Dothraki, someone would have noticed.

Regarding Thorne, if my speculations from 2012 have been right, Thorne's speech is akin to that of Brutus' speech after the death of Caesar.  Thorne does not "inspire" with emotions - he merely gives the men his reasons for killing Snow.

It will be Tormund Giantsbane who will give the speech of Marc Antony's ilk - the one that stirs men's blood to mutiny and rage - and Tormund will "Cry Havoc - and let slip the dogs [direwolves] of war!"

I bet we hear that oration in Episode 2 or 3,

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