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rocksniffer

...and the women of Dorne get some get back...SPOILER?? OF COURSE

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1 hour ago, El Guapo said:

I think it is only fair that when the time comes Obara lets Nymeria kill Tommen.

 

 

Yeah, Obara needs to stop being a greedy fucking bitch, I for one, have had enough of it!

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38 minutes ago, RoamingRonin said:

This season has doubled-down on the Sand Snake debauchery. Why would anyone support a treacherous woman and her bastard as the true rulers of Dorne? How is she any different from the Lannisters?

Yeah this blew my mind in a negative way. WHY ARE THEY INVENTING THIS STORY THIS WAY. It's awful and makes so little sense. But I have to believe, unlike last season, there is a reason they are doubling down on this crap; by that I mean I have to think they are doing this story as a means to a relevant end.

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I just want to know how those two Sand Snakes got from the dock watching the ship sail away, to boarding it when it's anchored outside King's Landing. Or how Doran is so hated, and they're so popular that they can overthrow Dorne by killing three people, but had a hard time assassinating Myrcella last season.

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23 hours ago, Ruhail said:

Wonder if Sansa asks if what happened to stannis kek 

Hope so..

23 hours ago, Joan Jett said:

No need to wonder. You already know she won't 

SHe needs to tell Sansa! Then send Brieene to find Rickon:P

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Ellaria Sand is going to be the ruling princess of Dorne and lead them into the war against the crown.  Succession-wise that makes zero sense but I doubt that the show will care about that.  They're going to tell the story their way, whatever the cost.

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What irked me the most, Areo Hotah died to a light prick in the back. We saw gouty, old Doran stabbed right in the heart, with enough energy to talk and listen for a good minute before he passed. Hotah was stabbed with a small knife (in the shoulder blade, no less) and fell dead in an instant. That's not quite how dying works.

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Doran in the books: smart, consistently under-estimated yet actually knows exactly what is going on, lets people think that he's useless but is actually in complete control.

Doran in the show: stupid, naive, does not even control his guard.

Another male character ruined while they go out of their way to make Cersei and Cat Stark more likeable and relatable. .

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Ah...I didn't think it was true, but...AH...

This season's gonna suck.

(Warning: Rant incoming) I understand that adaptations are never 100% the same as their source material. Things have to adjusted, plot lines have to be streamlined and combined, unessential characters have to be cut, themes have to be condensed, and blah blah blah. Long story short, it's inevitable that things are going to change.

But a good adaption has to have changes that make sense.

So...in the books: The elder 4 Sand Snakes were chaotic and dangerous women feared throughout Dorne. So much so that Doran immediately has them put into custody to keep them from riling up Dorne into open aggression against the Iron Throne. But in Book 5, he releases them and convinces them to take part in his long-planned scheme to overthrow House Lannister. They initially don't believe him to be a worthy leader, but their minds are amended after they hear out their uncle and they vow to aid Doran in honor of the Late Oberyn whom was previously Doran's partner-in-crime.

So despite their lethal nature, the Sand Snakes are loyal to their family. Hell, they shared Oberyn's desire to attain justice for Elia and her children; they mourned their father and wanted revenge for him; and when they learn of Cersei's plan to kill Trystane, they are furious. I would also point out that they were good friends with the Crown Princess Arianne.

Ellaria herself gave a powerful and heartfelt speech about the cycle of revenge and how she wanted it to end before she lost someone else that she loved:

"Oberyn wanted vengeance for Elia. Now the three of you want vengeance for him. I have four daughters, I remind you. Your sisters. My Elia is fourteen, almost a woman. Obella is twelve, on the brink of maidenhood. They worship you, as Dorea and Loreza worship them. If you should die, must El and Obella seek vengeance for you, then Dorea and Loree for them? Is that how it goes, round and round forever? I ask again, where does it end? I saw your father die. Here is his killer. Can I take a skull to bed with me, to give me comfort in the night? Will it make me laugh, write me songs, care for me when I am old and sick?"

So with that in mind...explain to me how it makes sense for Ellaria and the Sand Snakes to murder both Doran and Trystane in cold blood? Season 5 was bad enough with Ellaria wanting vengeance by trying and eventually succeeding in murdering Mycella. But now she murders her beloved's brother and nephew out of spite? She's going to destabilize Dorne's government by killing its lord-paramount and his heir? Does she not realize that she's opened the door for a civil war now that dozens of other Dornish houses will see a chance to fill in the power vacuum?

I'd also like to point out that there's no logical way for Ellaria and the Sand Snakes to fill the power vacuum that they just created. Not only because they are women in a male-dominant society, but they're also bastards who stand outside of the line of inheritance unless legitimized and now, they're kinslayers (one of the worst crimes in Westerosi Society) who will garner hatred from the more honorable vassel houses loyal to House Martell. So yeah...these women just went full retard...

Oberyn Martell is spinning in his grave right now!

Nothing about this change makes any sense other than to be "shocking for the sake of shock." And if this is just a taste of what the rest of the season entails, then I'm out. I knew that things were going down hill from Season 5 onwards, but I never thought that it would get this bad...

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Love the direction with the Dorne characters. Myrcella, Tristane, Doran, Areo Hotah all taken out, looking forward to where that goes now and what revenge Cersei and Jaime will plot over Myrcella's death. I have a feeling I will enjoy Ellaria and the Sand Snakes to Doran's hand sitting procastination, good riddance to him!

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TV-Ellaria is long past the point of adding 2 + 2 to get a bloody, civil war-torn Dorne as 4.  I remember her speech in the books; it was heart-rending.  I don't recognize this Ellaria; and Oberyn surely would not either.  

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1 hour ago, RoamingRonin said:

This season has doubled-down on the Sand Snake debauchery. Why would anyone support a treacherous woman and her bastard as the true rulers of Dorne? How is she any different from the Lannisters?

Well, she's probably going to tell everyone that Jaime and Bronn did it. But she explained perfectly anyway, Doran is considered weak by a lot of the people. I think he even says so in the books. Remember Robert's speech in season 1:

"How long do the people of the Seven Kingdoms stand behind their absentee king, their cowardly king hiding behind high walls? When do the people decide that Viserys Targaryen is the rightful monarch after all?"

Could apply to Doran. Dorne is a place where Oberyn can use poison to cheat yet still be beloved. And it's a place where bastards aren't despised like the rest of Westeros.

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28 minutes ago, Apple the Great said:

Doran in the books: smart, consistently under-estimated yet actually knows exactly what is going on, lets people think that he's useless but is actually in complete control.

Doran in the show: stupid, naive, does not even control his guard.

Another male character ruined while they go out of their way to make Cersei and Cat Stark more likeable and relatable. .

The guy is an idiot who relied to heavily on luck and time. His entire plan is marry his kids to people, and that's it. And that's gone to hell. He's all talk and very little action.

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Screw this. After last season I did not expect any improvements on the Dorne part. What worries me, is that since show-Ellaria is a substitution for book-Arianne, it could mean that in the end Doran is going to get killed by his own daughter (of course, in a way that makes more sense than here). She would have the support of their people and be direct the new princess of Dorne and have the sandsnakes as her minions, who are also loved by folks. I can only hope for Darkstar somehow interfere with this possible plot. Anyway, I am quite sure that Doran is doomed in the books, too. 

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Madness, just madness . Ellaria and sandsnakes are suddenly murderers without hearts. Kills cousin while smiling.... But maybe the worst part was that Doran's guards did just watch him die. What's up with that shit? Less loyal and honorable than Boltons and Frey's to their own family. Dorne is now the Place with lowest moral in whole westeros. I hope that we still see some high born and low born that revenge the murder of their lord and son. May Ellaria's rule be short.

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Without Aegon to support... I just don't understand what Dorne's importance to the story is.

Unless they crown Ellaria (though I don't know how that would work) or one of the daughters, and they lead a full blown reckless attack on Kings Landing, leading Cersei to burn them all with wild fire. Then winter comes... And THEN, Dany can arrive, as her vision predicted, to an iron throne with the ceiling burnt and snow falling through.

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2 hours ago, Kyll.Ing. said:

What irked me the most, Areo Hotah died to a light prick in the back. We saw gouty, old Doran stabbed right in the heart, with enough energy to talk and listen for a good minute before he passed. Hotah was stabbed with a small knife (in the shoulder blade, no less) and fell dead in an instant. That's not quite how dying works.

Yeah Jon took a few to the gut and still managed to try and forgive Olly right at the last moment of his life, he cared for Olly that much, I just hope the show managed to portray how important Olly was to Jon and the nights watch 

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2 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

Love the direction with the Dorne characters. Myrcella, Tristane, Doran, Areo Hotah all taken out, looking forward to where that goes now and what revenge Cersei and Jaime will plot over Myrcella's death. I have a feeling I will enjoy Ellaria and the Sand Snakes to Doran's hand sitting procastination, good riddance to him!

How can anyone love this shit. That they made sand snakes and Ellaria more coldhearted than Boltons and Frey's. The fact that they made his own guards hate him makes me sick, Doran was loved By small folk.

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