Redeeming Dorne

[JonCon's Red Beard]

13 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

When as a viewer I find Cersei Lannister more sympathetic and likable than the Sand Snakes, you've done screwed that up. The only thing they can do to enrage more people is have them join Dany and enrage her fans as well.

It's Ramsay/Stannis all over... people actually root for anyone killing the Snakes, even Ramsay if possible.

[mirthula]

I have an idea about how they could redeem dorne. 

I was watching an old scene where Tyrion goes to receive Oberyn when he first arrives to KL, but instead Tyrion meets with the bannermen of house martell. So we know there are some powerful bannermen of house Martell that are in Dorne. 

What if Ellaria had this elaborate coup plan and she went to the other houses for support and told them how they should go to war against KL but Doran wont allow it as long as he rules so we have to dispose of him. The other houses agreed to her and told her they will support her coup but she has to kill off Doran and successor Trystane and then they will name her queen and go to war in her name. 

Now the houses meet to name her queen but they double cross her and arrest her instead. The other houses tell her they agreed to her stupid plan because they wanted to take over and she just made it easy for them, and they will never allow Dorne to be ruled by stupid kinslaying bitches like her and cut her throat and her bastard daughters are killed, assassins are dispatched to KL to eliminate the other two. Dorne is ruled now by another powerful family. 

Rule of Martell line bastard or not is over in Dorne. The happy end. 

 

[Ser Lepus]

On 27/4/2016 at 9:34 PM, Eilif said:

First one is they blame everything on Doran. This way the Sand Snakes can appear to be Mrycella’s avenging angels. I don’t think two of the Sand Snakes went the whole way to King’s Landing just to kill a single dude. If they claim the Dornish seat on the small council they will learn who the movers and shakers are in the capital and get the access they need to avenge their father. While they maybe be able to convince Cercei, I don’t think that if Jaime stays around they will be able to convince them of their “good” intent. Unless they say that they were trying to kidnap Mrycella to save her form the Martell’s.

No way they can pull that. Jamie is back to KL, and he saw the Sand Snakes trying to kill Myrcella, he saw how in love was Trystane, he saw Doran speaking for peace, chastising Ellaria and the Sand Snakes and sending Myrcella  to KL... It is going to be VERY difficult to convince Jamie that Ellaria isn't to blame for Myrcella's death.

I guess it isn't completely impossible to convince people that Doran killed Myrcella and planned to put the blame on Ellaria, but if that were so, he would have prepared himself better and wouldn't have been murdered by Ellaria. The fact that he was murdered too points to Ellaria being the poisoner... It is going to be VERY hard to convince anybody otherwise.

Also, Ellaria and the Sandsnakes need to present themselves as Elia and Obery's avengers in order to be accepted as leaders by the Dornish. Otherwise, they have nothing to offer.

On 27/4/2016 at 9:34 PM, Eilif said:

The second is if they discover evidence of Doran’s schemes to overthrow the Lannisters. This would dispel the weak Doran that they thought, they can realize that they have made a huge mistake, and redeem show-Doran from beyond the grave. If they follow up with Doran’s plan, they can get their revenge in a more book-Dornish fashion… especially since this “war” that they want makes no sense at all.

I haven't seen anything that indicates that Doran was planning to do anything to overthrow the Lannister. I think he was presented as a pacifist who tried to avoid unnecesary suffering for his people, and his warmonger nieces and his brother's mistress are going to ruin it all. They are going to get Dorne involved in the war, and they are going to be crushed.

And I don't think Doran needs redeeming. He didn't try to avenge Elia because he didn't have the strength to win a war against the Lanninsters, the Baratheons, the Starks, the Arryns, the Tullys and the Tyrells. And once King Bob and Jon Arryn and Eddard Stark and Tywin Lannister were dead, who was he going to take revenge on for Elia's death? It was too late for revenge. As for Oberyn, he died during a judicial duel, and his opponent died too, so he doesn't need avenging.

I guess he could have tried an assassination or something similar, in order to avenge Elia, but there were risks for Dorne involved in that route, so he acted like a caring ruler and chose to protect his people from harm over revenge.

As for the Dornish plot itself... yeah, that's unsalvageable. They have become a caricature. Doran and Oberyn were the only likeable, believable characters, everybody else are bad cartoon characters.