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I think we're seeing the GNC taking flight, clearly Rickon and Osha were way too calm, everything was planned in my opinion. They knew Ramsay wants Sansa and he will not kill his only chance of getting her back (Rickon). Also having Karstark around him ensures that he won't kill Rickon in the heat of the moment or by making something stupid. In my opinion, that wasn't Shaggydog. 

Regarding TOJ, the only complaint i have is that BR didn't mention Dawn and it's history, but i liked that they at least pointed to it, the sword that Dayne was caring for when we first saw him is clearly Dawn, and the other one is an usual sword.

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I also think that wasn't Shaggydog and that Rickon and Osha are there because of a plan, not because yet another northern house turns out to be traitorous morons.

I think Dawn wasn't mentioned because they want to forego confusion about too many important swords. There's already Ice (now Oathkeeper and Widow's Wail), Needle, Longclaw, and Lightbringer. No need to bring even more swords into it in the show.

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I really liked the ToJ fight scene, but my biggest objection about it is that there were 6 vs 2, instead of 7 vs 3. And I never imagined Howland Reed fighting in close combat. Yes, I saw he was wounded first, but if he could be so brave fighting these men, how could he let those assholes squires bully him at the tourney at Harrenhall? I always imagined he saved Ned by using a usual crannogmen trick - shooting Dayne with the poisoned dart from a blowpipe. I was a little bit disappointed for leaving the part with Lyanna for another episode. Just let it be soon....

Another nebula which I have noticed: it seems that the three-eyed raven is about 1000 years old. Is he the Bloodraven on the show, or someone else? Bloodraven is about 120 years old in the books.

We can only imagine what kind of terrors will Ramsay inflict upon Rickon and Osha. I really can't see the Umbers turning their cloak against Boltons right now.

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^^  Don't think the 3 Eyed Raven in the show is Brynden "Bloodraven" Rivers like he is in the books.  Can't recall him ever being called/calling himself that, or even Bloodraven ever being mentioned by anyone.

 

On the same note, has anyone on the show ever called that Umber at Winterfell Smalljon, or even just Jon?  Kind of doubt the show is getting that specific.  Hell, the Greatjon isn't even dead on the show.  He sure as shit wasn't at the Red Wedding.

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23 minutes ago, Philpenn said:

^^  Don't think the 3 Eyed Raven in the show is Brynden "Bloodraven" Rivers like he is in the books.  Can't recall him ever being called/calling himself that, or even Bloodraven ever being mentioned by anyone.

 

On the same note, has anyone on the show ever called that Umber at Winterfell Smalljon, or even just Jon?  Kind of doubt the show is getting that specific.  Hell, the Greatjon isn't even dead on the show.  He sure as shit wasn't at the Red Wedding.

I have a feeling it was said somewhere that he's Brynden Rivers but I can't quite remember where at the moment, sorry!

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1 hour ago, Philpenn said:

^^  Don't think the 3 Eyed Raven in the show is Brynden "Bloodraven" Rivers like he is in the books.  Can't recall him ever being called/calling himself that, or even Bloodraven ever being mentioned by anyone.

 

 

I don't think it's ever confirmed he's bloodraven. That was more of a Fan Theory i think.

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Agreed.  Same as the Umber being Smalljon, or the "main" white walker being the Night's King.

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Was pretty put off by the changing of "Woe to the Usurper" for some reason.  Not that it really matters, but the words were already written, and didn't need to be changed.  Are show watchers really too stupid to understand the original words?

Edited by Philpenn
2x.

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Good episode and a lot of things moving around at once.

Positives - Arya and her training was more obvious this week. Last time it seemed more like a beating than training, this week it should have been more obvious to everyone that she is being trained. Would have been a badass moment if she had answered the Waif when asked about her list.

Winterfell - moving along and I believe the GNC taking shape. Umber wouldn't kneel or swear allegiance so that later on he isn't breaking his word. Loved him calling out the Boltons and Karstarks to their faces. Seems like he brought Osha and Rickon there as part of the trick, hated seeing Shaggy dog dead, hopefully it's some type of trick, of he died another way and they just used it to their advantage.

Kingslanding - wasn't bad, nice to see that Cersei and her posse can't just get their way. Nice little nod to when Tyrion pulled his chair to the end of the table when Jaime did it for Cersei. Olenna reminding Cersei she is not in power and not the queen was a little sweet for me.

Sam - nice little update to let us see that they aren't just wasting their time on the boat, Sam is smart enough that he knows Gilly needs to learn to read and understand more so she can fit in at Horn Hill.

The Wall - would have been a more powerful scene had Jon walked out to the balcony for the reveal to everyone instead of what seemed to be an announced arrival, but that's nit picking. Mel referencing the Prince that was promised. He killed the boy (Olly) and now the man is born? Nice touch at the end, wear it, or burn it, I don't care, my watch has ended. 

Tower of Joy - really liked this. It was as good as could be expected, people were going to tear it apart unless it was exactly like the books, and even then people would have criticized them for just copying GRRM. Thought the fight looked good and they portrayed Dayne as the badass he was in the books.

Negatives - Mereen, or the other Dorne as I think of it. This story line just shows how deep of a hole GRRM dug himself.

Dany - Not a big surprise other than the whole, your best outcome is living here with us. Any chance Jorah dies saving her and giving her freedom? Maybe in duel with Khal Pono? Or does Drogon show up and save her again, and rally the Dothraki people to her side for the war to come?

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3 hours ago, RadSam said:

I have a feeling it was said somewhere that he's Brynden Rivers but I can't quite remember where at the moment, sorry!

I seem to recall him saying he had been known as different names one of them being Brynden Rivers.  But my main problem is that they made him 1000 years old...  Really....

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12 minutes ago, Nymeria Pao said:

I seem to recall him saying he had been known as different names one of them being Brynden Rivers.  But my main problem is that they made him 1000 years old...  Really....

Yeah, timelines don't seem to matter so much anymore

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Umber mentions that Jon with an Army of Wildlings might be a threat at Winterfell. 

Umber then gives Ramsey something that would make Jon want to come to Winterfell with an Army off Wildlings xD

I'm calling conspiracy. 

What I liked: 
---Arya scenes finally getting some progress
---Jon is back, and he's moving on with his life. 
--- TOJ
 

What I didn't Like: 
---Merreen.... I would have liked to see the dragons eating or something =/
And the scene between Tyrion, Missandei and Grey Worm was torture. Its like the show writer doesn't know how to get the characters to interact- so they didn't even try and tried to make an inside joke about it. 
---Tommen and Sparrow (Scene just draaaaagggged)
---Sam to Gilly: You're all I care about- Yes I thought it was cute that Gilly called Sam her child's father.... and in the books he does have sex with her- which considering the title being Oathbreaker I thought might happen- But he was still pretty conflicted about it- not nonchalantly talking about prioritizing her over his oaths between barfs in a bucket. 
--- No Arya cat Warging
---- SHAGGY DOG!!! NOOOOOO Dx 
---- They could have shown at least one Sansa scene! Even it if was just her seeing the wall from a distance before the episode ended. 
Maybe something where's she's talking about Jon when they were younger to build up to their relationship.... I mean... I don't think the two have ever even spoken in the show xD (Or in the book for that matter)
---- That Jon went through with the execution... if he was stepping down/possibly leaving it doesn't even really matter >.>
It feels like he wants to change his life- and I think choosing to not go through with his "duty of justice" would be a good place to start. 

What I'm looking forward to: 
Bran better be back at the TOJ next episode! Don't keep me waiting. 
Rickon being totally safe and not tormented or flayed in any way D=
Jon and Sansa hug! 


 

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10 hours ago, Anthony Pirtle said:

Varys knows all about sacrificing his body for a cause, if ya know what I mean.

Well we now know he is a thousand years old. Which pretty much kills all the fan theories. I don't think it is necessary to tie him back into any other figure. Who do we even know from back then? Want to make him the original AA? Sure if you like. Does that tell us anything? Not really.

Thousand year old man in a tree is enough.

Interesting though that we are told Bran will leave the cave in the same episode Rickon reappears. It means that Rickon is no longer in the line of succession to being Warden of the North. Bran will be master of winterfell when he leaves the cave. Robb may have made Jon heir ahead of Bran but that is really a non-issue as Jon is clearly going to end up on the Iron Throne or dead.

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10 hours ago, Anthony Pirtle said:

Varys knows all about sacrificing his body for a cause, if ya know what I mean.

Well we now know he is a thousand years old. Which pretty much kills all the fan theories. I don't think it is necessary to tie him back into any other figure. Who do we even know from back then? Want to make him the original AA? Sure if you like. Does that tell us anything? Not really.

Thousand year old man in a tree is enough.

Interesting though that we are told Bran will leave the cave in the same episode Rickon reappears. It means that Rickon is no longer in the line of succession to being Warden of the North. Bran will be master of winterfell when he leaves the cave. Robb may have made Jon heir ahead of Bran but that is really a non-issue as Jon is clearly going to end up on the Iron Throne or dead.

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6 hours ago, Philpenn said:

^^  Don't think the 3 Eyed Raven in the show is Brynden "Bloodraven" Rivers like he is in the books.  Can't recall him ever being called/calling himself that, or even Bloodraven ever being mentioned by anyone.

 

On the same note, has anyone on the show ever called that Umber at Winterfell Smalljon, or even just Jon?  Kind of doubt the show is getting that specific.  Hell, the Greatjon isn't even dead on the show.  He sure as shit wasn't at the Red Wedding.

The three eyed Raven can't be Bloodraven since he said that he had been a thousand years in that cave

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Did anyone else get the feeling that Sam and Gilly's discussion on the Citadel's boy's only policy was a possibly set-up for a late Sarella Sand insertion -OR- even more outlandishly pasting a disguised and newly gung-ho-for-education Gilly (not sure what they would do with the baby)?

Edited by hiemal

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The most anticipated scene of the season in my opinion The Tower of Joy, in the end was not catastrophy, allthough I just cannot understand why it was not 7 against 3...  The discussion was kinda weird, I mean Arthur Dayne told Ned 

 

I wish you luck in the wars you fight, and then ''Now it begins'' I mean what the hell, it might've been sarcastic, but Arthur from the books would never start a fight knowing he lost, was too proud and too great.... kinda off the discussion in there, also no idea why chage Woe to the usurper, too hard english for writers I guess?....

 

Now lets just hope Gerold is in the Tower :P

 

The biggest negative about TOJ I have is, you portray a legendary swordfighter and the guy gets sneaked upon his back and stabbed.... bad awarness?

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When will Jaime attack High Sparrow? And why does Tommen listen to High Sparrow? Feels like it is going to slow in Kings Landing

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5 hours ago, Bluesnow said:

---Sam to Gilly: You're all I care about- Yes I thought it was cute that Gilly called Sam her child's father.... and in the books he does have sex with her- which considering the title being Oathbreaker I thought might happen- But he was still pretty conflicted about it- not nonchalantly talking about prioritizing her over his oaths between barfs in a bucket. 

 

Sam had sex with Gilly last season after he (and ghost) saved her from the NW brothers that were trying to rape her. 

 

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