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rocksniffer

Queen Unburnt Rises Again...Yes there shall be SPOILERS

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5 hours ago, Vastet said:

I agree with Ice Spider. It couldn't have been Daario and Jorah. They were too far away, and couldn't possibly have snuck up on the building anyway.

Well, we cut from the khals trying to get out, to the barred door with the dead guard, to Jorah and Daario looking on. So...I think the director was trying to tell us something.

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Well I suppose we'll have to wait for the next episode for the answer. If it gives us one. Otherwise we'll each have our own opinions.

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13 hours ago, Joan Jett said:

Ok, but personally I still consider it to be incest since they're related by blood. 

tell that to Franklin Roosevelt and Eleanor...related by blood and still married and president and first lady of US...incest laws also include step parents and step kids no blood just too close to marry...although there have been those who have challeged that law as well.

2 hours ago, direwoofwoof said:

Loved this scene and find it interesting that both fires scenes were with the Dothraki. In the books didn't her hair burn off? In season one and this episode is expected her to be bald after the fire. 

yes it did

 

9 hours ago, TickTak7 said:

I don't really understand why people are hyper-analyzing this scene. 

She sets the Temple of the Dosh Khaleen on fire. 

She traps the Khals inside. 

She kills them. 

She walks out, unburnt, winning the favor of the Dothraki Khalasers. 

It's really not that hard. 

Fire spreading and door breaking etc. 

If you can't suspend your sense of belief about firing spreading in a show that has dragons, ice zombies, vagina monsters, and several hundred year old women, then I think it's time you held up your hand and admitted to yourself that you are probably over-thinking things WAY too much. 

this...so much this...

:smoking:

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Loved how she didn't use Drogon at all here. And I think since the show has established her immunity to fire, it made sense. Most of all, it was nice to see her actually move forward on the path to Westeros for the first time in about 16 years. I'd love to read it but I got no problem seeing it on TV first. 

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7 hours ago, Ice Spider said:

Then why were they so far away when it first showed the place burning? I don't think so, the ex-kaleeshee were inside at first and the last to leave the building. do the math.

They will also be the ones to help Dany lead the Dothraki

If it was Dario and Jorah killed the guards, would they have stayed around waiting to be discovered?

The fact that they were far away when the place went up means nothing. Yes it went up fast but the temple wasn't actually so far from the rest of the village.

Or it could have been the other Kaliseeshees. Either works. 

19 minutes ago, Jack Bauer 24 said:

This was the definition of a woman showing agency and being a strong powerful woman. Loved it.

Yes, in a society in which it was denied. Which is one of GRRM's overarching themes. The Khals spend their lives doing nothing but rape and pillage and bossing people about. They don't provide anything of value. To effect the change in Essos society that Danny is trying to make, she has to decapitate the power elite and she knows it.

Vyserys also said he would make Dany sleep with the Dothraki horses and he ended up the same way.

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On 5/16/2016 at 6:02 PM, Ser Lepus said:

Yes, that's the hardest part to understand... Those were the Khals gathering in their great hall... there should be hundreds of bodyguards, attendants, servants and nosey people watching those doors... how come nobody noticed the main doors being blocked?

Because Vaes Dothrak is their sacred city...they are forbidden from shedding blood in the city therefore the khals really didn't need guards since they figured they were safe from attack. But they didn't count on a fire resistant khaleesi burning them alive and the way all the people ran up to the temple as it started to burn told me that they were in other parts of the city; with the aid of the Dosh Kaleen(the younger one Dany befriended), Jorah and Daario could have sneaked up there and killed the guards. And the Dosh Kaleen could have barred the doors after they brought Dany into the temple.

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1 hour ago, Jack Bauer 24 said:

This was the definition of a woman showing agency and being a strong powerful woman. Loved it.

Its also the very definition of a Mary Sue.

Im fairly disappointed that no matter the odds, in a series that is based around choice and massive consequence, Dany can literally walk out of almost any situation unscathed.

We can have strong empowering roles without the nonsense.

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4 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

Its also the very definition of a Mary Sue.

Im fairly disappointed that no matter the odds, in a series that is based around choice and massive consequence, Dany can literally walk out of almost any situation unscathed.

We can have strong empowering roles without the nonsense.

Lol with the Mary Sue. It's the new buzzword of the forum. And no, she can't walk out of almost any situation unscathed. That's nonsense. Fire is one element. Many other things can kill her. Is there a reason why you're not understanding this? 

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4 hours ago, direwoofwoof said:

Loved this scene and find it interesting that both fires scenes were with the Dothraki. In the books didn't her hair burn off? In season one and this episode is expected her to be bald after the fire. 

I believe they said they didn't want to have Emilia be bald for a while on the show(it probably would also be a pain to show her regrowing it, with all of the different wigs she'd have to have). It kind of makes sense.

 

6 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

Its also the very definition of a Mary Sue.

Im fairly disappointed that no matter the odds, in a series that is based around choice and massive consequence, Dany can literally walk out of almost any situation unscathed.

We can have strong empowering roles without the nonsense.

"A Mary Sue is an idealized and seemingly perfect fictional character, a young or low-rank person who saves the day through unrealistic abilities. Often this character is recognized as an author insert or wish-fulfillment."

 

Does that sound like Daenerys? No. She was not low-rank at this point(technically speaking), she didn't save the day with unrealistic abilites(she's survived heat and fire before). She's not a self-insert or wish-fulfillment character.

 

She can't get out of every situation unscathed, not at all. She can survive fire. Fire is not the only, nor primary, way to kill or harm someone in the world.

 

Just because you don't like her doesn't mean you get to throw terms around willy-nilly as if you know what they mean

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So your arguments are "She can drown in water, so shes not a Mary Sue!".

Look, I know your Khalessi fans are a bit special, but this is far fetched.

"Perfect fictional character". Well yes, that does sound like our friend "Khalessi". Lets put this in perspective. The traits Dany exhibit in the show if shown by anyone else are treated in a different way. Lets use Fire as an example. Stannis can burn people for the greater good. Evil. Dany can burn people for the greater good. "Strong powerful woman".

This show is built upon the dire consequences of ones actions. The Red Wedding, is a perfect example of this. For Dany, her poor choices are rewarded via Dragons, Armies, Advisors. I mean, at this point everything has fallen into her lap because shes a moron. At every chance, when she is met with adversity, she comes out of it looking like a million bucks and people applaud it.

 

"low-rank person who saves the day through unrealistic abilities"

Lets use this latest episode as the example shall we? Prisoner/Captive of the Khals, shes being treated like dirt, treatened with death/rape. Sounds low rank to me. If only my two henchmen, with one dagger. Could slip past 100,000 Dothraki, sneak up to the main temple. Dispatch the one guard. Board it up. Then sneak back to the bushes. That would be really damn convenient. Then because we dont have any CGI budget left for Drogon, man I wish this one time magical ability that was given to me via the blood magic of my dying child and the magic of Dragons hatching would return to me in this moment of need. Oh dear how ever will I survive this!

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If she were a mary sue, the masters wouldn't have retaken most of Slavers Bay. She would have been the one raping Drogo. Her dragons would obey her every thought. Jorah wouldn't have needed to save her from poison. She wouldn't have lost her baby, and she wouldn't be barren now. She would already be undisputed Queen of the world.

She is not a mary sue.

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15 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

So your arguments are "She can drown in water, so shes not a Mary Sue!".

Look, I know your Khalessi fans are a bit special, but this is far fetched.

"Perfect fictional character". Well yes, that does sound like our friend "Khalessi". Lets put this in perspective. The traits Dany exhibit in the show if shown by anyone else are treated in a different way. Lets use Fire as an example. Stannis can burn people for the greater good. Evil. Dany can burn people for the greater good. "Strong powerful woman".

This show is built upon the dire consequences of ones actions. The Red Wedding, is a perfect example of this. For Dany, her poor choices are rewarded via Dragons, Armies, Advisors. I mean, at this point everything has fallen into her lap because shes a moron. At every chance, when she is met with adversity, she comes out of it looking like a million bucks and people applaud it.

 

"low-rank person who saves the day through unrealistic abilities"

Lets use this latest episode as the example shall we? Prisoner/Captive of the Khals, shes being treated like dirt, treatened with death/rape. Sounds low rank to me. If only my two henchmen, with one dagger. Could slip past 100,000 Dothraki, sneak up to the main temple. Dispatch the one guard. Board it up. Then sneak back to the bushes. That would be really damn convenient. Then because we dont have any CGI budget left for Drogon, man I wish this one time magical ability that was given to me via the blood magic of my dying child and the magic of Dragons hatching would return to me in this moment of need. Oh dear how ever will I survive this!

She can die by sword, which would be you know...likely in a war. So she's far from safe. Is there a particular reason you're having trouble understanding something so basic?

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7 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

So your arguments are "She can drown in water, so shes not a Mary Sue!".

My argument is that she is not a Mary Sue simply because she is impervious to fire.

7 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

Look, I know your Khalessi fans are a bit special, but this is far fetched.

So you resort to insulting other people to make yourself seem more right? Not off to a good start here.

7 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

"Perfect fictional character". Well yes, that does sound like our friend "Khalessi". Lets put this in perspective. The traits Dany exhibit in the show if shown by anyone else are treated in a different way. Lets use Fire as an example. Stannis can burn people for the greater good. Evil. Dany can burn people for the greater good. "Strong powerful woman".

This show is built upon the dire consequences of ones actions. The Red Wedding, is a perfect example of this. For Dany, her poor choices are rewarded via Dragons, Armies, Advisors. I mean, at this point everything has fallen into her lap because shes a moron. At every chance, when she is met with adversity, she comes out of it looking like a million bucks and people applaud it.

Which is why Slaver's Bay is completely slave free, the Sons of the Harpy are nonexistent, her dragons follow her every command, and she is successfully ruling Meereen and preparing to invade Westeros, right? Oh wait.....

 

Just because she has met situations and come out on top does not mean she is not facing consequences. She conquered Slaver's Bay, but she did nothing to cement her rule before she moved on, and now her work is undone. Slavery has returned, Meereen is on the brink of civil war, and she still can't control her dragons fully. Not every poor choice has to end with death. But she is facing consequences, her choices are having repercussions.

7 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

 

"low-rank person who saves the day through unrealistic abilities"

Lets use this latest episode as the example shall we? Prisoner/Captive of the Khals, shes being treated like dirt, treatened with death/rape. Sounds low rank to me. If only my two henchmen, with one dagger. Could slip past 100,000 Dothraki, sneak up to the main temple. Dispatch the one guard. Board it up. Then sneak back to the bushes. That would be really damn convenient. Then because we dont have any CGI budget left for Drogon, man I wish this one time magical ability that was given to me via the blood magic of my dying child and the magic of Dragons hatching would return to me in this moment of need. Oh dear how ever will I survive this!

She was in consideration for joining the Dosh Khaleen and was only threatened after she told the khals they were not fit to rule. While among the Dothraki she did not have a high rank in terms of title, she did outrank them with other qualities which she used to her advantage. 

How? It's not like Daario and Jorah haven't done something similar before a few seasons back. 

 

You do realize the CGI budget does not rely on how many scenes Drogon appears in, right? It costs money to make the model, but once they have it, then can reuse it.

 

It was never stated in the show to be a one-time thing, and in fact has been shown to be the opposite. Dany climbed into the extremely hot bath, touched the dragon eggs, survived the pyre, and had her baby dragons breathe fire right next to her all without any sort of danger. The books also seem to indicate she is fire-immune, as she has never been burnt by it.

Even GRRM said that it only "probably" couldn't happen again, not that it wouldn't back in 1998.

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1 minute ago, Jack Bauer 24 said:

Wait...you think they are out of CGI budget money already in episode 4? Drogon was in the trailers. He will be in this season.

He does, apparently. He also completely misunderstands how money actually ties in to CGI. 

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There is this thing called a budget. Which is taken into account for the entire season, they havent used it all up by episode 4 you drongo. Clearly, theyve needed to preserve the budget for later episodes when he does make his return and the Bastardbowl.

Anyway, ill be over in the criticize thread where people can actually have negative views of something.

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Just now, Misnthropia said:

There is this thing called a budget. Which is taken into account for the entire season, they havent used it all up by episode 4 you drongo. Clearly, theyve needed to preserve the budget for later episodes when he does make his return and the Bastardbowl.

Anyway, ill be over in the criticize thread where people can actually have negative views of something.

Good because that's what those threads are for. Did you just realize that?

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16 minutes ago, Misnthropia said:

There is this thing called a budget. Which is taken into account for the entire season, they havent used it all up by episode 4 you drongo. Clearly, theyve needed to preserve the budget for later episodes when he does make his return and the Bastardbowl.

Yes, of which they had $100 million this season. CGI involving a computer-generated creature or thing is based on how much it costs to make the digital model, not how long it appears on screen. After they create the dragon models each season, it doesn't cost them anything to use them each episode. They don't use them every episode to avoid them potentially looking off.

Quote

Anyway, ill be over in the criticize thread where people can actually have negative views of something.

Good, that's what that thread is for. I'm not saying you can't have negative views at all, I'm simply giving explanations for what you've said. If you can't handle that, so be it.

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If the Dragons can be summoned through a psychic/warg connection in the fighting pits leading to her capture. Why didn't she summon a dragon here?

The reason I ask this is because the first time she was the ghost rider, it involved a ritual involving blood magic. When she birthed her dragons she killed a witch, and her Khal offering most of her possessions to the flames. after another Blood magic ritual where a horse was sacrificed and her unborn child died.

Here she is flammable because she is was born flammable and so she is flammable? Has she gained new inferno powers, was she born with fireproof powers, is she human?

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