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18 minutes ago, Morgana Lannister said:

My hunch is actually not for the Sand Snakes, despite having been seen last in KL not being the ones to kill Tommen.  I get the incline that somehow Cersei, albeit very indirectly, will be the one to cause for it to happen (with all 3 children).  Okay, this is a stretch but it could be argued that Joffrey was killed for how awful he was which was indirectly a consequence of how much she had indulged him.  No idea what will get Myrcella but with Tommen I really think that his (I am sure at least at the moment) sincere devotion is going to be what kills him (my money on one of the Tyrells) which could be arguably a consequence of Cersei having gotten herself into trouble with the Faith in the first place (including giving them an army for her own ulterior motives), either that or he will realise he has been played by the High Sparrow and will be the Faith who gets him.... Maybe complete tin foil but for now sticking with this prediction.

 

id really love it if Cersei was somehow directly responsible for Tommen getting owned, or the Faith does it. But the fact that the show left the Sand Sneks all hangin' like that really points to them showing up outta nowhere and putting poison in his juice. And then Cersei goes apeshit and tries to nuke KL. Who knows. lmao

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30 minutes ago, Florina Laufeyson said:

id really love it if Cersei was somehow directly responsible for Tommen getting owned, or the Faith does it. But the fact that the show left the Sand Sneks all hangin' like that really points to them showing up outta nowhere and putting poison in his juice. And then Cersei goes apeshit and tries to nuke KL. Who knows. lmao

I do wonder if they are not back in Dorne off screen as it were.  I just thought them being there just serve the purpose of killing Trystane but it is true to say that what you say makes sense too so I guess it's wait and see...  However, the events in Dorne pan out differently in the books (at least for now it seems that way) and although books and show are by no means the same  I think the main end game conflicts and major deaths are going to be pretty close but then again almost anything is possible in GoT lol

Edited by Morgana Lannister

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Like a lot of people have said here, I'm also bored with the Faceless Ones, mainly because they don't make any sense.

They are all supposed to be nobody yet the Waif has clearly enjoyed beating, tormenting and humiliating Arya as evidenced by the smug little smirk on her face every time she gets to give Arya more hassle. She has emotions, desires, an ego and a sadistic streak. That's a personality, which gives her an identity. So she is not nobody, she is somebody.

Maybe that's the point, that you can never entirely be nobody, that some kind of personality will always remain, but it's still rubbish. Even assassins that are not part of some secret group can be dispassionate. The Waif enjoys it too much, she's like a female Ramsey.

Logically Arya should be able to point this out and discredit her but that wouldn't be dramatic enough and anyway she seems to be the main guy's favourite. Also an emotion, favouritism.

The sooner Arya carves her up and moves on the better. I really hope killing the Waif isn't another stupid test.

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2 hours ago, Morgana Lannister said:

this could make sense given how they are keen on giving main character plots that other characters had in the books, however I am all for both Brienne and Jaime surviving the Riverlands and Sansa is not as blood thirsty as LSH I don't think and unless she learns that it was him who threw Bran out of the window, okay he is a Lannister but I don't think is personal at this stage if this makes sense.  Also not sure but get the impression that Tyrion probably told her he was one of the members of his family who didn't treat him abysmally and I don't get the impression, certainly not in the books that she has animosity against Tyrion even now so unless it is purely for tactical reasons not sure how Jaime would be such a priority for Sansa, just like even with the changes she has gone through, I can't see her just killing any random Freys in cold blood.  I think Sansa would be a fairly decaffeinated version of LSH but I could be wrong...

Sorry this post has turned out totally convoluted lol but basically saying that I don't think she hates Jamie specifically, although hey yes she does hate the Lannister house as an entity but not on a more personal level individually when it comes to him.  I personally think it is more likely that Brienne and Jaime will have a one to one combat scene that plays out simply because they are both doing their duty on opposite sides of the war...

I'm thinking back to Catlyn's words to Rob in season 1: "We will kill them all."

Given everything Sansa has been through, and given that the Lannisters are responsible for the death of her father, mother & elder brother, and the destruction of her house, etc., I doubt she will make a distinction between "good Lannisters" and "bad Lannisters".  Tyrion might be the exception, as he was actually kind to her, but that's moot because I don't think they will ever cross paths again.  She let Littlefinger live, but that was a near thing. I think if he had said the wrong thing, he'd have been done.

Jaime has no relationship with her at all.  The show never puts them together and he never so much as says hello to her.  All she knows is that he is the Cersei's brother and (probably) Joffrey's father.  

2 hours ago, hallam said:

I doubt it. We didn't get as much time together as in the books.

What?

Edited by Deadlines? What Deadlines?

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5 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

I'm thinking back to Catlyn's words to Rob in season 1: "We will kill them all."

Given everything Sansa has been through, and given that the Lannisters are responsible for the death of her father, mother & elder brother, and the destruction of her house, etc., I doubt she will make a distinction between "good Lannisters" and "bad Lannisters".  Tyrion might be the exception, as he was actually kind to her, but that's moot because I don't think they will ever cross paths again.  She let Littlefinger live, but that was a near thing.I think if he had said the wrong thing, he'd have been done.

 

Jaime has no relationship with her at all.  The show never puts them together and he never so much as says hello to her.  All she knows is that he is the Cersei's brother and (probably) Joffrey's father.  

What?

Still I think if she was going to set off in a LSH path there would be other people more prominently up there on her list, such as Walder Frey and yes, possibly LF despite her sparing him earlier in the series.  I am certain however that there will be a show down between Jaime and Brienne but I reckon that will be purely tactical in military terms as they will find themselves on opposite sides of the war.  I just not convinced that Sansa will fully take the role of LSH.  In fact, the BWB even without UnCat are better candidates for this IMHO, but then again of course this is just my opinion.  Tywin Lannister, had he been still alive and assuming she knew the part he played in it all, on the other hand could have been a more direct target.  I personally think her efforts are directed at regaining WF and her main target surely would be Ramsay Bolton but I don't think she is going to go on a revenge killing spree with multiple targets based on family links alone.

Edited by Morgana Lannister

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4 minutes ago, Morgana Lannister said:

Still I think if she was going to set off in a LSH path there would be other people more prominently up there on her list, such as Walder Frey and yes, possibly LF despite her sparing him earlier in the series.  I am certain however that there will be a show down between Jaime and Brienne but I reckon that will be purely tactical in military terms as they will find themselves on opposite sides of the war.  I just not convinced that Sansa will fully take the role of LSH.  In fact, the BWB even without UnCat are better candidates for this IMHO, but then again of course this is just my opinion.

She has a list, no question.  Her list probably has a meaningful order, but there's no way she passes up a target of opportunity.  

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3 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

She has a list, no question.  Her list probably has a meaningful order, but there's no way she passes up a target of opportunity.  

All I can say is we shall see... I really, really despite what she is been through I don't see her as LSH.  If she were to indiscriminately kill anyone she comes across from an enemy family well I think that would make her highly irrational which IMHO is contrary to what I think both show and books are trying to show us with her development, i.e. that she is becoming smarter and more of a player.  Behaving like that would just make her purely and simply an executioner.

Edited by Morgana Lannister

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So much book 3, 4 and 5 material happening this season now with Jamie going to Riverrun and Coldhands appearing, I feel we are not really very far into book 6 material. That gives me hope for 3 more things from the books that have yet to happen: Kevan Lannister's assasination, Lady Stoneheart and the biggest of all: Aegon/Young Griff.

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I have to assume that at this point in the series, we're only being shown things that have an impact on the way the story will end. Dorne is out of the picture (for now at least, thank goodness), and as sad as the demise of the direwolves is, would they have made a difference when the real war begins? I guess there's a small possibility that Nymeria's pack will show up somewhere, somehow, but I doubt it. I think Ghost will be pivotal, hopefully in the sense that he rips Ramsay's testicles from his body and pisses on his head before leaving him to die slowly.

Based on that, TOJ, The Mad King, and the murder and violence committed against the Starks (Bran, Ned, Red Wedding) will have an impact on the story going forward. Which leads me to believe that LSH will happen. I know, it's wishful thinking, but consider how many times we've been reminded of Cat and how she died. Then think about how many times someone at the wall mentioned Benjen. To me that was a dead giveaway that he would be back. I also think it's a little bit of fan porn for readers and a huge holy hell moment for the Unsullied. It would be great way to end the season.

Also:

Of course Margery is faking. All of this leads somehow to Tommen's death and a vacancy on the Iron Throne. My guess is a stupid move by Cersei during Jamie's absence that backfires. Speaking of which, the whole "what Lannisters do to (their) enemies" speech...what do they do? Jamie was captured, Tywin killed on the can, Cersei imprisoned, Joff and Myrcella murdered, Lancel's a kingslayer/cousin f#*ker turned holy roller, Tyrion convicted of regicide then 

Spoiler

sold into slavery (although we have been graciously spared that nonsense).

The Lannisters kinda suck, they just cover it well.

Arya: I've always thought that Jaqen is Syrio, or somehow had knowledge of Arya through Syrio, and he chose to protect her and teach her. Even if not, I don't think he ever believed she would be a FM. She's too emotional. Who else is emotional? The waif. She's not supposed to be jonesing so bad to kill people. I think Jaqen just sentenced her to death. He knows that Arya belongs in Westeros and the Waif shouldn't be a FM. He gets the end result with no dirty hands.

1000 ships. Heavy sigh with eye roll. I don't know how much time is passing, and I know I should suspend disbelief, but there's no way the Ironborn can build 1000 ships overnight and get them to Mereen to carry the khalasar across the sea. (Unless Euron has Littlefinger's transporter.) But, Drogon and Gilly's baby are both huge, so who knows?

I'm really looking forward to seeing Jamie and the Blackfish interact. Part of me hopes that they'll agree on what a POS Walder Frey is and get rid of him for good (unless Sansa does it first).

 

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Jaime had short hair in the flashback, but he did stab him in the back.  But there is one part that I'm curious about, right after Doogie Howser Stark says "where's my sister" there is someone's hand and forearm on something with a lot of blood, anyone think that could be Lyanna in childbirth?

 

the clothing on the forearm is brown leather, with green cloth underneath.  Stark colors.  Something in the shot is very bloody.  5 minutes and 53 seconds in.

 

granted it could be Robb over fake Westerling at the Red Wedding, I'm not real sure what to make of it.

Edited by SerJeremiahLouistark

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12 minutes ago, Arya Gendry said:

I have to assume that at this point in the series, we're only being shown things that have an impact on the way the story will end. Dorne is out of the picture (for now at least, thank goodness), and as sad as the demise of the direwolves is, would they have made a difference when the real war begins? I guess there's a small possibility that Nymeria's pack will show up somewhere, somehow, but I doubt it. I think Ghost will be pivotal, hopefully in the sense that he rips Ramsay's testicles from his body and pisses on his head before leaving him to die slowly.

Based on that, TOJ, The Mad King, and the murder and violence committed against the Starks (Bran, Ned, Red Wedding) will have an impact on the story going forward. Which leads me to believe that LSH will happen. I know, it's wishful thinking, but consider how many times we've been reminded of Cat and how she died. Then think about how many times someone at the wall mentioned Benjen. To me that was a dead giveaway that he would be back. I also think it's a little bit of fan porn for readers and a huge holy hell moment for the Unsullied. It would be great way to end the season.

Also:

Of course Margery is faking. All of this leads somehow to Tommen's death and a vacancy on the Iron Throne. My guess is a stupid move by Cersei during Jamie's absence that backfires. Speaking of which, the whole "what Lannisters do to (their) enemies" speech...what do they do? Jamie was captured, Tywin killed on the can, Cersei imprisoned, Joff and Myrcella murdered, Lancel's a kingslayer/cousin f#*ker turned holy roller, Tyrion convicted of regicide then 

  Reveal hidden contents

sold into slavery (although we have been graciously spared that nonsense).

The Lannisters kinda suck, they just cover it well.

Arya: I've always thought that Jaqen is Syrio, or somehow had knowledge of Arya through Syrio, and he chose to protect her and teach her. Even if not, I don't think he ever believed she would be a FM. She's too emotional. Who else is emotional? The waif. She's not supposed to be jonesing so bad to kill people. I think Jaqen just sentenced her to death. He knows that Arya belongs in Westeros and the Waif shouldn't be a FM. He gets the end result with no dirty hands.

1000 ships. Heavy sigh with eye roll. I don't know how much time is passing, and I know I should suspend disbelief, but there's no way the Ironborn can build 1000 ships overnight and get them to Mereen to carry the khalasar across the sea. (Unless Euron has Littlefinger's transporter.) But, Drogon and Gilly's baby are both huge, so who knows?

I'm really looking forward to seeing Jamie and the Blackfish interact. Part of me hopes that they'll agree on what a POS Walder Frey is and get rid of him for good (unless Sansa does it first).

 

Lannisters murder their enemies in cold blood.  What irritates me is the whole Dorne storyline last season could have been scratched.  Waste of time.

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Jaime kissed Cersie. I was like "NO Jaime, NO!!" :( I do have some hope now that he's being sent away that he might run into Brienne and remember that he's on a redemption arc.

Edited by Jaime4Brienne

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I think LSH would be too big. If that happens, it could as well be the last scene of the season. And if that happens, than I'm sure they have an 8th season in mind. Still, sounds more like wishful thinking.

But then again, Coldhands was wishful thinking, and we had a "not-coldhands-but-close-enough" Benjen Stark in this episode. So hold on your hopes...

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1 minute ago, Dudu42 said:

I think LSH would be too big. If that happens, it could as well be the last scene of the season. And if that happens, than I'm sure they have an 8th season in mind. Still, sounds more like wishful thinking.

But then again, Coldhands was wishful thinking, and we had a "not-coldhands-but-close-enough" Benjen Stark in this episode. So hold on your hopes...

It's not that I'm particularly hopeful. If she doesn't drive the story, I don't want her. It's just that the foreshadowing on this show can be somewhat heavy handed, and the Cat shots, the RW reference, the mention of the BWoB, finally in the Riverlands...the timing is right. 

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5 hours ago, CrypticWeirwood said:

That’s an astute observation.  Not even the Red Woman herself claimed did it; she almost certainly did not.

Anybody notice the flash of Catelyn?

No ? I really need to re watch it... it just seemed to move so quickly, I missed Lyanna too until I saw a still on the net.

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11 minutes ago, Optimist said:

Is it ok to post this here?  Someone screenshot-ed Bran's vision - terrific stuff - https://imgur.com/gallery/5WMdv/new

Very nice!

I have the feeling this sets the stage for mind-time-traveling Bran/3EC to have influenced the mad King "Burn them all".

As a result of the madness we have now a lot of Wildfire in KL and i can see Cersei trying to bomb the Sparrows away with it.(The explosions in the vision)

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 So is what happened to Benjen the same thing that happened to Jon? I'm starting to think that Rhilor or the Red Woman had nothing to do with resurrecting Jon.

Benjen seems to be clearly dead (albeit walking around and all), whereas Jon is definitely still (or rather, once again) alive. I thought that the blood he was squeezing out was for himself, not for Bran, that maybe that's what he needs to survive--contrast that with Jon, who's eating the crap food of the Watch and drinking its awful beer. Benjen was prevented from turning into a wight, but he wasn't brought back to life. He's undead. Jon's alive.  Which isn't to say that R'hllor is responsible for Jon's resurrection, necessarily, but I think what happened to Benjen is something completely different. 

3 hours ago, hallam said:

How many Faceless Men are there?

Is show Arya safe after icing the Waif? Does she have to ice Jaq'un as well? How about after that? Is her name on a FM hit list forever?

I suspect that she will be safe once she kills the Waif. The Faceless God or whoever is owed one death; no reason that can't be the Waif instead of Arya. Jaqen doesn't seem like he's inclined to be angry at her, and also, honestly, on a pragmatic level it's just going to be easier for the show going forward if she's not also being pursued by assassins for the rest of her life. I suspect that if she's able to kill the Waif, she's good. And obviously she'll be able to kill the Waif. 

Also, I know folks are saying Sansa is gonna be the embodiment of vengeance, but to me it seems Arya is far better suited to the role of LSH stand-in. I mean, she's had a list for ages, she's already killed people, she's gained some assassin skills, and if she heads to the Riverlands and pairs back up with Nymeria... Just sayin' it could work nicely. 

3 hours ago, RadSam said:

Dany. Yawn. How is she going to rule Westeros and it's people if she kills them all and tears down their houses? And what I've always wondered, what will happen with the Dothraki? The people of Westeros are hardly going to take to a queen with a barbarian army. They rape and kill and steal. I can't see them in Westeros.

Exactly. When she was giving that speech about how they were going to tear everything down in Westeros, I thought, "Wow, great way to make yourself popular with 'your people,' Dany." Tearing down the houses and bringing in an army that tends to rape and pillage its way across the world, well, that's not exactly the way to set yourself up as a successful leader in the future. (Yeah, I'm sure she'll outlaw raping and all, but that speech was all about subjugating and destroying the Westerosi; when did she decide they were the enemy instead of her people?) Daario was 100% correct that she is a conqueror, not a ruler--but the problem is that her world desperately needs rulers, not conquerors. She's left her conquered cities in a dire mess, and now she's scooting off to do the same to Westeros? We're seeing that Meereen is kind of in crisis, and Astapor et al. already went back to slaving, but her response is basically "shit's getting difficult here....Ooo! look over there! Let's go there!!"  ("Squirrel!!")  And we're... supposed to like her? Her heart is in the right place in terms of freeing the slaves, but she ought to get her brain and her common sense involved in the process as well to make sure that they stay free and can survive. At this point I think I'd take King Tommen over Queen Conquer & Scamper.

I also think Dany ought to think about WHY she wants to take over Westeros. Yeah, sure, her ancestors came over a couple hundred years ago and smoked some castles and conquered the place. Great. So what? She wants to avenge Rhaegar and his family and all, but... that's not a reason to want the Iron Throne. She wants revenge, not Westeros. She's the kid who wants a toy because someone else took it, but doesn't actually want to play with it. If she can't handle the one city of Meereen, which only has two or three major factions to juggle, she's gonna be completely overwhelmed by seven kingdoms and massive numbers of factions. She may win a war, but unless she changes her personality, she will lose the peace every time. 

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4 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

I'm thinking back to Catlyn's words to Rob in season 1: "We will kill them all."

Did she really say that?

Must have burned it out of my brain. Catelyn Season 1  Lady Stoneheart.

3 hours ago, Arya Gendry said:

I have to assume that at this point in the series, we're only being shown things that have an impact on the way the story will end. Dorne is out of the picture (for now at least, thank goodness), and as sad as the demise of the direwolves is, would they have made a difference when the real war begins?

I agree, but Dorne and the Iron Islands have both made a comeback in a big way. Last season I honestly thought Euron was being written out of the show altogether, yet here he is. The Sand Snakes seems to be a replacement for Aegon's invasion, leading Dorne to rebel against the crown. So both these plotlines are more important for the main narrative than we had thought.

How exactly? Who knows?

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